BBC responds to backlash to article about lesbians being pressured into sex by some trans women

[FindTheTruth]

BBC spokesperson said: “The article looks at a complex subject from different perspectives and acknowledges it is difficult to assess the extent of the issue.

“It includes testimony from a range of different sources and provides appropriate context. It went through our rigorous editorial processes.

“It is important that journalism looks at issues - even where there are strongly held positions. The BBC is here to ensure debate and to make sure a wide a range of voices are heard.”

attitude.co.uk/article/bbc-responds-to-backlash-to-article-about-lesbians-being-pressured-into-sex-by-some-trans-women-1/26090/

("TWAW in the same way that Far Right is Right?")

You'd have a hard job explaining to me why so many leading lights on your side of the argument like Peter Tatchell tend to be older - and men.

Unfortunately, there is also a group of trans allies who have, to say the least shown themselves to be of less than sterling character, Eric Joyce and Gordon Pike( one of the creators of the Scottish Prisons Policy on transgender prisoners) spring to mind.

Everybody was young once.

These bright young things are the out of touch dinosaurs of tomorrow with their own wrong think.

The point I'm getting at is times are changing. The attitudes that were acceptable 50 years ago just aren't accepted by today's younger generation.

50 years ago, when I was young, I was a bit of an idiot too. Now I’m older, I still espouse the sensible causes that I embraced in my youth, for example environmentalism and electoral reform. I’ve ditched my admiration for Timothy Leary and some marginally violent radical political groups.

We all have to grow up. Experience - particularly the reality of living life as a woman - is enlightening in so many ways.

MargaritaPie
"The point I'm getting at is times are changing. The attitudes that were acceptable 50 years ago just aren't accepted by today's younger generation."

Fifty years ago?

Like condemning homosexuality, threatening women who speak out and being overtly racist? Watching this lot is exactly like going back fifty years.

I saw a couple of trans activists (both of whom are older than I am) on twitter, mocking a mixed race women's rights protester for the colour of her skin after a demonstration in Edinburgh.

They (and the people who liked the comments) assumed her natural skin colour was fake tan and mocked her for it. I think it speaks to the whiteness of trans activism that they could see a mixed race woman and assume her skin colour wasn't real.

Isn’t it funny how Margarita Pie goes for the ageism card?

Do you forget what Frank Luntz discovered while he was here doing research just this year? That the 18-28 year old group are the LEAST tolerant of all age groups. Despite them thinking that they are the most tolerant.

I think Margarita you are so entrenched these days in your attempts to shame women on an anonymous forum, that you forget that many of the people you are attempting to shame and denigrate would have been very supporting of that ideological movement. Until we lived life and realised who the really marginalised people are- the women who can never speak up for many reasons.

And until we realized that actually the world doesn’t work like the magic idyll we thought it was. It is quite amazing how many experiences we have in common, the male doctors telling us our period symptoms are normal just get over it, the miraculous way jobs disappear or we are just plain old dismissed from them while pregnant, or that we just didn’t get that promotion because we were of ‘an age’.

Yeah, yeah Margarita.

Keep getting your opinions spoon fed from TRA twitter.

Dictatorial regimes which allowed "no debate" have also relied very heavily on the young to help in subjugating their people, Mao Zedong and Pol Pot amongst others are some examples.

Do you forget what Frank Luntz discovered while he was here doing research just this year? That the 18-28 year old group are the LEAST tolerant of all age groups.

Sometimes it really is like going backwards. Protesting women's meetings, targeting homosexuals, sending rape and death threats. And people like margarita pie totally blind to it happening. True, blind bigotry.

And of course, Margarita, you are fully aware that a well known TRA Kirsty Blackman is very tolerant and very much known for their being on the ‘right’ side. This is what you mean isn’t it?

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/owen-paterson-kirsty-blackman-tweet-b1952396.html

[quote Helleofabore]And of course, Margarita, you are fully aware that a well known TRA Kirsty Blackman is very tolerant and very much known for their being on the ‘right’ side. This is what you mean isn’t it?

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/owen-paterson-kirsty-blackman-tweet-b1952396.html[/quote]
Goodness. I think I remember the protesters outside the first conference for the new Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual Alliance posing proudly with her.

mobile.twitter.com/simonjedge/status/1452228971328851973

Some of her researchers are little angels too

Pie, you seem.to be aligned with some very dubious people.

@MargaritaPie

Since you've mentioned age (and I've seen another thread with a quote saying LGBA and T**Fs are old) I will say something I've observed.

The LGBA events and the conference- mostly middle-aged people, right? There was a photo on Twitter where one user commented "would be quicker to do a hair count than a head count".

Marion Millar and the people who turned up to support her in Glasgow- all mostly middle-aged people, right?

Graham Glinehan- in his mid-50s I believe.

Now think back to that LGBT event were someone wearing LGBA attire was not welcome. The crowd chanting "trans lives matter" at him so he would leave were all young people.

The students who protested against Kathleen Stock's employment. Young.

Think of pretty much anything Stonewall and there will be a mix of age-range including large numbers of young people (as opposed to dominantly old people).

The point I'm getting at is times are changing. The attitudes that were acceptable 50 years ago just aren't accepted by today's younger generation.

Yes, you would nearly think those people (with their lived experience and often decades working in safeguarding roles) saw real risks in allowing people to self identify as women to enter spaces where women are vulnerable. Saw real risks in rigidly enforcing gender stereotypes so people feel compelled to try to be 'other', rather than challenging toxic views on what it means to be a man or woman.

When I was twenty I couldn't have imagined being 40 something either yet here I am. We all get older, if we're spared. You should be ashamed of your overt ageism but instead you're wearing it like a cloak. 'Check your privilege'.

It's the exact same thing over and over again though isn't it.

Girls and young women thinking that the world is now a safe equal place because that's what we try to give them - and also trying to identify out of any thing they don't like (eg "I'm not like the other girls").

Then growing up and seeing that the world is still as sexist as it ever was, and of course you're not really going to fix that within, what, 50 or 60 years?

Lots of us only became feminists as we grew older and saw it all, while becoming more empowered with age and not giving a shit about what people think of us anymore.

This is the same.

"you think so many young men are attracted to protesting against women's sex-based rights. Certainly, most of the 'protesters' I've seen at these anti-women protests have been male. Often young men"

I didn't say young men, I said young people. There are plenty young men and women who support Stonewall and oppose the likes of LGBA. I've seen a number of middle-aged and old men support the LGBA too.

I came across a video by the new Green Party leader and she says it better than I could regarding the LGBA. They don't exist to help LGB people, they exist to oppose trans people and to oppose LGBT organisations who help transpeople.

Lol the LGBA really petrify some people don't they. They show the whole thing up.

Yes. It's wonderful - proof that they're having an impact.

@Datun

Lol the LGBA really petrify some people don't they. They show the whole thing up.

Yes, they really do. Because you can't point and laugh at the LGBA as a bunch of crazy lunatics like most people do with the BNP or 'Muslamic Ray gun' EDL types. The LGBA is made up of lesbian and gay people, some of whom were involved in Stonewall for years, others who have years of safeguarding experience behind them. They are a totally reasonable and legitimate group.

It's why the likes of Owen Jones and Katy Montgomerie have to resort to taking the piss out of the LGBA conference disco.

I don't think I have ever seen anyone as petrified of a group and so determined to silence it, as people are of LGBA.

On the age thing, I would totally have been 'TWAW, those older people who are objecting to this are just stale bigots' when I was at university. Now that I have a hell of a lot more life experience, both personally and professionally, I feel very differently. Funny that....

On the age thing, I would totally have been 'TWAW, those older people who are objecting to this are just stale bigots' when I was at university. Now that I have a hell of a lot more life experience, both personally and professionally, I feel very differently. Funny that....

I was TWAW at that life stage. I joined MN when I was 21, and there will be posts from me under previous names explaining that cis was just a word we should use about ourselves to avoid othering transwomen.

I grew out of it all.

I think that Margarita is once again trying to deflect from their outrageous rape apology of a post up thread.
This article was a report on a very serious issue, the rape and sexual coercion of lesbians by some biological males who identify as women.
The BBC stands by its report and good for them. Those who condemn this report are doing so because it reflects badly on a particular group of males. The same rationale of" don't rock the boat" was used in the Catholic Church, Rotherham and countless other organisations, and countless women and children suffered as a result. So Margarita, I ask you once again, how many raped women is enough for the BBC to report it?

how many raped women is enough for the BBC to report it?

Isn't this why some people had a problem with the article? The named person they interviewed about the cotton ceiling was someone who had actually sexually assaulted women herself. It just didn't sit right.

Isn't this why some people had a problem with the article? The named person they interviewed about the cotton ceiling was someone who had actually sexually assaulted women herself. It just didn't sit right.

This person was named to explain the term" cotton ceiling "and it's background. The reports of other lesbians raped or sexually coerced had nothing to do with it. So how many lesbians raped by biological males do you think are necessary for people to talk about it in the main stream media? 2, 200, 2000, more? Or do you believe like others complaining about this report that women should just shut up and get on with it as it is more important not to tarnish the reputation of one group because of a few bad eggs?
After all that is what they did in the Catholic Church and elsewhere.

@Journeyofthedragons

how many raped women is enough for the BBC to report it?

Isn't this why some people had a problem with the article? The named person they interviewed about the cotton ceiling was someone who had actually sexually assaulted women herself. It just didn't sit right.

LC has now been excised from the article's explanation of the term's origins as if she had never existed. It's very Stalinesque.

Are we now allowed to discuss the ongoing situation of an oppressive subculture in which young women are made to feel morally at fault for not having sex they don't want to have?

The ‘old people=bad’ and ‘young people=good’ is such a Whiggish interpretation of history, which is very
ahistorical in my view. History hasn’t been a constant march of progress. Think about the European witch hunts. The generation before the witch hunters saw ‘witches’ as a bit odd/eccentric/people to keep on the right side of. Even earlier than that the Church was trying to convince ‘witches’ and those who believed they were witches that their superstitions were false. I’d say these were more reasonable views then “burn the witch!”