Kathleen Stock has resigned

[nevernomore]

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/kathleen-stock-resigns-from-universuty-of-sussex-after-trans-rights-row-h0pns6lds

I wish she hadn't. Bullies should not be allowed to win. It just emboldens them.

As an aside did anyone enjoy the recent performance by the University of Sussex on University Challenge?
They lost to Birmingham by 235 points. In fact at one point in the game they had a score of minus 5.

Wasn’t it fantastic! Too much time on “ gender studies “ eh?

Lord Hunt (labour peer) will ask an oral question about Professor Kathleen Stock in the House of Lords Tues 16th November

Tweet
Philip Hunt
@LordPhilofBrum
I have an oral question tomorrow @UKHouseofLords on the terrible treatment of Professor Kathleen Stock @Docstockk at Sussex University @LabourLordsUK

Good to keep the Kathleen Stock story in the news. An awful cautionary tale of what can happen when the gender crowd get above themselves. Will be interested to hear the replies on this in the HOL.

Agree Prudence. Re replies, I'm hoping we don't get 'both sideism'

HoL starts at 2:30pm and it's the 3rd question

The link is here. parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/ece90084-ba21-4f3f-a0da-83f410e28bab

Oral questions: Investigation into the circumstances of the resignation of Professor Kathleen Stock from her post at the University of Sussex

Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Labour)

Thanks for the link. If anyone wants to watch or listen, but can't because you're at work, you can use the link to catch up later.

on now

QUESTION

Lord Hunt: KS villified by students, unsupported by union, let down by university. does she agree, however much legislation you have, you need some confidence in our universities to show some strength in defending our acadamics - what's the gov going to do?

RESPONSE
Baroness Barran: restriciton of speech goes against fundamental principles of HE. freedom of speech bill will strengthen and address the gaps that exist within the current law including the lack of a clear enforcement mechanism and that will bring with it clear consequences for providers and student unions who breach these new duties

some v. good questions and responses. Maya's case has come up!!

Baroness Jenkin Q: can you confirm beliefs are protected characteristics under EqA 2010 and it is unlawful for employers, service providers and coworkers to discriminate against or harrass their employees or customers simply for holding such beliefs?

Cashman being Cashman, urgh.

@FindTheTruth

Agree Prudence. Re replies, I'm hoping we don't get 'both sideism'

HoL starts at 2:30pm and it's the 3rd question

The link is here. parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/ece90084-ba21-4f3f-a0da-83f410e28bab

Oral questions: Investigation into the circumstances of the resignation of Professor Kathleen Stock from her post at the University of Sussex

Lord Hunt of Kings Heath (Labour)

I’m not sure if I really understand what I just watched as well as some do here but I definitely heard an complaint of awful things from ‘both sides’ in this situation be upheld.

I’m also not ok with the idea that Maya’s case doesn’t mean people must refer to trans people by their chosen pronouns in the workplace. Over and above Maya’s case compelled speech is illegal under the same laws as free speech is legal (from my understanding). And imho more importantly, kids need to be free to name what they know is fact/material reality, for the sake of safeguarding. It’s contradictory to teach kids to use accurate honest factual language and while insisting teachers use inaccurate language.

But I’ve only noticed snippets out of the whole thing so might not grasp this as well as others here would.

@RedDogsBeg

Cashman being Cashman, urgh.

He made it very clear his focus was on trans women. Wonder why that's his priority than say trans men?

Rhetorical question

@FindTheTruth

some v. good questions and responses. Maya's case has come up!!

Baroness Jenkin Q: can you confirm beliefs are protected characteristics under EqA 2010 and it is unlawful for employers, service providers and coworkers to discriminate against or harrass their employees or customers simply for holding such beliefs?

But apparently that doesn’t go as far as not disciplining them for using pronouns accurately?

It sounded like a trans person’s right to not be ‘misgendered’ came before right to hold gc beliefs, and right to freedom of expression surely too.

From what I understood.

Here is the link for those that missed it live, always a 10 minute time limit on these questions:

Agree Prudence. Re replies, I'm hoping we don't get 'both sideism'

Unsurprisingly, we did.

always a 10 minute time limit on these questions

New info

• There are MANY amendments to the Freedom of Speech Bill, in part due to Prof. Kathleen Stocks treatment

• the bill will address the gaps that exist within the current law including the lack of a clear enforcement mechanism and that will bring with it clear consequences for providers and student unions who breach these new duties

• Lord Cormack asked for SoS to write to all vice chancellors

• Baroness Morris - Q what can you do about harrassment of other named people now? A investigation on part of the office of students, consider number of amendments on the bill

Existing info confirmed

• belief in 'biological sex' is protected under the EqA thanks to Maya's case

Both points (1) the protection of academic freedom and (2) that having a belief in in biological sex (re Maya Case) is enshrined in law, were well covered.
Cashman came up with the usual stuff about trans people being vulnerable etc and described the GC position on biological sex as a "philosophical position", which always annoys me - dont these people base any of their opinions on science.
But the government has been asked to write to university VCs to make these positions clear and that lecturers shouldnt be harassed so I suppose thats better than nothing.

Just saw this...

"An investigation has been launched by a watchdog into the University of Sussex after an academic at the centre of a trans row was forced to quit.

"The inquiry by the Office for Students will look into whether the institution met its “obligations on academic freedom and freedom of speech”, Parliament was told"

www.gbnews.uk/news/kathleen-stock-university-to-be-investigated-after-trans-row-professor-forced-to-quit/159510

Hansard report here - hansard.parliament.uk/lords/2021-11-16/debates/FBF4A25A-0AE7-45C2-A525-D5649D96C543/ProfessorKathleenStockResignation

This both sideism statement from Baroness Garden (Lib Dem) is a disgrace:

There should be no place for the intemperate and divisive language that seems to have been a feature on both sides in this particular sad case.

Times article about inquiry:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/ab6dd0f8-472e-11ec-9969-911e63457092?shareToken=24da396aece7efeb7a06c7519986a340

@FindTheTruth

This both sideism statement from Baroness Garden (Lib Dem) is a disgrace:

There should be no place for the intemperate and divisive language that seems to have been a feature on both sides in this particular sad case.

Yes, this ^^

That’s what I meant up thread.

Is she saying Kathleen Stock said anything unreasonable? Because if she is why was that not challenged? Isn’t that libel or slander or something along those lines?

@BloodinGutters not only does Garden say that gender critical language is "intemperate and divisive language" but she's conflated death threats and material abuse (posters, smoke bombs, balaclava'd mobs) with 'views'.

thanks for the share token @Igneococcus. short and to the point. I wonder how long the investigation will take

The Office for Students (OfS) is an independent public body and regulator of HE in England. We are not part of central Government, but we report to Parliament through the Department for Education (DfE)

Senior team
www.officeforstudents.org.uk/about/who-we-are/our-senior-team/

OfS supporting LGBT
www.officeforstudents.org.uk/news-blog-and-events/blog/how-the-office-for-students-is-supporting-lgbtplus-students/

Interesting written evidence suggesting the OfS is SIMPLY NOT doing it's job to regulate freedom in Universities and questioning the 'political diversity' of the senior team.
committees.parliament.uk/writtenevidence/16097/html/

So if the OfS is not doing it's job then it's part of the problem in the first place. Marking it's own homework?