Employee using pronouns. Help!

[OfNobody]

Hi all,

A friend of mine has just taken on a new recruit and he's just realised that she uses pronouns after her name on her email signature.

He'd love for her not to do that because he's GC himself (and has a very traditional client base) but can he ask her to stop? Is that in itself discrimination?

Would love to advise him but generally, all the work issues I see around this run in the opposite direction (employers asking employees for pronouns).

Any experience of this, or any insight into how he can politely request that she drop the pronouns without ending up on the front cover of The Guardian?

From what he said, she doesn't sound like a massive raging handmaiden. She's just fresh out of uni and obviously thinks this is the way to go.

@merrymouse

Well, that cleared that up, great answer lol

Again I think gender ideology is homophobic because it doesn’t recognise same sex attraction.

Though it wouldn’t by the same token recognise heterosexual attraction?

The homophobia i think lies more in the implicit rejection of feminine men/masculine women.

My work have just given us a new signature with pronouns. I don't usually use a company signature but have adopted it just to delete the pronouns and show a bit of non sackable resistance/solidarity to anyone doing the same.

Though it wouldn’t by the same token recognise heterosexual attraction?

No, but there is no pressure on heterosexual people to change their sexuality. Gender identity ideology suggests that a lesbian just needs to meet the right man and that there is something wrong with her if she insists that she is same sex attracted.

Similarly gender ideology is misogynistic because it doesn’t recognise the sex based oppression of women.

However I agree with your point about rejection of feminine men/masculine women.

Well, that cleared that up, great answer lol

Well Quaggers, this whole thread is full of lots of explanations of why most people see gender ideology as highly sexist. I have yet to find an explanation of why it's not and it's interesting that you would chose to reply with a PA retort rather than an actual explanation. For it to make any sense you have to first explain why gender identity is. Please do so without using regressive gender stereotypes.

He doesn't need to make it about the pronouns at all. Just point out there is a 'house style' signature and that she needs to adhere to it. Presume she is junior and wanting to make a good impression. Lots og young pronoun people don't even really know they are making an overtly political statement. She might well have learnt to do that at uni.

I think your friend and his clients need to get with the times.
Even professional sites such as LinkedIn encourage pronouns alongside your user name.

Your friend and his clients are living in the dark ages.

And no, having she/her on an email signature won't make the company look stupid, it will make your company look modern and look like it considers staff wellbeing

@HalzTangz

I think your friend and his clients need to get with the times. Even professional sites such as LinkedIn encourage pronouns alongside your user name.

Your friend and his clients are living in the dark ages.

And no, having she/her on an email signature won't make the company look stupid, it will make your company look modern and look like it considers staff wellbeing

You sound about 12

@HalzTangz

I think your friend and his clients need to get with the times. Even professional sites such as LinkedIn encourage pronouns alongside your user name.

Your friend and his clients are living in the dark ages.

And no, having she/her on an email signature won't make the company look stupid, it will make your company look modern and look like it considers staff wellbeing

You need to read the thread.

Believing that men and women's identities are shaped by their sex and inherently different from each other can in no way be considered modern. Early 20th century perhaps.

Putting forward a 'house style' on the matter makes sense. He is in charge and her work emails do reflect on him- so he gets to choose.

You made me think about my own plans on this matter- in case the fad spreads.

If/when pronouns are required on my work emails:

'You' will be fine for now.

If I get right to the top of the greasy pole, I will probably prefer:

'Thee' or 'Thou'

As for the ones you use when I am not present... those are really not my affair.

Even professional sites such as LinkedIn encourage pronouns alongside your user name.

Gosh, if LinkedIn do it then we must all join in. Glad to know this.

Yes it keeps asking me. Because someone may just discuss me behind me back and... well do have super powers and will know...

@somethinginoffensive

Even professional sites such as LinkedIn encourage pronouns alongside your user name.

Gosh, if LinkedIn do it then we must all join in. Glad to know this.

It might encourage it but out of my professional network I don't think anyone does it.

@HalzTangz

I think your friend and his clients need to get with the times. Even professional sites such as LinkedIn encourage pronouns alongside your user name.

Your friend and his clients are living in the dark ages.

And no, having she/her on an email signature won't make the company look stupid, it will make your company look modern and look like it considers staff wellbeing

So the way to win contracts is to go around telling potential customers that they need to move with the times

LinkedIn a "professional site"

Many moons ago, in a different life when I worked in tech I set up accounts with Facebook, Myspace, Twitter, LinkedIn etc etc as they popped up as part of my job to report on developments in tech.

Obviously I used fake details. And it's amusing how those fake profiles have grown and grown with (presumably also imaginary) friends and colleagues. Certainly my fake LinkedIn profile still gets views, connection requests and the odd invitation to apply for a job.

So the idea of LinkedIn as arbiter of modern anything is amusing.

LinkedIn used to be reasonably ‘business’. Not it’s ‘here’s a photo of my dog!’ and general wokey nonsense stories (no business relations at all). It’s getting like twitter on there.

I’ve generally had a ‘fake’ member of my department. It stops staff getting hassled (for various reasons).

And no, having she/her on an email signature won't make the company look stupid, it will make your company look modern and look like it considers staff wellbeing

😂 No thanks. It says to me they only consider the well-being of some staff. A place to avoid indeed.

Agree@Etorih It looks like they look after the wellbeing of male staff and sideline women. I'm baffled as to how anyone can see this as modern and am still waiting for an answer which does not rely on old-fashioned gender stereotypes (quite apart from the fact that it's ridiculous to expect people to remember everyone's pronouns. Honestly I struggle to remember people's names much of the time. I have no hope of remembering pronouns too).

Sideline women?

@Quaggars

Sideline women?

This has been explained to you many times on this thread alone.

Women are disadvantaged in the workplace when sex/gender is emphasised.

You have failed to engage with any explanations.

Insistance on disclosure of gender also disadvantaged people who struggle with the concept of gender for any reason.

The only people advantaged are people who want to impose gender ideology.

‘ also disadvantages’

Sideline women?

Yes.

quite apart from the fact that it's ridiculous to expect people to remember everyone's pronouns.

It's quite controling behaviour really isn't it.