To wonder why an MP is lying about womens bathrooms?

[TeaKlaxon]

Lucy Allen has tweeted that the Barbican has mens bathrooms and gender neutral bathrooms, but no womens bathrooms.

Lots of twitter users told her that was wrong.

The Barbican itself told her it's wrong.

But the tweet remains. AIBU to think that if an MP gets something wrong, they should apologise and remove the lie? Or to think that this is deliberate misinformation to further the myth of women being 'erased'?

twitter.com/lucyallan/status/1507076111871713282?s=20&t=D_TGgQBlnKkKZ6NEIjnzsw

@TeaKlaxon

Incidentally, this misinformation seems to be a habit among people who want to have a go at trans people or establishments that are inclusive of them.

twitter.com/InayaFolarin/status/1507786322601250820?s=20&t=D_TGgQBlnKkKZ6NEIjnzsw

Here's a GB News presenter making the same claim about a pub in Belfast.

The only problem is that her claim is false. She is claiming that a sign that shows where the gents and gender neutral toilets are means that there are no women's toilets. But that is a lie.

Whats even more remarkable is that it is a lie demonstrated by the very sign she tweeted which, in small print at the bottom says that there are gender specific toilets on every floor - so the sign is literally just a direction to those specific loos, not an exhaustive list of all loos in the building.

Why do these people have such a need to lie?

I'm confused about this, why are gents and gender neutral so obviously signposted, yet you have to ask a member of staff where the womens are? Doesn't that seem a little strange to you op?

[quote girlmom21]@TeaKlaxon if you're going to post an anti-Tory post do it without proving yourself wrong.

There are plenty of Tory MP's you can have a pop at but misquoting someone and claiming they said something they didn't is misinformation - by your own definition. [/quote]
Lucy Allen's intention is clear.

To spread misinformation about the availability of women's bathrooms in the Barbican. It is all part of a myth being perpetuated that women are 'being erased'. It is blatant misinformation and the inability of some to call it out speaks volumes about their priorities.

I've just figured it out! The OP is American! Bathrooms and Trump! Now it all makes sense. Have you even been to the Barbican, OP?!

Main level toilets are Barbican. Gender neutral, disabled, men's.

The women's toilets have been rebadged mixed sex.

So what - you think the various lesbians who have told us about their experiences being challenged in womens bathrooms

You say 'told us' TeaKlaxon - who are you representing here?

Being incorrect doesn't necessarily equal lying. Having male toilets and gender neutral toilets but no female toilets in one specific area of a building is strange and, unless the direction of the female toilets is highlighted in the area where those toilets are, it's logical to assume they don't exist.

If you were in a bar and someone stood in front of the gender neutral toilets asking where the ladies was you'd roll your eyes because you'd assume they were trying to make a point.

I'm confused about this, why are gents and gender neutral so obviously signposted, yet you have to ask a member of staff where the womens are? Doesn't that seem a little strange to you op?

No.

Because I happen to have been to that pub. And I know that in another part of the building there will be a sign with 'Ladies' (or women's - can't quite remember what label they use) and the same small print, that directs people to the women's bathroom.

It just so happens that in that particular part of the building, the sign is directing people to the Gents and Gender Neutral toilets because that is what happens to be up those particular stairs.

So 1 person (with an agenda) claims something happens despite many people on here saying they have never seen it and now we are all supposed to believe it’s an issue?
I attended an event a couple of years ago and due to the kind of event it was there were quite a few butch presenting lesbians and also quite a few Transwomen. There was no way you could have mistaken one group for the other.

@Franca123

I've just figured it out! The OP is American! Bathrooms and Trump! Now it all makes sense. Have you even been to the Barbican, OP?!

Many times. Most recently just before Christmas to see Anything Goes.

And nope, not American.

@DingDongDenny

So what - you think the various lesbians who have told us about their experiences being challenged in womens bathrooms

You say 'told us' TeaKlaxon - who are you representing here?

Representing no one but myself.

@Hoppinggreen

So 1 person (with an agenda) claims something happens despite many people on here saying they have never seen it and now we are all supposed to believe it’s an issue? I attended an event a couple of years ago and due to the kind of event it was there were quite a few butch presenting lesbians and also quite a few Transwomen. There was no way you could have mistaken one group for the other.

Yeah but there's an article in Diva Mag so it must be true

@Hoppinggreen

So 1 person (with an agenda) claims something happens despite many people on here saying they have never seen it and now we are all supposed to believe it’s an issue? I attended an event a couple of years ago and due to the kind of event it was there were quite a few butch presenting lesbians and also quite a few Transwomen. There was no way you could have mistaken one group for the other.

Except there's also lots of evidence of people speaking out about their experience being challenged in bathrooms.

You're obviously free to ignore that if you wish.

Coming back to add that Lucy Allen has form for misinformation - most notably tweeting the debunked rubbish about Keir Starmer failing to prosecute grooming gangs, and also lots of stuff about how covid isn't a big deal. She's faked a death threat, bullied her own staff and was suspended from a previous job for plagiarism. This isn't someone who has earned the benefit of the doubt.

I don’t ignore evidence and I don’t ignore my own lived experience and that of many women I personally know
I do ignore biased articles in skewed publications with a very clear agenda, with or without your permission

I go a lot to the Barbican

The toilet situtation has been fucking me off for a while.

In cinema 1 they converted what used to be the ladies into "gender neutral" toilets. There are I think only 2 or 3 cubicles.

The gents has either remained as gents or is labelled as gender neutral with a urinal... regardless it doesn't feel like my loo options have been massively expanded but they have for those who identify as male.

Anyway, it's had a massive impact on the queue for the loo in that area for women.

The toilets around the theatre are less of an issue and I've not been into cinema 2/3 post covid so can't remember what they are like.

@girlmom21

Being incorrect doesn't necessarily equal lying. Having male toilets and gender neutral toilets but no female toilets in one specific area of a building is strange and, unless the direction of the female toilets is highlighted in the area where those toilets are, it's logical to assume they don't exist.

If you were in a bar and someone stood in front of the gender neutral toilets asking where the ladies was you'd roll your eyes because you'd assume they were trying to make a point.

It's not logical to assume they don't exist. The Barbican is a huge space. There are parts of the building that have women's bathrooms but the mens bathrooms are somewhere else certainly out of eyeline (e.g. from memory, on at least one floor of the main auditorium area, if you go out one side of the balcony, there is a women's bathroom, but if you go out the other side there is a men's bathroom.

I believe there is a disabled loo on both sides as well.

If you go out the door with the women's bathroom, you can't immediately see the men's bathrooms (and vice versa). It's not reasonable to deduce from that they they don't exist.

I'm not surprised they were being challenged if they were in a bathroom. I'd challenge anyone I found in our bathroom.

@raspberrymuffin

Coming back to add that Lucy Allen has form for misinformation - most notably tweeting the debunked rubbish about Keir Starmer failing to prosecute grooming gangs, and also lots of stuff about how covid isn't a big deal. She's faked a death threat, bullied her own staff and was suspended from a previous job for plagiarism. This isn't someone who has earned the benefit of the doubt.

Thanks for flagging this.

Yes, seemingly quite a dishonest (or, being generous) careless person.

But it's interesting to see all the posters on here falling over themselves to defend her, even though they can't actually explain in what way the implications of her tweet are correct.

All they've got is 'but she only says she was told X, so as long as she was told X it;s not technically a lie...'

@TeaKlaxon but if you saw womens toilets and gender neutral toilets you'd assume there were no mens toilets. It's not the same as them being completely separate.

If there are just mens or just womens, you know there'll be other toilets elsewhere.

If there are just gender neutral toilets, you assume there are only gender neutral toilets.

@Hoppinggreen

I don’t ignore evidence and I don’t ignore my own lived experience and that of many women I personally know I do ignore biased articles in skewed publications with a very clear agenda, with or without your permission

OK.

So we should just ignore lesbians like Eloise Stonborough because her words are printed in a magazine for queer women and NB people.

It's funny how much of the GC narrative is all about listening to the concerns of women, but when a woman sets out her own experience that they disagree with, it is dismissed entirely.

@daimbarsatemydogsbone

I'm not surprised they were being challenged if they were in a bathroom. I'd challenge anyone I found in our bathroom.

I agree. And I don't think a lot if people go to the Barbican for a bath or shower either.

[quote girlmom21]@TeaKlaxon but if you saw womens toilets and gender neutral toilets you'd assume there were no mens toilets. It's not the same as them being completely separate.

If there are just mens or just womens, you know there'll be other toilets elsewhere.

If there are just gender neutral toilets, you assume there are only gender neutral toilets.
[/quote]
No, I wouldn't assume that.

Unless I'd been primed to believe that institutions are out there wholesale removing womens facilities and 'erasing women' - maybe if I'd fallen for that nonesense then I might assume such a counterintuitive thing.

But aside from being brainwashed (including by people like Lucy Allen furthering this nonsense), if I saw gents and gender neutral bathrooms in a venue as large as the Barbican, I would just assume the women's bathroom is somewhere else. That is by far the more reasonable assumption.

Perhaps they wanted to borrow a loofah?

On what planet do people regularly confuse butch lesbians with transwomen/men?

That’s only possible if someone has no eyes, or ears.

I really don’t understand this modern push that actually, we can’t tell men apart from women. It’s as clear as the difference between night and day, no matter how that person is dressed/styled. Maybe in a carefully staged photo, certainly not in real life where the person is talking/moving.

It’s complete and utter hogwash.