Gender nonsense will be the Tories secret weapon

[bellinisurge]

To my mind, the only way the Tories can get themselves out of their self made mess is to shine a light on gender woo woo in the Labour Party. I'm guessing that was behind Wes Streeting's tentative "maybe we shouldn't say burn the witch all the time".
How can they not see how vulnerable they are when Liz Truss has become a more appealing prospect for women's rights.
Jesus.

Why the fuck are you still here boring me to death?

Good line, I'm enjoying the carnage.

I doubt anyone here would want trans people to live in the shadows, and it's a matter of fact that trans people have as much protection under the law as any other UK citizens, and more than some because they benefit from hate crime legislation.

Your insinuation that women standing up for their own legal protections are by default anti-trans is tacit acknowledgement that the repeated attempts to establish gender identity in place of sex are in direct conflict with women's rights.

Yeah see the lesbian and gay movement for details. Oh

False equivalence. The lesbian and gay movement weren’t targeting children and their movement didn’t involve pushing them down paths of life long medication and painful surgeries on already healthy bodies. They didn’t demand any changes in language, they didn’t demand people lie and abuse and attack them when they wouldn’t. They didn’t demand that men compete in sporting events with women or be allowed into their single sex spaces. They wanted equality, which they didn’t have. They didn’t want to change society, they just wanted to play an equal part in the society which was already there. Trans people already have equality but what they want is to be prioritised to the detriment of women. So, not not the same thing at all and that’s why trans ideology cannot stick in the long term.

I am laughing at these attempts. These statements are so off the the truth but obviously it is wishful thinking.

Just like the statements such as : working class women are not concerned about this - like this poster is an authority on working class women …. because they know some.

Yet, not once has shared a definition of what they are describing as working class. And ignoring the working class women posters on this board, and those women with working class backgrounds.

Now, we get a litany of events that have ‘missed’ the mark in changing the world.

I think some posters actually need to get out and speak to people across different communities. Due to Hubbard, I have had more conversations with people now read up on women’s sports than ever.

Thanks to Joanne Rowling, I have had numerous conversations about what it all meant with very confused parents.

Thanks to Keira Bell, and Dr Stock there has been conversations started by people expressing horror at what is happening.

Conversations are now happening in real life every day now. Where as two years ago there was nothing. Strangely, they are not happening with people those asking questions consider friends who would consider them hateful.

Hence those with extremist trans activist views will not be included in these conversations. That recent YouGov survey showed what was happening there.

Why on earth would anyone say anything to someone they know would probably call them phobic and hateful. Maybe even effect Thor livelihoods …. Yet we are being told ‘working class women are not discussing this’ (no … they are not having these conversations around you) .

And look at the organisations pulling out of stonewall. Yeah, winning!!!!

There have been wins though - Harry Miller, the census. There are court cases still in the offing including appeals.

Keira’s case actually had effects in other countries who are now doing their own research into affirming only treatment. There is a growing swell of international clinicians saying that there are issues that need to be addressed. Even trans doctors themselves.

The overconfidence displayed here has been an outstanding effort. But like others have said. It is projection based on nothing but wishful thinking.

@barleybadminton

Why the fuck are you still here boring me to death?

Good line, I'm enjoying the carnage.

Really? You write awfully long posts for someone here to spectate

Yeah see the lesbian and gay movement for details. Oh ...

yeah because there is absolutely no evidence of an anti-lesbian and anti-gay backlash happening since gay marriage was achieved... Oh...

But ultimately, there'll be a backlash to that backlash. Indeed, that is already happening. Because the moral arc of the universe is long, but it bends towards justice. And it bends towards truth. A movement founded on 2+2=5, or on any other logical contradiction or lie, can flourish for a time (only a short time, given the speed of cultural change these days) and will maybe have roots forever in some dank and seedy corners of the culture, but truth always finds a way, no matter how hard zealots and tyrants try to clamp down on free speech.

There are four lights. 2+2=4. The emperor is stark raving bollock naked. Transwomen are male. Deal with it.

The lesbian and gay movement weren’t targeting children

That's exactly what they were accused of doing, what do you think Section 28 was about.

their movement didn’t involve pushing them down paths of life long medication and painful surgeries on already healthy bodies.

No they were accused of luring children into a 'gay lifestyle' where they would take drugs, have deviant sex and get AIDS.

They didn’t demand any changes in language Are you having a laugh? Many of the older generation were furious that a word that once meant happy and carefree was now used to mean sexual deviance as they saw it.

They didn’t want to change society, they just wanted to play an equal part in the society which was already there.

Have you ever read any radical lesbian literature from the period or looked at some of the agitprop that was produced at that time? The lesbian and gay movement was revolutionary in nature and many sought to overturn everything from capitalism to the nuclear family.

All that post says is that you know nothing about the struggle for LGB rights.

My thoughts exactly. Barley seems to be wasting an awful lot of effort on the pitiful, doomed death throes of our movement...

Sorry, Alekto. Great name, by the way!

"As someone who is part of the LGBT community"

What part are you?

And it doesn't matter what we were accused of back in the day, Barley, fact is the allegations were completely baseless. Unlike..

they are not having these conversations around you

Sshhhhh!

CompleteGinasaur ta very much

Bloody formatting

they are not having these conversations around you

Sshhhhh!

CompleteGinasaur ta very much

And as someone who lived in a Lesbian Housing Co-op in the 80s, worked in Lesbian owned businesses, volunteered for years on a Lesbian helpline, marched against section 28 when it was still section 27, campaigned for an equal age of consent before Stonewall was even formed..

If you want to know anything about the struggle for gay rights, don't ask Barley, I'm sat right here.

Two glasses. Yay!

@DialSquare

"As someone who is part of the LGBT community"

What part are you?

Extremely good question. But I don't think Barley answers those..

Oh well. We'll just have to come to our own conclusions then (if we haven't already).

Absolutely, DialSquare.

Do you think he's gone? Oh dear, how sad, never mind..

And I've just reread my post and realise that it doesn't say quite what I meant it to - I did not mean to imply that I knew more than anyone on here about the struggle for gay rights (such a portentious phrase; I didn't choose it). I just meant Barley...!

Oh my god. Does Barley actually believe that most people are happy for women's spaces to be fully open to men? Does he or she really believe that GC people are in the minority? Bless. Be kind guys. Barley is going to find the wake up call quite difficult when he or she hears it.

Sorry, Whatiswrongwithmyknee, I keep trying to be kind like I'm supposed to, but then Barley starts up with the old inane shite and the Red Mist descends...

Christ you’re actually working through the LOJ playbook now, at least get some original false equivalences going.

Just reposting this from my earlier comment and wondering how you think this is going to play with the ‘younger generation of feminists GCs have failed to win over’:

In fact why don’t you read this thread about the horrific racist abuse FGM survivor and campaigner Jana Cornell receives from TRAs simply for using the word female within the context of FEMALE GENITAL MUTILATION:
panoramicgutterview.blogspot.com/2021/03/female-genital-mutilation-and-right.html?m=1

Or that Allison Bailey receives for standing up for women’s and lesbian’s rights.
twitter.com/BluskyeAllison/status/1480143656380252161

Or when it finally dawns on them that gender identity is wholly based on limiting sex stereotypes, that their identities, rights and experiences have been eroded, that they’ve been utterly gaslit and manipulated in order to validate a group of people who couldn’t give the slightest fuck about them.

And sorry but you can’t play the ‘moral panic over gay people’ card when your ideology seeks to erase same-sex attraction and coerce, pressure and shame lesbians into having sex with male bodies, gay men into having sex with female ones.

You need to do womaning better @completeginasaur - be kind to others (well, men) and stop having an opinion which others (well, men) don't like. You can trust men to judge whether your rights are being protected and it's really unkind of you to challenge their authority in this regard. Have you even given one thought to their self actualising? There really is no price too high for people (well, women) to pay for other people's (well, mens) self actualisation.

To my mind, the only way the Tories can get themselves out of their self made mess is to shine a light on gender woo woo in the Labour Party.

Or they could scrap their own proposals to the GRA and repair the damage they have done to Women's Rights. They can do this. They have an 80 seat majority in the HoC.