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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Pushback at Wi Spa in Los Angeles

999 replies

FannyCann · 27/06/2021 11:14

Well it's all kicking off at the spa. An amazing woman behind the desk standing up for women and telling a man where to take his penis. I fear she will lose her job over this but it's a glorious way to go.

twitter.com/stillgray/status/1408997169344909313?s=21

OP posts:
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EmbarrassingAdmissions · 28/06/2021 18:40

That poll is interesting although I don't know anything about Walsh's followers.

I confess to a weakness for the comment:

Damned if you do, flashed if you don't.

twitter.com/jennerrrssss/status/1409285801364668419?s=20

FlyPassed · 28/06/2021 18:41

I've started a new thread so that everyone sees the follow up video

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/4283068-Wi-Spa-pt-2-talking-to-the-manager?watched=1

Part 2 is on instagram
www.instagram.com/tv/CQfqaRDnS36/

EmbarrassingAdmissions · 28/06/2021 18:50

I am so angry that these low wage, minimum protection women are being put up front to defend this. Legislators everywhere have put women in these invidious positions.

Cailleach1 · 28/06/2021 19:32

The men seem to find it very entertaining and cool that there is an onslaught like this against the women and girls.

toffeebutterpopcorn · 28/06/2021 19:50

Until their mum, sister, partner, friend gets flashed/attacked/perved at...

I’m just imagining a flash mob of Bubbles (from little Britain) and her friends descending on the men’s changing rooms and showers and chasing them all around, snapping their bottoms with wet towels...

McDuffy · 28/06/2021 20:00

I wonder how many previously be-kinders are having an "oh shit" moment about this video

SheldonesqueDoesNotBelongHere · 28/06/2021 20:03

Champagne - champagne for everyone! 🍾 🥂

Who call this nonsense out for exactly what it is.

Did that woman really say he went next to a young girl in the jacuzzi?

We can see this for what it is.

PronounssheRa · 28/06/2021 20:06

I think Man Friday needs to go international

NiceGerbil · 28/06/2021 20:59

@Cailleach1

The men seem to find it very entertaining and cool that there is an onslaught like this against the women and girls.
I thought most of them looked a bit worried tbh. Desperately hoping that they wouldn't be dragged into it.
NiceGerbil · 28/06/2021 21:18

I can't find the post upthread but it said the wokebro said the person MIGHT be s transwoman.

If that is what was said, then it means he thought they might not be a transwoman.

Which means that he felt it was very important that the women and girls give the benefit of the doubt to a naked man sitting in a spa area with naked women and girls around the place.

We're always told to be polite, be nice, give the benefit of the doubt when alarms are ringing.

You see it on here from women (fgs) all the time.

OP: Man did creepy thing X
Loads of posters: Are you sure you didn't misinterpret him? You sound like you're over-reacting. Why were you rude he only wanted a chat! He's probably lonely/ depressed/ has some kind of additional needs/ socially inept etc etc.

Women have said though all this, it opens the door to all and sundry pervy men and men who enjoy upsetting/ intimidating /angering women

Answer was no no.

A man wouldn't pretend to be trans just got that! (Getting into an area with loads of naked women and girls- really??!!)

You can tell who is genuine and who isn't.
How?

Etc etc

So this completely obvious thing that was going to happen, happened (and a woman was brave enough to be unapologetic and didn't back down). And it was filmed.

The staff weren't interested.
The female customers had left and were hanging around in bathrobes etc (I doubt they got their money back!).
A woman paying to go in asked for her money back.

The staff weren't interested.
I'm guessing not getting involved in it was their main aim.

The men didn't go all Neanderthal and rush in and remove him/ beat him up. None of them looked like they were thinking about it.
None of them said hold on that's not right and tried to talk to the staff or agree it was wrong or anything.

One man decides to come and tell the woman, and if course all the other women and men heard. That it was ok for him to be there because he MIGHT be transgender.

I mean they have a mixed area FFS. The staff wouldn't even get someone to have s word and suggest that. For fear of being sued I assume.

There were girls of various ages in there FGS.

Watching it, it was EXACTLY the dynamics that women and girls navigate all the time.

Wokebro would rather give the person in the women's naked spa the benefit of the doubt, and was happy to risk the safety and certainly ruin the comfort of s load of women and girls. Essentially so he could feel like he'd educated some out of date/ transphobic women. And he was willing to risk other people- women and girls to feel good about that.

Urgh. And. Same old same old.

McDuffy · 29/06/2021 07:06

This had me awake and seething at 5am this morning. I feel so bloody helpless.
Splitting people by gender and not sex is just such an easy way in for flashers and voyeurs and they get a bloody free pass Sad I'm sad that there will be no female spaces left because of the sheer fucking entitlement of some people.
I was first wanked at in public when I was 14, and my little sister with me was 9. No need to be subtle or surreptitious now, fellas! Come on in.

VortexofBloggery · 29/06/2021 08:20

What if the naked man with his dick out was really and truly transgender. Does that make it ok? When it is said "oh I doubt he was truly trans" what does that mean to the little girl in the jacuzzi? Or the Muslim woman, or ANY woman? I can't see how that is supposed to make it right. No longer indecent exposure, no longer voyeurism, no longer CSA. The problem is considering a man is anything other than a man.

toffeebutterpopcorn · 29/06/2021 08:28

If you don’t believe that sex matters then there is no ‘compromise’. It’s like when on of a couple wants a baby and the other doesn’t - there is no middle ground.

We can’t allow a fairly recent whirlwind of a philosophy to just bulldozer women’s rights to hell. Remember there is no debate.

highame · 29/06/2021 08:29

Doesn't it strike you as odd that someone who might be transgender, a transwoman, wants to display their masculinity? That flies in the face of any arguments that TRA's make, doesn't it? My apologies if that thought has already been discussed

toffeebutterpopcorn · 29/06/2021 08:34

Do men wander around the mens room stark b-naked? I can honestly say that I have never done this!

Datun · 29/06/2021 08:35

What if the naked man with his dick out was really and truly transgender. Does that make it ok?

No. It doesn't. There is no difference in terms of category between the awful man telling the woman off and the born man who says they really want to be a woman.

They are both showing complete disregard for women's consent.

Neither should be in the women's section.

There is no condition, set of words, psychological state that means men can legitimately ignore women's consent.

I'd like to say I cant see that happening here, but then I remember Karen white.

toffeebutterpopcorn · 29/06/2021 08:35

*R4 now - UN-women taking about gender equality! 🤬 sex sex sex you twit.

Datun · 29/06/2021 08:37

@highame

Doesn't it strike you as odd that someone who might be transgender, a transwoman, wants to display their masculinity? That flies in the face of any arguments that TRA's make, doesn't it? My apologies if that thought has already been discussed
That's the difference between those with gender dysphoria and those without.
Imasoulman · 29/06/2021 09:22

@highame

Doesn't it strike you as odd that someone who might be transgender, a transwoman, wants to display their masculinity? That flies in the face of any arguments that TRA's make, doesn't it? My apologies if that thought has already been discussed

Yes it strikes me as very odd

No one can be blamed for questioning the motivation behind this behaviour.

WoolOfBat · 29/06/2021 10:20

I find the suggestion that this man was closer than a meter to a 9 year old girl absolutely awful.

Musing here…what if they had filmed the creep and asked people to rate his genitalia out of 10? Maybe that would put him off next time?

NiceGerbil · 29/06/2021 10:27

@WoolOfBat

I find the suggestion that this man was closer than a meter to a 9 year old girl absolutely awful.

Musing here…what if they had filmed the creep and asked people to rate his genitalia out of 10? Maybe that would put him off next time?

Erm...

It's not a race to the bottom here.

And I for one have no interest whatsoever in viewing and commenting on a random blokes todger.

What a bizarre suggestion tbh.

OvaHere · 29/06/2021 10:44

The most worrying thing about what happened at this spa is that it highlights the far reaching and chilling effects of gender ideology.

Even if you're minded to give credence to the idea of an inner gender identity it's not been established whether this naked male was even claiming one. The women didn't know and the staff didn't seem to know.

Mr Be Kind who interjected to scold the women didn't know either but was happy enough to offer it up as an excuse on behalf of a naked man he didn't know and had never met.

This is what women mean when we ask the question how can we tell why a man is in our spaces and what his intention is?

Nobody in charge of the spa was willing to do the most basic of checks which shows that adherence to this ideology renders even simplistic safeguarding obsolete.

What if this man was a known offender out on licence who realised it was a way to get close to little girls? I don't know that but neither does anyone else because nobody with any authority was willing to ask any questions or investigate.

OldTurtleNewShell · 29/06/2021 10:46

@McDuffy

I wonder how many previously be-kinders are having an "oh shit" moment about this video
Not that many, I think. In my experience, the argument goes in circles from 'be kind' to 'okay, that one's bad but you're cherrypicking' and then back to 'be kind' again.
WoolOfBat · 29/06/2021 10:47

Sorry NiceGerbil, it was a flippant remark. I am just so cross with these people again and again doing things like this without any consequences whatsoever. It really makes me angry.

I think public shaming (which I generally detest) is looking increasingly appealing.

OvaHere · 29/06/2021 10:52

Not that many, I think. In my experience, the argument goes in circles from 'be kind' to 'okay, that one's bad but you're cherrypicking' and then back to 'be kind' again.

From what I saw on Reddit the current favoured argument seems to be.

" You're all so prudish, why does it matter if a little girl sees an adult penis, she won't melt at the sight"

Which is a huge pushing of the Overton window of what is acceptable conduct around little girls. Makes it much easier IMO to make the jump to "why does it matter if a little girl touches an adult penis, it won't do any harm".

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