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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Midwives told sex is "assigned"

193 replies

Ravenclawdropout · 29/06/2022 16:30

Now midwives are told sex is 'ASSIGNED' at birth mol.im/a/10964279 via dailym.ai/android

OP posts:
flyingbuttress43 · 30/06/2022 12:06

People who think the difference between assign and observe/recorded clearly are not aware of the significance of language creep and how, after time, it changes are perception of reality,

flyingbuttress43 · 30/06/2022 12:07

Sorry "our" not "are"

queenmabb · 30/06/2022 12:19

And they will relay that because they're told it. Just like they will relay anything they are told and why their advice is not really advice, it's just repetition of protocol that could be completely factually incorrect.

Johnnysgirl · 30/06/2022 12:24

Are they given any guidance as to how to make this "assignment"? I'm guessing it works exactly how it used to; by genital observation...
Fucking muppets.

Johnnysgirl · 30/06/2022 12:28

Or maybe they're given total discretion?
"Oh, you wanted a girl, Mrs O'Leary? No problem at all; ignore the penis, I'll just record that one as a girl for you. Isn't this new system great!!"

Luxa · 30/06/2022 12:36

Sex is determined at conception. One sperm fertilises the egg. The chromosome from the egg will be X. If the sperm carries a Y chromosome then the embryo will be XY and a boy will develop. If the sperm carried an X then the embryo is XX and a girl will develop.

The sex may then be observed at a scan or at birth. It cannot be assigned because it is already there.

Biological sex cannot be changed even with hormones or surgery. The chromosomes are the same for life.

'Gender' was for a long time used as a euphemism to refer to sex, but the present day understanding of 'gender' is that it's chosen according to how you feel. It is a belief about yourself. This is clearly very different from sex which is physical and unchanging. It is also why transwomen are not actually women.

Bumply · 30/06/2022 12:43

DS2's sex was confirmed from his DNA when I had amniocentesis at ~16 weeks.

The assigned at birth always annoys me.

BoredofthisCrap7 · 30/06/2022 12:49

Luxa · 30/06/2022 12:36

Sex is determined at conception. One sperm fertilises the egg. The chromosome from the egg will be X. If the sperm carries a Y chromosome then the embryo will be XY and a boy will develop. If the sperm carried an X then the embryo is XX and a girl will develop.

The sex may then be observed at a scan or at birth. It cannot be assigned because it is already there.

Biological sex cannot be changed even with hormones or surgery. The chromosomes are the same for life.

'Gender' was for a long time used as a euphemism to refer to sex, but the present day understanding of 'gender' is that it's chosen according to how you feel. It is a belief about yourself. This is clearly very different from sex which is physical and unchanging. It is also why transwomen are not actually women.

All absolutely true and irrefutable.

but......

wait for it......

"wat abowt intersex" etc etc etc ad nauseum

Around and around it goes.

LK1972 · 30/06/2022 12:59

Discovereads · 30/06/2022 10:49

It’s assigned. Assigning simply means deciding and choosing whichever sex the baby is based on visual identification. It’s splitting hairs to argue that “assign” can’t be used to describe this process. It has been for decades and there’s no reason to pick another word that means the same thing.

It's deliberate phrasing to advance the TRA agenda, as evidenced in this draft law paper from Columbia University.

'Abstract
Transgender rights discussions often turn on the distinction be-tween “gender identity” and “sex assigned at birth.” Gender identity is a person’s own internal sense of whether they are a man, a woman, or nonbinary. “Sex assigned at birth” means the “male” or “female” designation that doctors ascribe to infants based on genitalia and is marked on their birth records. Sex assigned at birth is intended to displace the concept of “biological sex.”

This Article provides an account of the origins of the terms “biological sex” and “sex assigned at birth” and assesses the potential of the shift to sex assigned at birth for transgender rights arguments...' papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=4032865
Lots more interesting stuff in the actual paper, download is free.

Would love to hear whether you still think GC women should just roll over and stop 'hair-splitting' after reading that @Discovereads

BoredofthisCrap7 · 30/06/2022 13:25

Absolutely correct.
It's also why birth certificates WHICH ARE A LEGAL RECORD OF A BIRTH AND BELONG TO THE CHILD, not the parent, should reflect biological truth and reality.

I vehemently disagree with being able to change your birth certificate in this instance because of a "gender" identity. I'm NOT talking about cases of DSDs where the sex was incorrectly recorded at birth due to ambiguous genitalia.

If we can "re-assign" or change actual concrete facts, why can't we change the birth date if we feel like it? The occupation of the father or mother? (I want to be an international best selling author and I want the father to be a hospital consultant. While I'm at it I want the birth date changed because I didn't want my baby to be born on a Wednesday. Can we change the birth weight too please, my baby identifies as skinnier than that.)

Birth records are legal documents which capture a true and accurate picture of the circumstances of the birth.
They are not an extension of someone's whims and fancies depending on how they feel or what ideology they currently subscribe to.

Record the FACTS of the birth, not an arbitrary "assigning" of anything.

ThinkingaboutLangClegosaurus · 30/06/2022 13:41

Pluvia · 30/06/2022 11:12

No. Here are the first two of a long list of definitions from Collins Dictionary (the dictionary I am required to use by my workplace).

1. to select for and appoint to a post, etc
to assign an expert to the job
2. to give out or allot (a task, problem, etc)
to assign advertising to an expert

There's an element of choice and judgment inherent throughout. Sex you merely observe. You don't allocate or select or allot or make a judgment call. In 99% of cases sex is clear.

Language is important.

Yes. Assigned does not mean the same as observed. It means more like ‘given’. And in all my long life, I’d never heard of a baby’s sex being ‘assigned’ until recently, in trans contexts.

ThinkingaboutLangClegosaurus · 30/06/2022 13:44

I love the Daily Mail’s intro: Midwives have today denounced claims they 'assign' the sex of children at birth

iI can hear them now.
”You assigned that baby male, I saw you do it!”
”I bloody didn’t!”

StopStartStop · 30/06/2022 13:48

Ravenclawdropout · 29/06/2022 20:22

It because of so many women having the courage to speak out especially women such as Kellie-Jay Keen who despite being 5 foot nothing and having grown men screaming in her face and other women condemn her, has continued to stand up and just say out loud what we all know to be true.

Yes, it is.

Artichokeleaves · 30/06/2022 13:51

How?

Where's the policy and guidance? How exactly is it assigned?

I'm sure this was demanded of the Royal College of Midwives who had to admit this is just a lot of Woke virtue signalling. It's lying. Everyone fucking knows its lying. Everyone knows they are only repeating a lie to be 'nice' because they've been told to.

We have generations of adults running around talking absolute bollocks on command while knowing full well it's total bollocks, and behind us is a group of kids without the life experience yet to know it's bollocks and a lot of intentional lying to be nice, and hiding the truth to be nice, and not mentioning the truth to be nice, who are going to be very, very confused. And very pissed off when it dawns on them just how totally fucked up they have been in their understanding of the world from a lot of very stupid adults in positions of responsibility with no boundaries and no basic common sense. And apparently neither the resilience nor training to know how to handle a difficult political lobby who throw whopping tantrums whenever they're not given exactly what they want.

Johnnysgirl · 30/06/2022 13:52

Assigning simply means deciding and choosing whichever sex the baby is based on visual identification
it does not. Ffs!

LK1972 · 30/06/2022 13:54

This contrived language is yet another example of TRAs using DSDs, and the language developed for the most complex of these cases, to muddy the waters and compel us to use ridiculous new terms.

The aim is to impose legal language/ terms that make it impossible to defend women's sex-based rights (which they also insist women do not have in this country).

No, thank you, I will not be using 'sex assigned at birth' and will challenge its usage anywhere I can safely do so.

LK1972 · 30/06/2022 13:55

ThinkingaboutLangClegosaurus · 30/06/2022 13:44

I love the Daily Mail’s intro: Midwives have today denounced claims they 'assign' the sex of children at birth

iI can hear them now.
”You assigned that baby male, I saw you do it!”
”I bloody didn’t!”

Grin
NecessaryScene · 30/06/2022 14:08

And in all my long life, I’d never heard of a baby’s sex being ‘assigned’ until recently, in trans contexts.

Well, it was used in DSD contexts to talk about either sex incorrectly recorded, or surgical procedures that were done.

It absolutely was not used for an accurate recording of sex - as Discovereads (faux?) naively claims it means.

Trans activists appropriated it to create the implication that the actual correct sex was "wrong", unlike the self-claimed sex. The implication of it being wrong is intended. That's why the word is being used, not the more sensible "recorded".

AlisonDonut · 30/06/2022 14:20

It has been raining all day so I have assigned today as 'wet'.

Johnnysgirl · 30/06/2022 14:29

AlisonDonut · 30/06/2022 14:20

It has been raining all day so I have assigned today as 'wet'.

Surely you had the option to assign "sunny"? Is that not how it works? The rain is all your own fault...

DadJoke · 30/06/2022 14:32

More Daily Mail anti-trans hyperbole. God forbid anyone use more inclusive language around transgender birth parents.

The document isn't telling anyone what language to use it's suggesting that language be inclusive where appropriate.

"In our language we will aim to add and not take away, taking into account the importance of preserving women-centred language as well as including language for those who do not identify as a woman."

Then it points to the diversity policy which does not mention "assigned at birth."

"Assigned at birth" the government's defintion and has a legal meaning.

The UK government defines sex as:

referring to the biological aspects of an individual as determined by their anatomy, which is produced by their chromosomes, hormones and their interactions

generally male or female

something that is assigned at birth

Theblondestoftheblonde · 30/06/2022 14:33

DadJoke · 30/06/2022 14:32

More Daily Mail anti-trans hyperbole. God forbid anyone use more inclusive language around transgender birth parents.

The document isn't telling anyone what language to use it's suggesting that language be inclusive where appropriate.

"In our language we will aim to add and not take away, taking into account the importance of preserving women-centred language as well as including language for those who do not identify as a woman."

Then it points to the diversity policy which does not mention "assigned at birth."

"Assigned at birth" the government's defintion and has a legal meaning.

The UK government defines sex as:

referring to the biological aspects of an individual as determined by their anatomy, which is produced by their chromosomes, hormones and their interactions

generally male or female

something that is assigned at birth

That's bullshit and you know it.

TastefulRainbowUnicorn · 30/06/2022 14:38

More Daily Mail anti-trans hyperbole. God forbid anyone use more inclusive language around transgender birth parents.

I was nonplussed at that until I saw the username and I realised it was, as advertised, a joke. Nice one! Have you considered changing your name to EjaculatingParentMicroaggression to be more inclusive?

MontanaMountains · 30/06/2022 14:50

So if you give birth to a female baby, but really wanted a male baby, you can just assign the female as male at birth? How progressive.

littlbrowndog · 30/06/2022 15:10

Yeah artichoke. It’s lying everyone knows it’s lying

they know that we know they are lying and they know that we know they are lying

and if sex was assigned at birth then how come so many baby girls are aborted in some countries

why can’t they be assigned boys at birth ? If that’s how it works.

The millions of missing girls

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