BBC responds to backlash to article about lesbians being pressured into sex by some trans women

[FindTheTruth]

BBC spokesperson said: “The article looks at a complex subject from different perspectives and acknowledges it is difficult to assess the extent of the issue.

“It includes testimony from a range of different sources and provides appropriate context. It went through our rigorous editorial processes.

“It is important that journalism looks at issues - even where there are strongly held positions. The BBC is here to ensure debate and to make sure a wide a range of voices are heard.”

attitude.co.uk/article/bbc-responds-to-backlash-to-article-about-lesbians-being-pressured-into-sex-by-some-trans-women-1/26090/

Could you just say the name? I'm afraid I'm not very familiar with the Girl Guides transgender policy

GG policy has been Stonewalled to admit boys who identify as girls into the GG. They're to share the same sex designated shower, change, wash, and sleeping facilities, and staff are not permitted to inform parents that their daughters will be going on a mixed sex excursion. Staff who raised concerns about this have been expelled from GG.
Any female GGs who identify as boys will be edged out of the GG.

Before anyone cries "yea well Scouts is mixed" yea, well girl Scouts are not sleeping in the same dorm or showering with the boy Scouts, and no one is being forced to pretend they boy scouts are really girls.

Whatever happened to prominent TRA Jane Fae anyway? They aren't so visible these days. The BBC used to love JF. They were a go-to with all that knitting on screen, how very harmless and quaint.

(lurkers)

I thought the BBC had removed the survey from the story, but the version I just read had no Lily Cade but the stats back in.

And yes LC said some appalling things, and was rightly removed from the article.

It stands without her, though.

I am happy to announce that with those criteria Owen Jones is GC as well.

It seems once it gets down to sex, most people are GC.

Oh wow, Owen Jones is GC. Radical gender critical?

This all reminds me of some Americans discomfort with the truth of a black man, Obama being president. He had a Kenyan father and lived in Indonesia as a small boy. So the “birther” group tried to say he wasn’t born in Hawaii, part of the US, but Abroad.
But their theory was completely irrelevant because Barack’s mum was a US citizen. None of the quibbling made a difference to a black man being the legitimate president.

Eresh, I am not sure about radical gender critical. But as a poster here tells us that “genital preferences”, which Cade has, means that you are GC, Owen Jones is definitely GC.

I shouldn't perhaps do this but I messaged a member of a band who identify as an all women LGBTQ+ band (4 women and one man who identifies as a woman). Amongst other things I asked -

"Just please explain to me how someone can claim to be same sex attracted and sleep with someone of the opposite biological sex? Explain how a lesbian can have a penis"

The response "Same way they use a strap on babe"

That is the closest I got to a rational argument from them.

Christ alive, what is that? And more importantly, who are all the lunatics fawning over them and their fetish pictures?

BBC young staffers complaining:

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/914760dc-3e31-11ec-9bef-aa3112940013?shareToken=44c4dd51cdc47c230891cb98e092c9f0

"Senior sources believe the issues should be tackled without fear or favour, while more junior members of staff think there have been missteps in reporting and transgender people are being unfairly targeted. “The fact is, LGBT colleagues skew younger and gender critical ones skew older. That matches with population,” observed one young employee."

Young person: "this is just the old people being old".

How do they know what the age split is? It seems likely that younger women are more likely to be affected by peer pressure and coercion as their careers are less established and they haven't been exposed to as much misogynist wankery. This sounds like a very anti-women group, and it would be an exceptionally bold young woman who didn't play nice. Or did the group hold a secret ballot? If not, the claim has zero credibility.

Since you've mentioned age (and I've seen another thread with a quote saying LGBA and T**Fs are old) I will say something I've observed.

The LGBA events and the conference- mostly middle-aged people, right? There was a photo on Twitter where one user commented "would be quicker to do a hair count than a head count".

Marion Millar and the people who turned up to support her in Glasgow- all mostly middle-aged people, right?

Graham Glinehan- in his mid-50s I believe.

Now think back to that LGBT event were someone wearing LGBA attire was not welcome. The crowd chanting "trans lives matter" at him so he would leave were all young people.

The students who protested against Kathleen Stock's employment. Young.

Think of pretty much anything Stonewall and there will be a mix of age-range including large numbers of young people (as opposed to dominantly old people).

The point I'm getting at is times are changing. The attitudes that were acceptable 50 years ago just aren't accepted by today's younger generation.

@MargaritaPie

Wow, it takes a special kind of ageism and racism to render invisible leading figures in the gender critical movement.

Do you actually think that eg Keira Bell or Raquel Rosario Sanchez count as old?

Or is it just that your racism and ageism means you ignore their existence because it doesn't fit your pet theory?

Yes, some younger people - particularly young men - support theories that allow them to punch down at older women. And yes, there's nothing like experiencing misogyny based on one's biological sex such as discrimination due to pregnancy or maternity to make one realise that biological sex matters, which very young women are less likely to have experienced yet.

But the idea that it is a battle of young v old sounds a lot like David Lammy and his 'dinosaurs' comment - and we all know how successful that was as a form of attack.

You'd have a hard job explaining to me why so many leading lights on your side of the argument like Peter Tatchell tend to be older - and men.

Why is that? And how do they fit into your nice little battle of the 'virtuous' young versus the 'past it' older generation?

@MargaritaPie

I'd be interested in hearing from you why you think so many young men are attracted to protesting against women's sex-based rights. Certainly, most of the 'protesters' I've seen at these anti-women protests have been male. Often young men.

Why do you think that is? A regressive movement of male privilege attacking 'uppity women? A bunch of incels? Age-old misogyny that never changes? Witch-hunting? 'Mommy issues'?

I find it sad. It does feel like a reaction. Just as MeToo etc were leading towards a greater respect for women's rights, the men's rights activists found a new dressing for their cudgels to continue their age-old fight against women's rights.

Gosh, this “next generation editorial group” comparing homosexuality to racism?

So progressive.

Do you actually think that eg Keira Bell or Raquel Rosario Sanchez count as old?

To MargaritaPie they probably are!

Anecdotal I know but my son who's at university (therefore young, Margarita), is very gender critical and so are many of his friends. They have a number of (male, mathematician/computer scientist/physicist) friends who say they are trans so don't say anything about their actual thoughts on the matter except with people who they know well.

I think there is a large, silent majority, even among the young, who know perfectly well that men are not women and are mostly rolling their eyes at all the demands, but not pushing back.

I suspect the lack of objection is partly because they don’t see the harm it’s causing, and in some cases is out of fear of the backlash/ loss of friends if they do voice their opinions.

Some evidence of this does exist. For example, even at Edinburgh University (allegedly at the forefront of transactivism) when pronoun badges were offered at Freshers’ week, the vast majority indicated they were not in favour of them.

I am glad the BBC are continuing to hold out, thus far. They have, of course, created a problem for themselves, having made no attempt to provide a balanced perspective on this topic. Now they have to row back from that position, and there will be strenuous attempts to prevent that happening. The next weeks and months could be very unpleasant indeed.

Young staffers at the BBC want section 28 back. Ban any news on lesbians who don't want to sleep with males.

“Would we write a story about people who don’t want to sleep with black people?” asked one employee

Same-sex attraction is 'racist'. Ban heretics from the news.

Repent. Stop justifying same-sex attraction. Listen to our fundamentalism.

Stop justifying things when it gets things wrong. Listen about how it got it wrong. And seek outside advice when it doesn’t know something.”

“Would we write a story about people who don’t want to sleep with black people?” asked one employee

So then they thought that story was about lesbians not wanting to sleep with transwomen?

Ugh. But then I guess that’s how all the TRAs interpreted it. A remarkable blind spot.

And a double and triple ugh for the racism. How do they not hear how damn racist they are?

@allmywhat

“Would we write a story about people who don’t want to sleep with black people?” asked one employee

So then they thought that story was about lesbians not wanting to sleep with transwomen?

Ugh. But then I guess that’s how all the TRAs interpreted it. A remarkable blind spot.

And a double and triple ugh for the racism. How do they not hear how damn racist they are?

Indeed. They're just confirming the lesbians' testimony!

Absolute numpties. So glad it's being reported.

The Times has seen a partial transcript from a “next generation editorial group” meeting, a forum in which young employees can speak to top news executives about workplace issues.

I wonder who leaked the transcript. And I wonder if the 'next generation' group will complain. I hope so.

“Would we write a story about people who don’t want to sleep with black people?” asked one employee

Would we write a story about Asian gangs in Rotherham preying on thousands of white girls?

@MargaritaPie
"The point I'm getting at is times are changing. The attitudes that were acceptable 50 years ago just aren't accepted by today's younger generation."

Ah, the good old logical fallacy that youngsters know best...
It's not as if young people had a tendency to group think, and occasionally getting recruited into dangerously reactionary ideologies, am I right? cough Islamic State cough Hitler Youth cough

Note: this is not to say that genderism = fascism (although it's tempting...)
Just a reductio ad absurdum: the young are, provably, not always on the Right Side of History... unless by "Right", we also mean "Far Right"?... Hmm...