Gay men being subject to abuse for their sexuality

[secular111]

Or Homophobia as we know it.

The belief that the trans-activists would stop by just attacking lesbians turns out to have been a miscalculation; gay men are a target now, and the community is only just starting to wake-up to the threat it is facing.

Woke Homophobia

@secular111

Or Homophobia as we know it.

The belief that the trans-activists would stop by just attacking lesbians turns out to have been a miscalculation; gay men are a target now, and the community is only just starting to wake-up to the threat it is facing.

Woke Homophobia

Horrific examples in that link OP ! many of them are anonymous, so I wonder what percentage are male??, what percentage are russian trolls?? and what percentage are real trans men???. Obvs. there are examples of some publicly being abusive to gay men but I've seen more examples of trans men not speaking up, being talked over and silenced by the males. And speaking up the differences between gender dysphoria and Auto G's (which I suspect many anonymous trolls are)

Gay men talking about the homophobia: "The more we speak out, the braver others will become to do the same. To any gay men watching this who share the same concerns - get in touch. It's time to speak up together against this new form of homophobia, as women have been doing for years. Let's show'em we've got this too 💪"

It's noticeable the massive increase in gay men protesting about this. One of my friends has actually apologised for not realising the seriousness of what I've been talking about in recent years. Now it's hit the gay men's community he finally gets the issue.

@FloralBunting

I note on this topic that we often get a 'You can just turn them down' when the issue of opposite sex people propositioning lesbians and gay men, but if you do employ a 'no thank you', the shaming attempts really kick in.

To be fair, that is the standard male attitude to being turned down. So transwomen are simply exhibiting typical male behaviour. What is less usual is women (transmen) exhibiting this behaviour which is why gay men probay felt safe.

@BluebirdsSong

Do you think trans people are in fact interested in dating transphobic bigots?

Anyone in particular you're refering to here? There's no transphobic bigots here that I've seen. Just robust debate and conversation. Which may not suit your need for safe spaces and limited topics of pre approved conversation I suspect.

I've spoken face to face to Transmen who talk disparagingly about the gay men who reject them. The TMs in question were also religious so the power dynamic was very much in their favour when they castigated homosexuality.

To be fair, that is the standard male attitude to being turned down. So transwomen are simply exhibiting typical male behaviour. What is less usual is women (transmen) exhibiting this behaviour which is why gay men probay felt safe

Yes I would agree with that.

There's no transphobic bigots here that I've seen. Just robust debate and conversation. Which may not suit your need for safe spaces and limited topics of pre approved conversation I suspect.

I think megamind here is suggesting that rejecting the opposite sex if you're homosexual is transphobic bigotry and that their response is 'Wouldn't want to shag you anyway!'

Like lesbians have never heard that from men they've turned down before.

Well it would make sense for a translesbians to have a relationship with a translesbian if they want to be with someone who outwardly presents as female.

Or homogenderal straight and bi women. And 'pan' women.

The homophobic conservative Christians like Ben Shapiro or Matt Walsh have become brave gender critical, feminist allies

I think for Americans this has become a sort of gotcha. I don’t know who these people are, but presumably Republican, Conservative Americans.

What American posters don’t get is that the rest of the world isn’t as blindly tribalistic as Americans are. It’s actually very cognitively lazy and somewhat immature. The rest of us aren’t generally wedded to our political affiliations to the extent that it becomes part of our identity. The rest of us are capable of nuance.

Protection of female spaces, women’s sport and protection of children - currently mainly girls - from experimental treatment is the hill I’ll die on. I am generally lefty but I’ll vote for any politician who stands up against the TRAs

@MrsOvertonsWindow

It's noticeable the massive increase in gay men protesting about this. One of my friends has actually apologised for not realising the seriousness of what I've been talking about in recent years. Now it's hit the gay men's community he finally gets the issue.

Which goes to show; pressuring women for 'gatekeeping their vaginas' and expecting women not to 'selfishly prioritise their orgasms' over providing sex to male born people who wish it is still, underneath, a totally socially acceptable, normal belief in our society.

When men start to be pressured to lay back and think of their social duty people start to be horrified.

It's taken bloody decades for me to realise what a very serious problem women have in society. The supposed veneer of 'women's rights have been won' is so insubstantial that no one's cared that it's been broken in the past few years.

@MrsOvertonsWindow

It's noticeable the massive increase in gay men protesting about this. One of my friends has actually apologised for not realising the seriousness of what I've been talking about in recent years. Now it's hit the gay men's community he finally gets the issue.

Really interesting that your friend apologised Overton. did he say anything else?

It's taken gay men a while but at least they're slowly waking up. Not sure if they've fully woken up yet but it's getting there.

It’s not phobic not to fancy someone.

I’m pretty sure the men who don’t fancy me don’t actually hate me.

Trans lesbians are trans women attracted to women, which includes other trans women.

Transwomen aren't women. Adult human females are women.

From what I've seen trans people aren't exactly excited to date transphobes.

Oh I don't know. This lot seem keen. weirdos

if you do employ a 'no thank you', the shaming attempts really kick in.

Quite. As Tibtom says; this is standard. I've had responses that range from 'what a shame' to 'I bet I could turn you straight/you just need a good seeing to' when I've said no thank you to a proposition from a man and explained I'm lesbian. The basic foundation of it is still really that I'm a walking service unit for male people and it's not acceptable for me to refuse to service on demand.

My feelings, preferences, inner life, enjoyment of sex - just don't really exist in the equation. As Rachel McKinnon (as called at the time) explained on radio, lesbians could 'learn to cope' with providing sex to a natal male person if they just tried.

Because actually enjoying sex and consent and choice and indentity isn't for mere females. They have a social duty.

And no one has the faintest problem knowing who has that social duty and doesn't get to argue about it, and who is allowed to say wtaf? Are you kidding me?

"the world isn’t as blindly tribalistic as Americans are. It’s actually very cognitively lazy and somewhat immature. The rest of us aren’t generally wedded to our political affiliations to the extent that it becomes part of our identity. The rest of us are capable of nuance."

Artichoke 👍

@ScreamingBeans

From what I've seen trans people aren't exactly excited to date transphobes.

Oh I don't know. This lot seem keen. weirdos

That's pretty grim. Looks like our teen visitor is misinformed on this one.

The abuse of gay men not accepting trans men seems to be mostly coming from trans men themselves, from what I have seen online. Is that generally the case?

Anyway, I was thinking this is going to become more of an issue with the percentage increase in girls identifying as TM are "coming of age" and getting older. Surrounded by the belief that they are men, validated and encouraged by their peers, and possibly fuelled by testosterone, I think it's going to get even uglier. Especially as gay men will have no qualms about pushing back robustly.

• @nolongersurprised 👍

Completely agree it's cognitively lazy and immature to brand lesbians and gays far right bigots, simply for being who we are. We're not dealing with very bright people though are we?

My son came out as gay at 15. No problem. He has now said that he will also sleep with someone with a vagina. But he's not bisexual. He will only sleep with a vagina-haver that thinks they are a man or are non-binary. I have no idea why that vagina would be different from one on someone that is a woman. 🤷‍♀️ He is very into self identity though. As soon as someone says they are something then they are. He says he's non binary as he doesn't "feel" like a man. I told him most people don't feel like a woman/man, I don't. But that makes me nonbinary too, he said. Yay for me! I can claim to be queer and The Most Oppressed now.

Trans lesbians are trans women attracted to women, which includes other trans women

A lesbian isn't attracted to penis. Otherwise she's not a lesbian. So saying a transwoman lesbian is attracted to other transwomen is factually incorrect.

Ben Shapiro is a very right wing provocateur. He is also an Orthodox Jew, a victim of anti-semitism and is married to a woman or Moroccan heritage. Not all people are the same.

We're not dealing with very bright people though are we?

It’s very strange how being accused on here of, say, right-ring evangelical beliefs by (presumably) American posters is supposed to lead to some sort of epiphanic change of mind.

I don’t give a fuck which group of Americans share my concerns. I’m not American and I don’t know all these people that posters keep trotting out as “gotchas”.

I can disagree about lesbians being coerced into dealing with “female penises” and also be supportive of access to abortions. I don’t give a shit about how this would be viewed in the US. The only impression I get from these posters is that everyone there must be a bit hard of thinking - everything my group says is does is good and everything the other group does is bad. It’s like friendship groups in primary school.

Rant over...

Malcolm Clark - gay man, is aware . . .

Malcolm Clark @TwisterFilm
1./ What's the link between this appalling French scandal, a monkey in a kid's library and the most recent hounding of @jk_rowling? All are connected by the mish mash of undigested ideas that drives so much of today's LGBTQ+ movement: Queer Theory
twitter.com/TwisterFilm/status/1418383530325954567

I wonder if a Venn diagram will be provided to accompany the permitted and correct areas where abuse isn't abuse and phobic isn't phobic? Being facetious, if in doubt.