gender woo and voting

[dropthevipers]

Is party stance on gender woo a deal breaker for you? I am/have been a center left type my whole life, would never previously have even considered voting tory-but I cannot vote for parties that spout manifest bollocks. How about you? Or you friends?

There is no and has never been a right to abortion under the ECHR.
i agree that the tories are no friend of women but abortion doesn’t need to be enshrined in a bill of rights and we should just keep the Human Rights Act and the rights under the ECHR (which by the way are totally unaffected by Brexit). Not a fan of the Bill of Rights.

I wasn't talking about ECHR. Over our years in the EU, we signed Treaties and laws. All these laws are now up for grabs as we bring in our own laws to replace the now defunct EU ones.

The Conservative Party have shown that they will not protect our rights. They are no friend to women.

Nobody needs to be “a friend to women”. They are politicians, not benevolent mates we can rely on in fair weather and foul.

They just need to persuade enough of us to vote for them.

Labour, LibDems & Greens at some point thought we were so far in the bag that we’d put up with them denying reality and insisting we did too . And if a minority got vocal enough about jumping ship we could be hounded or shamed back into our rightful place of giving them our vote on demand, no questions asked. Cos they are “our friend”. And know what’s best for us. Even when we are in a “silly girlie tizz” over minor details like “lady penis”, kids being transed behind parental backs and weirdos trying to become minors’ “rainbow foster family” online.

The Tories, as ever, want to win. They don’t think we are so malleable, fearful of social shunning & weak that we can be bullied into voting for them unless they they give us the hill we are prepared to die on.

It’s not odd that so many women find the latter a more palatable option.

“Palatable”
if the welfare of the vast majority of women in this country is unimportant to you, if you don’t care about women’s rights at work, rights to get legal aid, rights to demonstrate, to have clean air or water, to have affordable heating, to have health care, to have secure housing then yes you might find the Conservatives „palatable“

I do not care that you care not for my views, opinions, priorities, intentions and word choices.

If you want to to persuade me to your view, put your back into it and make an argument. Or live with the reality that I have as much need to keep up with the modern day Political Puritans as I do the Jones.

This is fundamental.

Political, union and corporate leaders know what a woman is.

If they are willing to deny women's single rights, ie my rights, to promote their own interests, I will not support them. Not now, not ever.

Perhaps you should get to work on persuading Labour that if they want to win they need to listen to women, rather than go about trying to shame women into voting how you think they should vote on the internet.

After all, Labour decided to go along with Brexit because they thought it would placate “red wall” voters, so they’re perfectly able to shift policy on something if they think it will get them votes. You should be lobbying Labour to do the same with women, rather than moaning about it.

@antifascist

Are you talking to the TRAs about their sudden enthusiasm for Grant Shapps, or do you only police gender critical women?

Mmmhmm. This.

I’m just wondering whether, if Starmer eventually backtracks on his commitment to self-ID, and Grant Shapps got in and said he’d pass it, @antifascist would still consider voting Labour?

A couple of years ago Grant Shapps would have been monstered by TRA Twitter for such a waffly, pusillanimous response. And yet now look. How times have changed and Isn't it great to see an open discussion at last.

You think you have the time to wait 2 years @theclangersarecoming? One of the most powerful people in the country atm is our first ever trans MP. A Tory MP whose vote (to every candidate running) matters more than us.

Wonder what "brave and stunning" thing he'll do next?🤔

Perhaps you'll focus on the clear and present danger to women now, rather than a possible threat in a future that none of us can predict.

I literally have no idea what you’re arguing there. 🤷‍♀️

Are you unaware that the Conservative party are in turmoil? And that's women's rights to single sex spaces could be bargained away for 1 vote in their leadership race?

That's the shit that's happening today. Not having our right to abortion protected is happening today. Vulnerable women being forced to share spaces with predatory men is happening now. And it has been brought to you by the Conservative government.

Labour, Lib dems, SNP, Greens, none of them have the power to do anything. Unless they get elected after the 2(?) difficult and destabilising years we have ahead.

We have a clear and present danger to women's rights today and it's the Conservative government.

Nobody needs to be a friend to women.

I disagree. Women make up more than half the electorate. More than rich people. More than LGBTQIA+ folk. More than men. All parties should be a friend to women and protect our rights.

And that's women's rights to single sex spaces could be bargained away for 1 vote in their leadership race?

We’re seeing more bargaining away in Labour than Cons. The direction in Cons is in other direction towards women’s rights over TRA tg

For some reason Starmer and Labour do answer to the lobby. I’m
not sure why they have a stronghold though

if thats true then you should be shitting it over the prospect of labour or the Greens getting in.

Some news for you though, none of us gets a vote in this leadership election unless we’re Tory members. So (a) there’s no point whinging at us; and (b) maybe we should all join the Tories, then? Is that what you’re suggesting?

I'm baffled by what point you are trying to make.

Regardless of the origins of self id in U.K. politics (which I believe was actually a cross party committee though it was endorsed by Theresa May) the only major party that is rowing back on this is the Conservative Party - furthermore it's seems most of the leadership candidates, one of whom will be PM support protecting womens rights.

Now of course we can be skeptics about them adhering to such promises but personally I think for some (nods to Kemi, Suellla and Savid) they are honestly held and backed by action.

For others, (nods to Rishi) I am more dubious about a personal investment but nevertheless if he feels it's a big enough topic to make a clear statement on for votes then I don't think he's going to row back in that.

In the meantime, Labour still can't admit only women have a cervix and many front benchers go much further than that in their belief that TWAW an desire to realise self id.

On this issue, the Conservative party (unless Penny or Grant win) are not the danger to women the Labour/LibDem/Green parties are.

Oh and Mordants sunk now.

Not because of her views, but because she's cravenly done a "fake" reverse ferret and been caught out lying plus that cringe PR video.

The last thing the Tory's want now is another "lying' PM. I think Nadhim's also out re: his tax probe.

Grant was never going to win either - he's just a smelly fart in the wind - a brief unpleasant whiff that quickly passes.

I am shitting it over what will happen this week/month/year under more Conservative party.

Women don't matter to the Tories. Some of them "know what a woman is", some of them don't and have pushed the TRA agenda to the extent that it became Conservative party policy and has damaged women's rights for years to come. None of them give a shit about women.

Knowing that, I am shitting myself about what is going to happen to women's rights in the days, weeks and months ahead. We have no say in that. Our only (Conservative) trans MP has loads of say.

I am gutted for all the GC and feminist voters in Bridgend. They held their nose and voted Conservative on the basis that "at least the Conservatives know what a woman is", only to find the Sugar Daddy promoting, cleaner of paedophile records from the internet, dodgy as fuck candidate they voted for is a TRA ticking timebomb.🤦‍♀️

Shapps is like the half-drunk, possibly curdled bottle of Mint Baileys you find at the back of the pantry when you’ve drunk all the good stuff.

He doesn’t have a chance but it was weird to hear him talk about the error of lockdowns after the whole nation lost their heads

Does anyone know anything about the claim that tory mp's have complained to the police about gender critical women, and a woman was questioned by the police? Its been said a couple of times in this thread (sorry I can't remember who by) and I would like to know the story behind it!

@Manderleyagain

I think that was Crispin Blunt. He doesn’t count.