Starmer and the Labour Party Really Cannot Read the Room

[ChristinaXYZ]

Labour and Self-id

twitter.com/PinkNews/status/1402586773499244549

Rosie Duffield gets the predictable kicking in the comments. Still no public support for her. That's what the Labour leadership think about women's rights and women who have an opinion.

Why any women would vote Labour I really do not know.

MidClrgs you clearly haven’t actually been a party member. I resigned as a Labour member - had stood for election as a councillor and everything, really involved - during the Corbyn era as it was simply impossible to get any traction against the woke bros and all you got was personal abuse and witch-hunting. Never again.

I have never in my life thought I would vote anything except Labour (I’m nearly 45 and never have voted for any party except Labour). But I can’t again. I may even end up voting Tory, and I hate the bastards. Never imagined this, but here we are.

I have family in one of the red wall seats. Very long time labour voters. They didn't vote, as the labour candidate just didn't represent them. Rother Valley. Quick look at twitter of the losing labour candidate, it's full of TRA retweets.

@Whatthechicken

I’m out. I tried to give back my membership a few days ago, but they still haven’t cancelled it. So I’ve just sent another message, I’m guessing they’ll have hundreds to do now though. I can’t trust Labour to safeguard my daughters sex based rights. PPs are correct KS is such a disappointment.

I didn't get confirmation of my membership cancellation requests until I cancelled my direct debit some months ago. Such an incredibly stupid move by Starmer. He has been a massive disappointment. And to think I voted for him in the leadership elections.

@FOJN

That footage is not on KS's twitter or the Labour Party.

KS twitter followers 1.1m
PN twitter followers 240k

It's almost as if he doesn't want people to see it.

Can someone who is a Twitter user make sure the PN thing is posted on his Twitter feed?

Or does it not work like that?

@Orf1abc

In this respect (though not in many others) he is reading the room.

That room is far bigger than your echo chamber.

Ah the great room of Hartlepool, Labour were absolutely right in their reading of the room there, spot on, hugely successful.

If their aim was to turn everyone away from Labour. Bravo.

@Theeyeballsinthesky

I hear you MidCirgs but honestly the level of hate thrown at women in the Green Party and in Labour, why on earth would I sign up to be abused by blue haired middle class ‘queer’ 20 somethings?

Same, and would actually be frightened of them having my personal details such as address if l joined and challenged them which l am rather ashamed to say.

Take the Green Party, from what I've heard in their spring conference they had a motion for twaw (or not). 500 people voted out of 25000 members. The vote was for twaw by 80 votes. This could have been stopped if women put their money (£3 per month) to join the party to vote against this.

Their position is so anti-science I wouldn't give them the steam off my......
nevermind pay to put myself in a position to be abused.

Unless something major changes I will be casting my first ever vote for the Tories next time round. I have no love for them but this is the hill I'm prepared to die on.

Take the Green Party, from what I've heard in their spring conference they had a motion for twaw (or not). 500 people voted out of 25000 members. The vote was for twaw by 80 votes. This could have been stopped if women put their money (£3 per month) to join the party to vote against this

There was a big effort led by GC Greens to prevent this happening, including offering proxy votes, but unfortunately on the day, the young anti GC wing of the party won the day. The Womens section of the Greens is now run by a transwoman who advised people not to tick the box on sex in the national census thereby scoring an own goal by making sure that statistics did not properly reflect the trans population!
Not that Labour would be any better. And I wouldnt vote Tory in several lifetimes.

@MidClrgs

*How many people decide they won't vote anymore because of their stance on women, yet won't get their arse into gear, join the party and vote internally for the party line?

Take the Green Party, from what I've heard in their spring conference they had a motion for twaw (or not). 500 people voted out of 25000 members. The vote was for twaw by 80 votes. This could have been stopped if women put their money (£3 per month) to join the party to vote against this.

Same with the Labour Party. Honestly. Sitting on a high horse saying you could never vote for them anymore is frankly apathetic. Join, vote, turn internal policies around. Join every damn Party to do the same if you really care about women's rights.*

Seriously????

I was there fighting the good fight in my CLP along side a number of other female members only to be constantly demonised and insulted by mid 20's early 30's left wing men whose sole contribution was hectoring in CLP meetings and acting as SJW's on social media.

Any and all actual effort such as canvassing and party admin was "left" (pun intended) to the Blairite cunts (their cosy term ).

As I've posted before, when many of the women left en mass what did they do? Ask why? Try and find common ground?

No the fuckers threw a party to celebrate.

So no, I'm done with them.

CuriousaboutSamphire

No idea, I don't have an account either. I can read but not post which means I can't be blocked!

@Orf1abc

In this respect (though not in many others) he is reading the room.

That room is far bigger than your echo chamber.

Its the Labour Party's room that is getting rapidly smaller.

They seem to be on a mission to alienate their already diminishing core voters, group by group.

@OldTurtleNewShell I voted for him too, I thought he would take us forward. I could stomach it if he proposed discussion/debate, a look at all of the issues - trying to work out a way forward. But no...women can just be the collateral damage, they’ll get over it, be kind and forgive us. Fuck Labour. I’m going to cancel my DD.

Please can some of the really clever women on here (and there are many) form a political party we can support? You would have a legion behind you!

I agree, MidClrgs. People, you need to join, not leave. And join now. Believe me, the progressive/lefties amongst you are wanted and needed. FFS - you have a right to be there. Don't let yourselves get edged out by loud voices on Twitter.

For what it's worth:

Starmer hasn't said anything that isn't in the manifesto. Which is all about support and debate.

Starmer is - very publicly - being advised, by very clever people, that this issue is toxic to all hell for Labour. He hasn't been captured. He's not daft.

Having said all of that - he needs to do something firm. If I were his advisor (& I'm not), I'd be telling him to make a hard-line statement saying the abuse of Rosie Duffield on social media is completely unacceptable.

The mad years of social media warriors that were a real feature of Corbyn-era populism - it's time to draw a line under that.

But, honestly, I've said it before : now is the time to join Labour - not to leave.

@irresistibleoverwhelm

MidClrgs you clearly haven’t actually been a party member. I resigned as a Labour member - had stood for election as a councillor and everything, really involved - during the Corbyn era as it was simply impossible to get any traction against the woke bros and all you got was personal abuse and witch-hunting. Never again.

I have never in my life thought I would vote anything except Labour (I’m nearly 45 and never have voted for any party except Labour). But I can’t again. I may even end up voting Tory, and I hate the bastards. Never imagined this, but here we are.

I have. I'm 15 years older than you. Have been around the block a bit canvassing cross-partisan support on women's rights, including Labour and Green. What I am worried about is - why are we all being keyboard warriors? Why aren't we fighting from within? I have no knowledge of feminist theory really (being a fairly uneducated woman from the north) but surely grassroots feminism is getting our hands dirty? A blue-haired mouthy idiot can shout at me but I am perfectly able to calmly put forward a motion that protects children and women. If there are no women there to support that motion then that makes me feel utterly depressed. The blue-hairs have won.

@Letsgetreadytocrumble

Starmer is going to have to pick a side on this soon, he can't keep fence sitting because he will end up losing support from everyone.

It's very clear that he has. That's it. I'm done with Labour.

as a previous poster said, it's on PN twitter feed, not KS', not Labour. I know because I tried to find it. I think he's trying to keep it quiet.
You'd have thought he'd have checked out Dawn Butler's poll results.

I agree, MidClrgs. People, you need to join, not leave. And join now. Believe me, the progressive/lefties amongst you are wanted and needed. FFS - you have a right to be there. Don't let yourselves get edged out by loud voices on Twitter.

I wasn't edged out by loud voices on Twitter.

Like the other women in my CLP we were bullied out by party members in plain view.

I’d love to see the Labour Party membership numbers over the past couple of years. Is it going up or down? Who is leaving? Who is joining?

At some point it begins to feel like a toxic relationship and as others have said, why pay membership fees, they don’t represent the rights of women and girls. Any Labour councillors who have done have been hounded out of the party or their posts. Rosie is a brave lone voice and constantly attacked by gender identity extremists. The Labour Party has allowed identity politics to destroy it.

Honestly, the manifesto position in this was penned by Lachlan Stewart.

Starmer hasn't said anything that is outside of that position.

I don't understand why everyone is suggesting he's saying any more than that.

He's not.

I had such high hopes for KS. He really, really needs new advisors and a backbone.

MidClrgs I’m in a CLP which literally drummed out councillors with more than 49 years experience - men and women - who wouldn’t sign up to a public TWAW manifesto, and in which the leader of the Labour group goes on social media to publicly berate anyone - even members and ex-councillors with decades’ worth of experience - who dares even a sniff of a question of the local party line on trans stuff. Women in the local party have just been stamped on (and some quietly harassed into resigning or shutting up). The idea that we can effect any change in that culture is laughable, and what’s more, none of us want to make the effort given the personal nastiness that results.

@DeRigueurMortis

I agree, MidClrgs. People, you need to join, not leave. And join now. Believe me, the progressive/lefties amongst you are wanted and needed. FFS - you have a right to be there. Don't let yourselves get edged out by loud voices on Twitter.

I wasn't edged out by loud voices on Twitter.

Like the other women in my CLP we were bullied out by party members in plain view.

Yes. Same here.

I will not lend my support to any party that treats women's rights like the fucking hunger games.

@irresistibleoverwhelm

MidClrgs I’m in a CLP which literally drummed out councillors with more than 49 years experience - men and women - who wouldn’t sign up to a public TWAW manifesto, and in which the leader of the Labour group goes on social media to publicly berate anyone - even members and ex-councillors with decades’ worth of experience - who dares even a sniff of a question of the local party line on trans stuff. Women in the local party have just been stamped on (and some quietly harassed into resigning or shutting up). The idea that we can effect any change in that culture is laughable, and what’s more, none of us want to make the effort given the personal nastiness that results.

This is very grim.

And I do think this is where we need KS to act.

It's partly an issue of what culture prevails in the Party.

A culture in which a debate on a subject which is known to be open to debate is silenced, and bullying of those with certain views is allowed to take place, is a toxic culture. And that has to stop.

It's beyond dysfunctional and delusional when we know that outside the Party people are not wholly persuaded to the idea of self-id without limits or debate.

I really mean it when I say 'delusional' too. It's like pretending the world - and the electorate - outside the members doesn't exist. And in a political Party, that is a form of madness.

Like the other women in my CLP we were bullied out by party members in plain view.

Quite. Have people forgotten what happened in Battle and Bexhill in 2017, the Labour party did nothing.