Apparently female rape survivors 'need' mixed sex groups

[IamSarah]

Honestly. This is what my local rape crisis centre wrote in a letter to the EHRC.

Apparently women who have been raped need to welcome trans women into the rape crisis groups as they provide amazing value and are 'needed'.

Of course they haven't actually asked female survivors. None of it is trauma informed. I've no idea what the motivation is but its dodgy as hell.

survivorsnetwork.org.uk/our-letter-to-the-equalities-and-human-rights-commission/

I think it's just been on Radio 4?

Yes it has at 7:08. Excellent coverage - I really hope your action has impact.

The self righteous whining from the council did my head in though.

Sending you a HH Sarah

Was it on Radio 4 at 7.08? I am listening back to Today and can't find it

I’m all for trans rights, but I was raped by my older kids dad a lot and I have to admit I’d hate this and I wouldn’t feel comfortable at all.

I've only seen the news about this today.

The mind bogles. I don't pretend to be any sort of expert on any of these issues, but how on earth could "experts" supporting victims of rape think it was appropriate (or necessary) to have men in the group?

What I like about this article is it’s very clear that that the survivor included was asking for just one session out of many sessions to be transwomen free. I suspect the reason that wasn’t giving is because many/most women would have only wanted to attend the penis free group.

It was on at 7.07. Only a short mention at the end of the news.
www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/live:bbc_radio_fourfm

Thanks, I must have slid past it. Off to see how they did...

God. TWAW, deal with it! I doubt that did them any good, hearing that was weird. A woman said out loud "Transwomen are women... we told her that before she came"

And the world shuddered. Hearing it said, by a woman, was quite different from reading it.

It’s utterly ridiculous to allow self ID, to the extent where they don’t even bother to exclude an obviously male person, in normal clothes for a man, from a women’s group. The women in that group presumably chose a women-only group for a reason.

Bad enough if there’s an obviously male person who’s made an effort, but the case as you describe it is so clearly wrong that I find it astonishing anyone working in this arena can even bring themselves to try to defend it.

I have to wonder whether this is like the case in Scotland, where there’s a male person high up in the organisation. Either that, or the women running it went into it for all the wrong reasons and actually enjoy inflicting pain. No woman with an ounce of empathy for her fellow women would inflict this on other rape victims.

just listened - short but clear. I checked Network survivors website and their policies - and their equalities policy is factually incorrect, surpise, surpise, and has gender as a protected characteristic not sex.

so according to them they don't have to prioritise sex - only gender

Glad to hear the case covered on today. I liked that they gave the defence that Transwomen are women. I see sprayed cornflakes at breakfast tables.

Peak breakfast listening.

Seems activists from this lobby have been extremely effective in seeking out organisations that provide services to women to explicitly change policies from the inside eg Edinburgh Rape Centre. Wouldn’t be hugely surprising to find the same in SN?

What this proves is that once any organisation gets into the grip of this lobby or worse is staffed by activists from it, it should not be permitted to provide services for females

hell mend (it’s a Scottish expression, no threats of violence - like karma) every individual and organisation who has worked to remove womens safe spaces. We won’t forget them.

their website says

"surviviors network is a feminist organisation"

they are funded by

"We deliver services funded by Brighton and Hove and East Sussex local authorities, Children in Need, The Office of the Police and Crime Commissioner, Brighton and Hove Third Sector Investment Partnership, NHS, Ministry of Justice, Lloyds Bank Foundation, Sussex Community Foundation, The National Lottery and Diocese of Chichester and we thank them all for recognising the enormous impact of our work and for working with us to deliver high quality services to survivors."

i wonder if those organisations realise that the services they offer are so skewed and that actually they are not abiding by the equalities act.

R4 NOW

I'm listening now.

Shock horror - a woman talking some sense!

And a rape centre talking utter 🏀

flopis I’m not sure that the BBC article makes it crystal clear that that the survivor included was asking for just one session out of many sessions to be transwomen free That is, it didn’t seem wholly clear in the article that there was also TW only group offered to service users.

It’s only because of reading Sarah’s previous posts that I was aware. Otherwise IMO the article doesn’t spell it out that there were men only and TW only groups offered to service users in addition to a women’s group that included TW.

Though if SN truly believes TWAW there would be no TW only group would there? Just a W group.

Of course they haven't actually asked female survivors.

If you read their letter, they have asked female survivors. They quoted research:
“Most cis service users said they were happy for transwomen to use their service, and also that they would welcome transwomen joining their women-only groups. They clearly differentiated between the prospect of cis men joining their group (who not not be welcome) and transwomen joining.”

Pain R, Cygnus Supprt and O’Neil S.(2021) “One of the Lasses”. Trans Inclusion and Safety in Abuse Support Services. Newcastle University. Newcastle upon Tyne.

I am a female survivor and I wouldn’t care if a transwoman joined a women-only support group.

That's nice.

Do you think the women who do care should be entitled to appropriate support?

At least one of those reduced our funding because we did NOT include transwomen in our female centre. The national one! We aren't diverse enough in our client base - clarified in a follow up, in writing!, as we don't include men or transwomen. We are a rape crisis centre, built by, run by and for women.

So for the last five years we have to give financial support to the male centre we also helped set up, but had been totally separate from as that is what the staff and client base felt was best.

Last month, our latest application, we got that funding back, no word of apology, just suddenly the full amount was sent, as it used to be. So something has changed.

And yes, we will continue to support the male centre. But we may do it differently, to re-build that separation, the distance staff and clients wanted.

I am a female survivor and I wouldn’t care if a transwoman joined a women-only support group.

What about the women who do care? Women like Sarah who find it traumatic to attend sessions with males. Should they be excluded in order to include men who want to be women?