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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

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#CisIsNotASlur trending on Twitter

335 replies

Slythermum · 30/10/2021 14:52

I'm assuming through the garbled wordfuckery I'm seeing on twitter that this is people who don't understand language who are using that this is in response to:

a) The BBC article about Lesbians
b) Women objecting to the word "cis"
c) Shut up women
d) Dinosaurs
e) Shut up Lesbians
f) fannies

Meanwhile, my daughter has said girls in her class are saying "down with the cis bus" "cis people are evil", "cis should die" etc

OP posts:
SinoohXaenaHide · 30/10/2021 19:48

I am not cis because I do not have a gender identity that matches the gender people assume when looking at me. Because I have no gender identity. I am physically recognisable as a woman. I just have no gender identity. Calling me cis is misgendering me. Describing me as cis is insulting because of the implication that the speaker actually doesn't give a toss what my gender identity is, they just want me to shut up. It is therefore inherently belittling.

anon12345678901 · 30/10/2021 19:49

[quote Millicispud]@anon12345678901

No, they are women.

What their biological is only really matters of they come onto my ward.[/quote]
No they are trans women, so biologically male.

Sophoclesthefox · 30/10/2021 19:49

Ah, you’re funny, milli Grin

I’m not cis, because I don’t have a gender identity, so it can’t therefore accord to my sex. It happens in the same way that I’m an atheist, so forcing an identity on me according to a philosophical belief that I don’t hold is like trying to call me a Presbyterian atheist- it just doesn’t make any sense.

And that’s before you even have to grapple with the ideological flaw in the gender belief itself that “it is very important that people are permitted to define their own gender, and not have other people dictate or define it”- unless you’re a feminist gender atheist, it which case, you will be cis and damn well accept it! Other people know better than you!

Nonsense.

EishetChayil · 30/10/2021 19:50

I don't need a descriptor to state I'm not trans.

Just like I don't need one to state I'm not a pelican.

MajesticWhine · 30/10/2021 19:51

If gender is not connected to biology how does it either match or not match your sex?

Wildfart · 30/10/2021 19:53

It is funny seeing the maze they wander around in.

PrawnofthePatriarchy · 30/10/2021 19:53

It's weird being the only sane person in the thread.

Somehow I doubt anyone else shares your opinion.

Wildfart · 30/10/2021 19:53

That's not one they, it's many theys of course.

EishetChayil · 30/10/2021 19:54

Millicispud, you are talking such pure shite I am actually laughing out loud. Such utter, gaslighty, culty hogwash. It's almost a delight to see, if it weren't so damaging.

PrawnofthePatriarchy · 30/10/2021 19:55

I don't need a descriptor to state I'm not trans.

Just like I don't need one to state I'm not a pelican.

Well, exactly. Grin

Ihaventgottimeforthis · 30/10/2021 19:56

I was hoping milli might be the one to finally have a coherent definition for what a 'gender identity* is.
I guess for the purposes of conversing with people who are adamant I have a gender identity, despite me not recognising it or claiming it, I shall henceforth say I am technically trans.

Ihaventgottimeforthis · 30/10/2021 19:56

So calling me cis would definitely be a slur in that case.

Terfydactyl · 30/10/2021 19:58

Hence most labels are a "best fit" sorta fare
All the words in all the languages and the best that can be done is "sorta fit"

ChilliChaos · 30/10/2021 19:58

Having a gender identity is a personality trait - a minority of people make it the focus of themselves whereas I believe the majority of people don’t have the trait, or even if they do it’s not an important part of them.

Everyone has a sex though. Male or female. Observed and confirmed at birth

MonsignorMirth · 30/10/2021 19:58

[quote Millicispud]@MonsignorMirth

I know it's trans, I literally just said that earlier.
Keep up.[/quote]
Thank you for responding! So, as you say if your sex is female and your gender is woman, you are trans.

If your sex is female, and you have no gender, you are trans.

If your sex is female, and your gender is male, you are trans.

So what is cis again?

Wildfart · 30/10/2021 19:59

I'm genderfuck as I don't believe in gender restrictions so I am definitely trans.

AlfonsoTheUnrepetant · 30/10/2021 19:59

[quote Millicispud]@MrsTerryPratchett

Not irony at all, you claim to know all about gender, then start talking about gender expression and roles, two entirely separate things.

Gender is what you are, not what you do or where.[/quote]
You have it backwards: sex is what you are; gender is a cultural expression.

Sex in humans is immutable and invariable across time and cultures. Gender changes across time and place.

MonsignorMirth · 30/10/2021 20:00

@MonsignorMirth

Millicispud: If my sex is "female" and my gender is "woman", are these (a) different (as they are different words), making me trans, or (b) are they the same, making me not trans?

If you say that female (sex) and woman (gender) are in some way the same, can you explain how? What exactly is female about having a woman gender?
Or what is womanly about being female? Unless you're one of those people that think "woman = adult human female"?

(Just re-quoting the question I put to Milli, who replied 'I know it's trans').
Cailleach1 · 30/10/2021 20:04

@Millicispud

It's just a descriptor; do people really get bent out of shape by being called cis?

I'm cis, my partners are cis, almost all the women I know are cis.

It is a fake usage of chemistry terms to apply to a man or woman though. Only place it was every used was in reference to chemical bonds (cis and trans) before someone from a social science/Arts department appropriated the term.

Someone else could appropriate and incorrectly use a descriptor from another usage in the morning and it would have as much validity as a descriptor for a (in their own head) classification of man and woman. Systole and Diastole for example.

Wildfart · 30/10/2021 20:04

That's a great point Monsieur,
If woman is an identity then we are all trans indentifying.

Am I out of the maze?

Millicispud · 30/10/2021 20:06

@Forgotthebins

Sure thing

Sex and gender are often linked, the vast majority of men are male and women are female, but as we can see with trans people, it's not always the case.

Gender expression is just a matter of how you like to express your gender or whatnot. Realistically, it's kind of irrelevant most of the time, but some people find it food to dress up how they like and express their masculinity/femininity in a way that suits them.

Gender roles/stereotypes is all that sexist bunk were trying to move away from.
Stuff like only women can like cooking and sewing and only men can be truckers and what not.
Gender roles is sorta cultural sexism, the idea that your gender or sex registered at birth should determine the rest of your life.

Gender itself is different.
It's the personal sense of self, oftentimes this is matching the sex of the person.

AllTheUsernamesAreAlreadyTaken · 30/10/2021 20:08

Well this is fun.
Very “Through the looking glass”

“If I had a world of my own, everything would be nonsense. Nothing would be what it is, because everything would be what it isn't. And contrary wise, what is, it wouldn't be.”

NarcissistsEyebrows · 30/10/2021 20:08

Milli please answer the two questions I'm desperate to have answered.

What IS gender? How do I know what gender I am? Genuinely keen to see a proper resource which can help me with this as I don't have an innate male or female feeling.

I'm what way is a Transwoman a Woman? What do a Transwoman and a woman have in common, and a man and transman have in common, which a man and woman don't?

I would love to read a definition of what a 'woman' is too if you can stretch to a third.

These are really basic asks which underpin the whole thing, and reading this stuff over the last 2 years I have never once read a proper answer to these.

Whatwouldscullydo · 30/10/2021 20:09

Gender expression is just a matter of how you like to express your gender or whatnot. Realistically, it's kind of irrelevant most of the time, but some people find it food to dress up how they like and express their masculinity/femininity in a way that suits them

You still haven't explained gender identity though and how we all know of we have one or not?

Its not sex
Its not stereotypes

What is it?