Mermaids vs LGB Alliance and Charity Commissioner - First-tier Tribunal (General Regulatory Chameber) Thread 2

[nauticant]

The Tribunal started on 9 September, witness testimony started on 12 September.

There is also live tweeting from twitter.com/tribunaltweets.

To obtain access to view the proceedings, send a request email to [email protected] about case CA/2021/0013 - Mermaids vs Charity Commissioner and LGB Alliance and ask for permission to join. You then have to provide certain information and agree to a judge's direction in order to be able to join.

Abbreviations:

J or judge: Presiding Judge, Judge Lynn Griffin
AJ or Judge: Assisted by Judge Joe Neville
MG: Mermaids counsel is Michael Gibbon KC
KM: LGB Alliance counsel is Karon Monaghan KC
AR: Karon is assisted by Akua Reindorf
IS: Charity Commission counsel is Iain Steele

Thread 1: www.mumsnet.com/talk/womens_rights/4629679-mermaids-versus-lgb-alliance-in-court-today
Thread 2: ongoing

Witnesses for the applicant (Mermaids):

Paul Roberts - CEO of LGBT Consortium (12 September)
John Nicolson MP - Deputy Chair of the All-Party Parliamentary Group on Global LGBT+ Rights (13 September)
Dr Belinda Bell - Chair of trustees of Mermaids (?? September)

Witnesses for the respondent (LGB Alliance):

Beverley Jackson - Co-founder and trustee of LGB Alliance (?? September)
Kate Harris - Co-founder and trustee of LGB Alliance (?? September)
Eileen Gallagher OBE - Chair of trustees of LGB Alliance (?? September)

Witness Statements:

Paul Roberts: lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Paul-Roberts-Witness-Statement-Exhibits.pdf
John Nicolson MP - Not yet available
Dr Belinda Bell: Not yet available
Beverley Jackson: Not yet available
Kate Harris: Not yet available
Eileen Gallagher: Not yet available

Submissions:

lgballiance.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/2022/09/Volume-4-Submissions-CA.2021.0013.pdf

(Header format follows the gold standard established by @ickky)

It's so interesting that in pursuing Mermaids case MG is having to argue that using "gender identity" is in some way harmful to trans people.

But as BJ says, it's not about trans people, it's not about individuals.

Love Bev - we are calling a spade a spade mate.

Think about where MG's reasoning goes. It means LGBA should use language approved by Mermaids claiming to be speaking on behalf of trans people, and deviation from that approved language should lead to sanction against LGBA.

Thanks all for the updates, this sounds pretty compelling stuff.

BJ is wiping the floor with this line of questioning.

It's not for you to police language - the irony!

This tribunal is priceless. I do hope we get to a point whereby someone has to say that lesbians don’t have penises. (Penii fir the pedantic)

Its unbelievable really

Bit behind but reading the Twitter thread.
Also says 'advance interests of LGB in context of concerted attempt to elide sex and gender' That is central to GC position?
BJ: yes

Well that shouldn't be an issue, should it, as BB yesterday said sex and gender were separate things. So we're all agreed on that.... no?

Can't we at least get this nailed down once and for all? SW says they're the same, others say they're the same, Mermaids now say they're different.

Ok I'm going to sound like an absolute conspiracy theorist but I have a feeling this is Mermaids swan song. They knew when GIDS was being investigated on the back of Bell V Tavistock and more people were coming out about it it was only a matter of time. They ( and their T before all else buddies) brought this case so that they can blame the nasty GC crowd. They will lose and shut down and come back as something like Stonewall Jnr.

This lies at the heart of so much. For years now trans activism has controlled the language and its use, the recent court cases have started to push back against that and caused huge alarm in the trans activism community, and so now we have a KC in court seeking to seize back that language so it can be controlled by Mermaids and similar.

BJ is sounding incredibly sensible and is able to articulate all of this perfectly. She is answering questions very thoughtfully . Talking about confusion for isolated young people who are being told that their issues are to do with gender identity

BJ: Not suggesting everyone should agree with us

And that is the very opposite of those pushing gender identity.

Because this is an implosion of a star and we have ringside seats .

I'm in (I haven't used my real first name). Thank you to Tribunal Tweets and all the knowledgeable posters on this thread for your time and effort in covering this.

I was trying to say I agree with you @RocketPanda 😁

Bev refreshingly realistic about the reality of homophobia

MG: is tranactivism the grea Threat faced by homosexuals?

BJ: in Uganda, no

I gathered that @HoofWankingSpangleCunt .

Unfortunately there are children and young people left with a lifetime of damage both physically and mentally because of it all.

He's blocked me on Twitter despite me never interacting with him. I'm assuming he's blocking everyone who follows or likes For Women Scotland.

I've always been intrigued by MSP/MP's who pre-emptively block people who may well be constituents (I'm not though I do live in Scotland) for daring to follow an organisation. Elected to serve their constituents but only if they agree with them, it seems.

Short break until 11
kQ having iPad kssue

Talking about countries where you can be arrested for being same sex attracted does rather highlight genderism as a luxury belief

Is anyone here still waiting to get in?

I'm still astonished MG's argument (on behalf of Mermaids) that LGBA should not campaign using terminology of their own choosing, which they use in order to express themselves clearly, because in Mermaids' view this is somehow harmful to trans people, and instead LGBA ought to be using approved language from a highly contested ideology.

Yes, I agree.

Have I misrepresented myself? I’m not trivialising the medical abuse in case you think that.

Argh we’re now past 600 posts and from here on in MN will glitch and crash on my phone

excellent