Employee using pronouns. Help!

[OfNobody]

Hi all,

A friend of mine has just taken on a new recruit and he's just realised that she uses pronouns after her name on her email signature.

He'd love for her not to do that because he's GC himself (and has a very traditional client base) but can he ask her to stop? Is that in itself discrimination?

Would love to advise him but generally, all the work issues I see around this run in the opposite direction (employers asking employees for pronouns).

Any experience of this, or any insight into how he can politely request that she drop the pronouns without ending up on the front cover of The Guardian?

From what he said, she doesn't sound like a massive raging handmaiden. She's just fresh out of uni and obviously thinks this is the way to go.

Great suggestions everyone. This is really useful.

I knew I could count on MN

@MotherOffCod

“ Pronouns in email signatures are unprofessional, politically motivated and inappropriate “

This statement is completely out of step with the real world of work right now.

It seems very wrong to see so many posters actively encouraging bias against anyone using a pronoun in their email sig.

It’s a thing, and lots and lots of companies and individuals are happy with it, and welcome it.

Get over it, or go complain about it on the sex and gender board (at time of posting this thread is in feminism chat).

I'm a manager and I'd say that to anyone in my team who did this. And don't tell me which bit of feminism I can post in.

@Albien

Why would being gender critical make you object to people including their pronouns in an email if they want to? Because it makes you and your company look like woke twats and creates a bad impression for customers. I think it’s sufficient to say this is the company email footer, please refrain from adding any extras.

But you can’t force everyone else to be gender critical. You wouldn’t want to work somewhere where you were compelled to add pronouns so the opposite - being compelled to remove them - is just as bad.

She really isn't harming anyone by doing this and people saying she will harm the business by doing it have absolutely no basis for saying it. Just an automatic kick back against anything that threatens your world view isn't it

But you can’t force everyone else to be gender critical
No, but I can decide how my company presents itself, and by extension how employees behave whilst engaged in their paid duties. I would object to someone putting pronouns in their email signature just the same as I’d object to them putting any other belief in there. Work emails are not the place for you to display your own personal beliefs.

Agree that pronouns on emails are bullshit Stonewall propaganda

Also, cis is a made up word which TRAS are using to attempt to replace the word “woman” - which is an adult human female

Nobody is using the word cis to replace the word woman

I can't really see how this matters or that anyone would notice or think anything of it. Perhaps he should focus on the bigger picture.

@StMarysKettle

Nobody is using the word cis to replace the word woman

They're using it to qualify it though when that isn't needed for people to understand the word accurately.

Woman and trans woman. Totally understandable terms with no ambiguity. Why does woman need a word in front of it when describing an adult female?

Stop creating issues where they don't exist. The employee is just as entitled to her inclusive views, as her boss is to his less inclusive views.

Not by pushing their views through someone else's company they can't. They're paid to do a job. That's it.

He could just say to her " In my company, it's not our policy to mention pronouns, so please don't do that in business or work emails.".

Good point. Even on my roughest days I can’t be mistaken for a man. So why point out the bleeding obvious?

You wouldn’t want to work somewhere where you were compelled to add pronouns so the opposite - being compelled to remove them - is just as bad.
You have the right to hold whatever beliefs you want but you do not have the right to express them at work. My boss wouldn’t allow me to put a picture of Jesus in my email signature and he wouldn’t allow me to put pronouns either. It’s the same thing.

If your friend feels strongly that this will reflect badly on the company, a brief chat could go along the lines of,

"I know some workplaces encourage sharing pronouns on outgoing emails, and I both understand and respect the good intentions behind you including them on yours. However, some of our clients, rightly or wrongly, will view it as a political statement. As a result, and given the nature of our work, we would rather all employees stick to the signature template to avoid any controversy."

I think what super and beamur said is probably the way to go

I've worked for some major players and with most you are not allowed to deviate from the template signature. Tell him to send out an email 'reminder' to all employees instructing them to keep their signatures to the company standard.

And geo

It really is up to the employer and not the employee in this situation.
If the company policy for email signatures is for a certain format then, you take the job, you accept those terms.
Pronouns in emails etc may be common in some fields of employment but I've yet to see it where I work. Although if you want to add them you can.

Surely a cis gender female she/her is the norm, people would automatically say she/her. It would only make sense if someone called David was she/her or they/them etc

There’s no such thing as c**. Made up nonsense.

@SuperLoudPoppingAction

I think all new starts should have someone (office manager or administrator or whoever) show them the house style for email signatures to ensure consistency and a professional look. No need to go into the politics of it, I wouldn't have thought.

Yep. Staff need to be professional in communications and not bring politics or ridiculous ideologies to work.

I would consider using pronouns to be potentially harmful to a brand.

I would be issuing guidance on how staff should sign off.

FWIW, I would say the same for an employee adding some kind of religious mantra or quote to the end of an email. Not appropriate, not professional, not acceptable.

@toffeebutterpopcorn

Good point. Even on my roughest days I can’t be mistaken for a man. So why point out the bleeding obvious?

It makes it easier for others to follow suit if they are GNC or non binary if they see others doing it. Or she has a slightly ambiguous name. Or a deep voice. I worked with a woman I had never met with a unisex name, we only ever used email or IM - it was quite a while before I found out she was female if she had her pronouns listed I would have known straight away how to refer to her when referring to her in her absence.

You can’t make everyone do this so that those who need to have it spelled out (for various reasons) what, ‘blend in’? And if you are referring to the person of they aren’t there...

“I had an email from Jamie, she said...”
“Jamie’s a man...”
“Oh, he said...”

My SIL has a foreign name - and it’s actually a boys name. She survives just fine.

In which case why not make people add their religion (or none) or dietary requirements of choice? Allergies? Tea/coffee/biscuit preferences. I can think of a few things that would be rather useful to know about colleagues, clients or suppliers. Choose of pronoun isn’t one of them.