Mumsnet is hiving off sex/gender issues into a sub-forum

[YourSexNotGenderIsOnFire]

It sounds like it's happening:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/4267223-Any-chance-of-a-review-of-the-FWR-moderation-rules-in-light-of-Maya-Forstaters-success-in-court-please

Many of us have explained how much we didn't want this and how unworkable it will be, but Mumsnet won't listen.

I honestly feel betrayed, and am just waiting for final confirmation then will delete my account.

Et tu, Justine?

The common factor is the current attempt to erode or remove the legal rights of females.

Yes.

This is such a horrible idea. I was hoping that MNHQ would reconsider. It feels like being banned from the feminist chat section, which really smarts. I've been around for 10 years now, and I'm really surprised that this will actually be happening.

So where do we talk about prostitution and surrogacy?

The discrimination against women lies in their biological sex.

@Alicethruthelookingglass

So where do we talk about prostitution and surrogacy?

The discrimination against women lies in their biological sex.

The non-trans topic.

I can’t help feeling it’s not very well thought through if the idea is to corral gender-critical or radfem sympathisers safely away in a special board. What about issues that cross both? Will it be reports about horrible terfery on one board, then terrible swerfery on the other…? What happens when topic stray across gender and non-gender stuff, will MN be moving the threads back and forth?

Won’t it just end up with MN having modding panics on both and people popping in to complain about two boards rather than one?

It’s a daft idea if MN think it’ll make their lives easier - it has the potential for double the trouble

@Alicethruthelookingglass

So where do we talk about prostitution and surrogacy?

The discrimination against women lies in their biological sex.

I'm guessing surrogacy will go to the surrogacy board and prostitution will go to the sex and gender board (though it has nothing to do with gender and everything to do with sex).

Except where it concerns trans people, for example Jake and Hannah Graf and their surrogacy plans or Paris Lees and others who have previously been prostitutes? I don't know. I'm confused.

If unsure I think the chat and AIBU would be best as the feminist chat board will be strictly moderated for it remain on topic and for posters who support this split not to be upset by other discussions.

Well I will post in the area where women's interests are centred. It's pretty clear where that will be.

Maybe they should call it: Feminism ( Women's Sex Based Rights)

I'd welcome the return of 'FWR'

It wont work because any issue about women, whether it is equal pay is based on our sex discrimination. And in every area, other people are trying to claim we aren't really discriminated against because of our sex.

So any topic you start, even pay equality the issue of whether TWAW and the implications for women will come up.

Women dont want to have to talk about this but hostile action by trans activists mean that even if specifically areas of women's lifes, such as press feeding have been occupied by the gender takeover.

So the best way to stop this endless talk about trans issues is to get trans activists to stop encrouching on women's rights.

You are like saying to the people of an occupied terroritory stop making such a fuss about the occupiers, we dont want to have to read about it.

I actually think the solution is not to change(*) the feminism board but actually have a totally separate board called Equality Rights.

(*) Or maybe just dump all the sub threads we have because they are hardly used and just go back to have Feminism and Women's Rights.

I genuinely cant understand why @MNHQ are taking what is so clearly a hostile action as this time, given recent court cases and so on.

I can only imagine it is because there is an orchestrated campaign bombarding MNHQ with complaints.

And just to say again, what would be demcratic is to have a vote, that is only open to subcribers to mumsnet.

Sorry tired brain = stupid typos

Women dont want to have to talk about this but hostile action by trans activists mean that even if specifically areas of women's lifes, such as press feeding have been occupied by the gender takeover.

should have been

Women dont want to have to talk about this trans instrustion, but hostile action by trans activists mean that even is specifically areas of women's life, such as breast feeding have been occupied by the gender takeover.

I can only imagine it is because there is an orchestrated campaign bombarding MNHQ with complaints.

This sort of thing always ratchets up when we get a "win", so I wouldn't be surprised.

You are like saying to the people of an occupied terroritory stop making such a fuss about the occupiers, we dont want to have to read about it.

^
THIS!!!! ^^^

I do not like this. I do not want it. I think that those who do want or want to shut us up.
However, I also think a viper by any other name will bite as deep.
People fight over what they call us, but it does not change the material reality of what we are. That is the whole point of this debate.

Well, personally I'd be interested in workplace equality and equal opportunities for women, and other such subjects. I have zero interest in transphobia, and I find the hatred directed at this minority frankly nauseating.

How is workplace Equality & equal opps for women NOT about sex/gender @Marty13 ?

If this change does go ahead, will the rules of posting in the new subforum be reviewed and updated, particularly in light of the results of Maya's case?

Hey, at least they're not actually hiding this topic from general view like they did on our Aussie equivalent to mumsnet. Hid the area for discussing GC feminism so you had to know about it and actively seek it out. Still got invaded and reported on by those fragile souls who asked for it to be hidden. Exists no longer. We made our own forum.

Has anyone made an Aibu thread about this? It would be great to see it discussed somewhere with a vote option. I don’t have time to write a good explanation in a way that would make it unlikely to be moved back here, unfortunately. I think it would need to be quite carefully crafted.

I'm seeing names in this thread that I normally don't see on this forum. Looks like there may be a silent majority/minority who support us too? Maybe MNHQ need to do a bit more research.

About bloody time too!

Where would the posts from the MRAs go? The ones that end with an instruction to 'discuss'? I don't tend to find MRAs are that interested in the sex/gender debate so maybe their posts could go in the section that's male inclusive. I could be on board with that.

I think many users may be unaware this is going to happen as it didn't even get its own thread, the suggestion was added to the thread in site stuff that was asking a different question.

Brilliant news!

I don't want to have to keep jumping between two boards to talk about issues related to women and women's rights.

If I start a thread that isn't directly related to the sex/gender issue, will mods have to move it to the other general chat board? And then when someone posts in the thread something related to the sex/gender issue, will mods have to move it back?

Mumsnet - could we discuss the names of the new subtopics her before a final decision is made so that we can have a say?

How about:

Feminism: Sex and Gender discussion
Feminism chat

What do others think of the above? It is important for users to have the word Feminism is the new subtopic.

I think it's very important for feminism to be in the name of the new section. And for both boards to be listed in the main menu so users can get to it via a single click rather than hunt through the entire topic list.

@Pumperthepumper

I don’t see what the big deal is, do you want the name ‘feminism’ in it?

@Pumperthepumper doesn't see what the big deal is, doesn't understand how the language here is important to us- that you cannot take feminism out of sex/gender issues- but has repeatedly asked posters on other threads about wording on sanitary products and thinks we should be more inclusive. Apparently, given we are clearly nasty vipers on that issue as well, for saying that just 'women' won't suffice, it's only important that language satisfies trans/non binary etc- it doesn't seem to work the other way round to you pumper?

Really, I don't see what the big deal is- why won't 'women suffice'- why won't one board for FWR suffice- given that ALL of these issues are related to feminism? 🤔