Do we have it anywhere on record that Stonewall does/does not support people to express their sexuality as exclusively homosexual?

[JustcameoutGC]

The expectation that lesbians accept partners with penises was one of the things that really made me start questioning gender identity politics more closely.

Exclusively homosexual lesbian spaces have disappeared as viewed to be transphobic. Just look on any lesbian dating apps and many of the users are male and be-penised. Some may be fine with this, but all of my lesbian friends are not, and they feel very disenfranchised, but equally they feel unable to speak out. Just look at what happened in Manchester.

I just can't wrap my head around how the prevoiusly stalwart and highly effective champion of gay rights has now essentially outlawed exclusive homosexuality.

Have they made any statements that make this stance clear? Have they actively said they do not support exclusively homosexual spaces?

[quote PurgatoryOfPotholes]but to say it is a widespread problem is to demonise a whole group as entitled shits

The group being... males? How dare feminists impugn our society, eh?

extract

New Study:'I thought it was just a part of life'
Understanding the Scale of Violence
Committed Against Women
in the UK Since Birth

Over 22,000 UK women told VictimFocus about their experiences of violence and abuse.

This dataset is the largest and most comprehensive record of violence committed against women and girls in the UK.

99.7% of our sample had been repeatedly subjected to violence including assaults, harassment and rape.

Only 0.3% of women had only been subjected to one violent incident or less.

Our initial findings in this report suggest that current statistics of the prevalence of violence against women have been underestimated for decades, and instead, it is likely that every woman and girl will be subjected to violence, abuse, rape or harassment. In the vast majority of cases reported here, women were subjected to multiple crimes and the perpetrators were overwhelmingly male

www.victimfocus.org.uk/womens_experiences_violence_abuse_study[/quote]
Sounds about right to me, every woman I know has has experienced a least one of the three, including me.

What's the forum, Bilinda?

@BilindaB

I also read Medium, which has a lot of content from trans people.

I'm also on a forum with lots of trans people.

Yes.... I can imagine you are on a list with lots of trans people. It is quite interesting to see concepts like males being magically changed into females using a machine. I have only seen that floated by two previous posters.

.... I imagine it gets 'floated' a great deal in forums for trans people.

The other thing that wouldn't get changed in that magical machine, is probably misogyny. That is a trait that never seems to change once it has developed, and it develops very early in some males.

@ArabellaScott

What's the forum, Bilinda?

That will have to remain a secret.

Right. Secret sources aren't all that helpful, though, in this context.

Do you ever read any feminist content? For example, the content that might drip-feed concepts like "people's clothing does not justify hurting them, take responsibility for your hands" and "rape is a massive off-the-charts problem".

What about watching the late Magdalen Burns? Her videos are still on youtube. Or Arielle Scarcella.

''The other thing that wouldn't get changed in that magical machine, is probably misogyny. That is a trait that never seems to change once it has developed, and it develops very early in some males.''

Quite possibly!

So just to clarify BilindaB's views -

The many anecdotal accounts (and a report from Get the L Out) about lesbians experiencing coersion to accept transwomen as sexual partners are unreliable and in fact are part of a lie made up by GC feminists. There are 6 transwomen active on Twitter who say that coersion is not happening so that means it isn't.

Lesbians can say that they do not want to sleep with transwomen but cannot say that this is because they are same sex attracted, because this is hurtful and bigoted.

Lesbians can have their own single sex spaces but organisations set up to facilitate this are hate groups and should be removed from LGBT marches and other events. In fact, a trans specific sign or t-shirt is fine but not one with the name of a reputable (as confirmed by the Charity Commision) charity.

By BilindaB's reckoning, there are only 3000 active GC feminists in the UK but those 3000 have somehow 'whipped up a scare story' despite being heavily censored by media outlets and social media platforms.

Sounds about right to me, every woman I know has has experienced a least one of the three, including me.

So why are you merrily assuring us that everyone is sickened by the idea of sex without enthusiastic consent, so all trans people must be too?

Flying flamingos, join the dots, please.

@PurgatoryOfPotholes

Do you ever read any feminist content? For example, the content that might drip-feed concepts like "people's clothing does not justify hurting them, take responsibility for your hands" and "rape is a massive off-the-charts problem".

What about watching the late Magdalen Burns? Her videos are still on youtube. Or Arielle Scarcella.

I've read feminist literature all my life. These days it's mostly online feminism (not here). I've watched both Magdalen Burns and Arielle Scarcella, not a fan of either. At least Magdalen was sincere, Scarcella I suspect is a grifter.

@ArabellaScott

What's the forum, Bilinda?

I hope Bilinda it is a forum where trans people discuss positive ways to support lesbians and their rights to speak out against those 'extremists' that you mentioned before. Maybe when you are there, you should mention that lesbians have in fact shown proof of their abuse and coercion so, you know, it is actually happening and since it is just a small group doing it, it would not require much effort to show 'vast majority' support for lesbians and get that group to stop the abuse.

I do feel like I had this conversation with a PP back during Lesbian week, was it you? If so, I am sure both lesbians and gay men would appreciate trans people not looking the other way while they are attacked. I cannot speak for them, but every little bit helps.

@ArabellaScott

Right. Secret sources aren't all that helpful, though, in this context.

That did give me a chuckle!

''Lesbians can say that they do not want to sleep with transwomen but cannot say that this is because they are same sex attracted, because this is hurtful and bigoted.''

You're thinking of another poster with that charge.

So I am guessing that those lots of trans people on this secret forum that BilindaB is part of regularly and routinely speak out against the extremist TRAs, that BilindaB has acknowledged exist, and routinely and regularly speak up for lesbians and their right to be exclusively same sex attracted and their right to have dating apps and spaces exclusively for themselves.

I am sure we will be treated to the evidence of this as it is such a cornerstone of BilindaB's case.

''I hope Bilinda it is a forum where trans people discuss positive ways to support lesbians and their rights to speak out against those 'extremists' that you mentioned before. Maybe when you are there, you should mention that lesbians have in fact shown proof of their abuse and coercion so, you know, it is actually happening and since it is just a small group doing it, it would not require much effort to show 'vast majority' support for lesbians and get that group to stop the abuse.

I do feel like I had this conversation with a PP back during Lesbian week, was it you? If so, I am sure both lesbians and gay men would appreciate trans people not looking the other way while they are attacked. I cannot speak for them, but every little bit helps.''

I'll see what I can do.

I'm also on a forum with lots of trans people.

Uh-huh. This is THE most surprising thing I have read today.

I see a few old favourites on that list that you have posted Bilinda, I definitely remember previous posts by another poster who felt that Contra and Montgomery were worth quoting as appeals to authority.

Their posts never quite managed to prove what they thought they proved though...

Perhaps it is a pattern. Coming from your forum, of course....

Ever watch any of these accounts, Bilinda?

Rose of Dawn
Miranda Yardley (incl Fionne Orlander)
Blair White

You may enjoy.

@Datun

Bilinda

Women are fighting for their rights and those of their children to legal boundaries, equitable adult political representation, and the very concept of women as a sex class.

And you're countering it with a fictitious chromosome machine and gravy boats.

1000%.

@ArabellaScott

Ever watch any of these accounts, Bilinda?

Rose of Dawn
Miranda Yardley (incl Fionne Orlander)
Blair White

You may enjoy.

I've seen one Rose Of Dawn but ca't remember. I'll check out Miranda Yardley. Blair White is mostly awful (although she did a good job skewering that sick predator Yaniv)

By BilindaB's reckoning, there are only 3000 active GC feminists in the UK but those 3000 have somehow 'whipped up a scare story' despite being heavily censored by media outlets and social media.

Is it also just 3000 actively misogynist men repeatedly subjecting 99.7% of girls and women to violence, too, maybe?

Regarding Miranda Yardley.

So, prominent transwoman and author Julia Serano said this.

if it were only a small percentage of cis dykes who were not interested in trans women at all, I would write it off as simply a matter of personal preference. But this not a minor problem—it is systemic; it is a predominant sentiment in queer women’s communities. And when the overwhelming majority of cis dykes date and fuck cis women, but are not open to, or are even turned off by, the idea of dating or fucking trans women, how is that not transphobic? And to those cis women who claim a dyke identity, yet consider trans men, but not trans women, to be a part of your dating pool, let me ask you this: How are you not a hypocrite?”

www.thedailybeast.com/the-struggle-to-find-trans-love-in-san-francisco

This is Serano being upset that lesbians are not trans-exclusionary, because many do not "discount" biologically female trans as dating options, but they do discount Julia. Julia is not upset for the lesbians. Julia is upset for Julia.

Serano needs to be told to get over it, and Miranda Yardley does just that here. Miranda also explains that the oppression of lesbians is truly real with citations.

mirandayardley.com/en/girl-dick-the-cotton-ceiling-and-the-cultural-war-on-lesbians-girls-and-women/

"I'm also on a forum with lots of trans people."

And the really good thing about the internet is that nobody lies and everyone is always who they say they are.

'If it were only a small percentage of cis dykes who were not interested in trans women at all, I would write it off as simply a matter of personal preference. But this not a minor problem—it is systemic; it is a predominant sentiment in queer women’s communities. And when the overwhelming majority of cis dykes date and fuck cis women, but are not open to, or are even turned off by, the idea of dating or fucking trans women, how is that not transphobic? And to those cis women who claim a dyke identity, yet consider trans men, but not trans women, to be a part of your dating pool, let me ask you this: How are you not a hypocrite?”

Yeah that's a load of shit.

@BilindaB

'If it were only a small percentage of cis dykes who were not interested in trans women at all, I would write it off as simply a matter of personal preference. But this not a minor problem—it is systemic; it is a predominant sentiment in queer women’s communities. And when the overwhelming majority of cis dykes date and fuck cis women, but are not open to, or are even turned off by, the idea of dating or fucking trans women, how is that not transphobic? And to those cis women who claim a dyke identity, yet consider trans men, but not trans women, to be a part of your dating pool, let me ask you this: How are you not a hypocrite?”

Yeah that's a load of shit.

But you said this previously -

'Without hard evidence, not a few anecdotal stories from unreliable sources, I will go with what I think most likely, n as I first said, relegate this accusation to another scare story whipped up by GC to smear trans people.'

Do you now concede that it is not a 'scare story whipped by GC' or do you stand by that statement? It's not anecdotal, unreliable evidence. That is a quote from an article, written by a transwoman. A prominent one at that.