What you all said was coming

[Pippinbird]

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10947483/Anguish-young-man-sex-organs-removed-NHS-regretted-day-SUES-NHS

So, he asked for the surgery on the NHS.

He got exactly what he asked for, for FREE.

Now he doesn't like the outcome, EVERYTHING IS SOMEONE ELSE'S FAULT.

Instead of researching things like freezing sperm, IT'S SOMEONE ELSE'S FAULT FOR NOT SPOON FEEDING MEEEE.

Ok then.

EXACTLY!!

Adult GIDS has an affirmation only policy. They do nothing to explore whether there could be underlying reasons for your distress and it is effectively a screening service to rule out physical barriers to medical transition. Tullip would not have had to “forcefully” argue for the surgery- the surgery is seen as the solution for gender dysphoria in an area where patients are effectively viewed as clients.

Look at the language used for the Indigo Pilot Clinics. They talk about informed consent, but it is framed in a client based environment where the individual chooses their “options”:

”Communication is key to helping you understand the services and options available to you. To support you throughout your journey with us, you will be assigned a care navigator. They will have lived experience as a trans or non-binary person as well as an understanding of pathways, services and resources available both within Indigo and more widely across Greater Manchester.

Care navigators are uniquely positioned to make your experience as easy, efficient and relevant to your needs as possible.”

indigogenderservice.uk/our-services/services-we-offer/care-navigation

It’s all warm and fuzzy and completely surface level. Where’s the in depth psychological assessment to ensure the medical pathway is suitable for each individual?

Where is the sense of caution when for hormones, you can be approved on your second visit (from the age of 17):

”We can recommend and support your own GP to start hormone therapy at your second appointment if:

you’re diagnosed with gender incongruence at your second visit;
you feel confident that you’ve understood the information we’ve shown you, including the possible risk and side effects of any treatment options;
you’re feeling ready to start hormones;
it’s medically safe for you to do so.”

indigogenderservice.uk/frequently-asked-questions

This model of acceptance on a vulnerable adult’s say so is utterly irresponsible and it needs changed. The govt is pushing ahead with this approach more strongly than ever due to the long waiting lists for the adult service. There is no will there for change. The Keira Bell case made it clear the courts will not rule for a blanket change, that litigation needs to be carried out at an individual level.

There is much focus on childrens services, but none on the adult service. What is going to happen when thousands of these current adolescents time out of children GIDS and are moved to the adult side? They have been brought up in a world of affirmation by schools, social media, their peer group without any chance to desist. Do they then suddenly become competent to make decisions as young adults when they are moved to a “client” based service?

I don’t think so. I firmly believe the adult GIDS service needs a complete overhaul and that in the current environment the only way to achieve this is through individual litigation. Tullip has been badly faked and I wish him the best of luck.

Obviously, it's in the interests of the trans lobby to push the "he knew what he was doing, what did he expect" aspect and completely ignore/downplay the poor mental health impairing decision making aspect.

I wonder how different that would have looked if the hospital had signed up to " boobytrap" an organisation that believed everyone who asks fir a mastectomy should get one no questions asked. And those drs who spoke to your mum walked around with pink and purple laces and lanyards having just filled out paperwork recording all the ways they make it easier for these mastectomies to be performed.

Would their be the same level.of care taken. Could we be certain of no conflict of interests.

It should all be Impartial and individual.

People are being told left right and centre that they can become the opposite sex, even by their governments (looking at you Scotland) so I can understand that the assumption would be that the surgeries must be fit for purpose…

Which of course they are not and will never be because you can’t just turn a penis into a vagina.

Excellent post. This is exactly what should be happening and it didn't.

I do feel sorry for him but I completely disagree with him suing the NHS for this.

No, let him crack on. The NHS needs to face the cost and hassle of being sued over this since it’s their ridiculous stance in enabling and caving to pressure to “be kind” rather than sticking with science that has made this whole problem so pervasive. If our doctors had stuck with the view that these people have a mental health problem then we wouldn’t be in this mess. We don’t allow anorexic people to remove their stomachs.

Exactly Narwhalsh

I mean David Lammy thinks you can grow a cervix or it's an add on at surgery or some idiotic madness. And Fiona Bruce in question time scolded Professor Winston when he said "I can categorically say you cannot change your sex" (I paraphrase, haven't checked his precise words) and FB jumped in and said "well many people would disagree" and left him looked like a fuming five year old that's been told off for something they didn't do.

The great thing about this case is the public finally get to hear some harsh truths. I hope he wins but win or lose it's a case that needed bringing.

This shouldn't have happened in the first place.
The NHS does not routinely offer plastic surgery. There are plenty of women with poor mental health who feel a breast enlargement or nose job would help.
They have to go private. Partly because the NHS doesn't want to be responsible for complications and partly because the NHS can't afford to give cosmetic surgery when it is supposed to be a free at the point of treatment service to keep the population well.
When are routinely refused breast reduction for health reasons. Breast reconstruction after cancer. Surgery like cleft palettes and sdr surgery is often delayed so patients have to absolutely fight for them, and there the results are physical not even just cosmetic.
The NHS just needs to up it's mental health support for trans people and direct them to comepatant private surgeons and loan companies.
It's the obvious solution but they are captured.

And they want us to allow them to do this to children?

If I was a doctor and a man came to me and asked me to remove his penis, I'd start by assuming that he was mentally ill. I would not be removing a man's penis unless there was a strong medical reason to do so.

Doctors generally refuse to offer sterilisations to young women, even if they've had children, because they think they might regret it. Why on earth, therefore, are they removing the penis of a healthy young man? The consequences of that are not just that he will never have children but that he will never have a sex life.

This isn't about this individual man knew or didn't know what he was doing. It is about the responsibility of doctors to behave ethically and not to carry out harmful, life-altering procedures with no medical benefit.

Exactly what Woo said.

I couldn't get my tubes tied, men can't get a vasectomy,
many many women have to wait risking pregnancy, because they are considered too young to make themselves infertile. They may change their mind.

Women who have terrible periods for decades, but no hysterectomy available because, you know, unnecessary. You're young, you might change your mind, it's not a walk in the park, major surgery, you know.

Make your mind up, which is it?

I am.sick to death of this kind of insane devotion to the nhs even when the has fucked up massively and changed/ruined lives. What has to happen befire they can be held accountable.

Perhaps they should put the money they pay stonewall into a pot fir if they get sued instead.

Why the hell should anyone feel guilty for suing when there's money fir stonewall training and rewriting policies removing the word woman and to pay staff to sit around on their arses filling out a huge stack of forms recording all the ways in which they shit on every protected characteristic besides gender reassignment.

If the nhs dont care where their money goes why the hell should the patient.

Crack.on. then perhaps they will realise that the get out clause fir any accountability is on the small print of said massive stack of forms and they are on their own.

He should sue the NHS & I hope he wins a massive pay out.

It might make them stop mutilating these people & clearing the massive backlog of genuinely needed surgeries instead.

No treatment for this should ever be available on the NHS other than counselling.

I don't know if there is an equivalent to the Freedom programme for people caught up in this ideology, but there should be.

The NHS is complicit in the abuse of these people & causes irreparable harm that they could not do to themselves without the assistance of the medical profession.

I have absolutely no sympathy for him.
He got what he wanted at 25 & now he will have to live with the consequences.

He wasn't a 14 year old child swept up in a world of lies who didn't know any better.

Maybe he could go into secondary schools to do talks & show all the kids who identify as something else the reality of what they are saying actually looks like.
Then some small good could come of this.

Like they say... if it saves one child.

I think if you had unnecessary surgery that left you in pain and with absolutely no sex life and no prospect of one, and feeling suicidal you might feel it was appropriate to be compensated.

I disagree, if you have chosen to have that unnecessary surgery and gone through a whole process to get it. While I feel sorry for him, people do need to take some responsibility for their own decisions

This is not really the fault of the NHS, it's the fault of mermaids draconian gender support groups who push their agenda rigorously and refuse to acknowledge any alternative viewpoint and push younger and younger kids into extreme solutions to their personality difficulties which are often much more complicated than gender identity. It doesn't matter how much your brain is wired wrong or how much you want to be the other gender or something in between... if you're looking for people to bend reality and to have plastic surgery to validate you then you're NEVER going to be happy. Treatment should focus on counselling and helping young people realise this IMHO but an extreme few of the transgender movement simply won't allow sensible discussions around this which is why health services are being pushed into such drastic measures and they're literally being emotionally blackmailed with children's lives to do this. This is all of society's problem not just the NHS

Funny but true

I think that's unfair though. Aside from the fact it seems he was mentally unwell there is so so so much misinformation online about the surgery, and few resources that actually spell out what it's actually like and the risks. It's being sold to people (including children) as a magic fix, and some put a lot of time and effort into supporting this notion in online content.

But the NHS is offering this, they haven't been forced at gunpoint into doing so- yes certainly other factors are equally/more problematic, but they need to take responsibility too

This is not really the fault of the NHS, it's the fault of mermaids draconian gender support groups who push their agenda rigorously and refuse to acknowledge any alternative viewpoint and push younger and younger kids into extreme solutions to their personality difficulties which are often much more complicated than gender identity

Someone in the nhs signs up for the training though. They pay them.to come in and to vet policies etc. Clearly without any kind of vetting because the social media content alone should raise concerns.

There's a choice made to involve them. Asking stonewall to write your legal.policies is like asking my postie to fix my car.

It's being sold to people (including children) as a magic fix

I agree. And this is where the NHS needs to be impartial (say no to the rainbow scheme), be evidence-based (where IS the evidence these surgeries are a good thing?), be free from pressure groups (not bowing down to Mermaids, GIRES, SW, WPATH and others).

The NHS shouldn't be allowed to wriggle off the hook. This issue needs a public inquiry, including the charity sector and what the Charity Commission has done in response to complaints, including RSE in schools, including the likes of TikTok, Twitter, Reddit. The whole lot, and especially charities and online platforms as these will otherwise be allowed to slope off into the shadows.

He's taken up the services of a 'no win, no fee' lawyer who I imagine has got their eyes on a big payday.

Perhaps. It's surprising how small most medical negligence payouts are (just a few thousand pounds) except in cases where a child has been brain-damaged at birth and needs funding for lifetime care.

I think it's more likely that this firm is hoping the first case, if successful, will open the door to others.

If someone went to a doctor and claimed they were Jesus, and that doctor, instead of examining why this person thought they were Jesus, just cracked on building a cross for the patient to be crucified on then we would be rightly horrified. Obviously an overblown comparison, but not so far off the mark.

This (the man in the Op, not the fictional Jesus!) could well have been my son, if he had not actually had some useful therapy from GIDS. The affirmation only model is dangerous, and unfortunately the only way things will change is if it starts costing them money in compensation. Losing money is the only thing that will make the NHS stop and look at what the hell they’re doing, sad but true, loss of money is worth more to society than actual human suffering.