GRA Reform, Legal Self Declaration, has no effect on access to spaces

[ool0n]

I'm wondering given the recent convincing defeat of gender critical ideology in the high court vs EHRC - if the Mumsnet gender critical people finally accept the fact that having a GRC has no effect on access to spaces?

People on the other side of the debate like myself have been explaining to GC people on Twitter for years that having a GRC has no effect on access to spaces so their objection to GRA reform is/was unfounded. I/we based this on -

1. English government legal analysis that stated having a GRC has no effect on access to spaces
2. Scottish government legal analysis ... ditto ...
3. The EA 2010 and GA 2004 text
4. The practical impossibility that a BC (Not an ID document) could be of any use in deciding access

now we have

1. Gender critical crowdfunded challenge to EHRC guidance that says having a GRC has no effect on access to spaces. Comprehensively lost, not even passed the very low bar to even be considered for a Judicial Review.

Given this is the case will gender critical people be reevaluating their assertion "Self ID", as in GRA Reform, must be opposed as it effects access to spaces? Trans people have always been able to "Self ID", in the colloquial sense, into men's and women's spaces. So making it easier for trans people to change their birth certificates only helps them, has no effect on GC feminists, and/or cisgender women and spaces.

(I also wonder if there'll be any introspection as to why an obviously incorrect interpretation of the law was able to become so prevalent in gender critical circles. Maybe listen to groups outside of GC circles a bit more?)

Anyway, back to repealing the GRA and ensuring service providers make good use of existing EA excemptions.

Is that because of social factors, hip dynamics, or something to do with their sexed soul?

Oh dear.

Perhaps he could post photos when he does? (well, when he doesn't get in because it won't work, will it, despite what you claim?)

Sorry, you're totally right. I must have dreamt that a paedophile and rapist without a GRC was locked up in the female estate with vulnerable women.

I must have also imagined the recent MoJ judicial review, brought by a woman sexually assaulted by a male who identified as a woman whilst in prison.

What am I like, eh?

This was PRISON. Common sense went in the fucking bin because no one wanted to challenge the rapist who identified as a woman. You think anyone else will?

This is why puberty blockers are such a must have for young male children who feel transgender. The criteria in the judgement yesterday was that transwomen should be indistinguishable from women. Once gone through male puberty, that is so much more difficult to achieve, which means transwomen will get challenged more and more.

May 5th 2021
SEGM "The Karolinska Hospital in Sweden has issued a policy statement regarding treatment of gender dysphoric minors at its pediatric gender services division. This policy ends the practice of prescribing puberty blockers and cross-sex hormones to minors"
twitter.com/SEGMtweets/status/1389832291422150656

'Sweden's Karolinska Ends the Use of Puberty Blockers for

@zzizzer

... Well I'm convinced. Men can clearly be women because they say so and have made other people say so too. No more gender criticism activism for me

Same here. I'm off to sit in the sunshine.

Can I ask please, why would a TW want to enter a space that was traditionally held to be a female space. Like oh I don't know, women only yoga or swimming, or a red tent at a festival? I am curious.

It's incredible how well you have this skill. Tell me, what traits give someone like Jazz Jennings away as male?

Are we allowed to talk about Jazz Jennings now? Because I'm sure a lot of people would be interested.

@sanluca

I'm AMAZED that you can! Well done for this skill!

I always think most men/males never realise how good women are at judging the sex of another person. For women it becomes second nature, call it survival instinct or something. Men/males don't need so don't seem to have it.

Yup. Yet another example of how a male-born person actually has no idea what it is like to be female.

Its good to know I may like Elsa and let all this go. I might take up macrame with my new freetime. Or perhaps learn to play the cornet.

@spoonrider

> "Self ID allows any male to access women in all the above circumstances and until trans groups acknowledge that and start working to tackle the issue, women will never stop speaking up - ever."

Self ID does not allow any male to simply access any female space.

If it does then please ask your husband to call himself a woman and to walk into the changing rooms at the local gym. I'll happily buy him some flowers and grapes for when he's lying in bed in the male hospital ward, healing from his beating by women.

Like that would actually happen. Women don't tend to react with violence.

So you're not going to ask your male friend to try this experiment?

I thought not.

Haha! Travis Alabanza got top shop to change their policy without even claiming to be trans! That's how easy it is.

@R0wantrees

Its good to know I may like Elsa and let all this go. I might take up macrame with my new freetime. Or perhaps learn to play the cornet.

What is a cornet, exactly? Is it bigger or smaller than a trumpet?

Poor Jazz has a male face and body. I saw a video of Jazz and a brother out running. Mmm.

As Jenn Smith (a Canadian transsexual) wisely said, men tend to be dazzled by the headlamps.

@R0wantrees

Its good to know I may like Elsa and let all this go. I might take up macrame with my new freetime. Or perhaps learn to play the cornet.

Nah. Let's go to the pub instead, they'll be open soon.

Although we could macrame in the pub I suppose?

@spoonrider

"Any man can identify as a woman, all they have to do is say they intend to transition and they're covered under 'gender reassignment'. Any man includes paedophiles, rapists, and voyeurs."

If you could grab a male family member and get them to test this theory, I'd be grateful.

Ask them to go to the women's gym and simply say that they intend to transition. Please let us know if the staff let him into the women's facilities.

Perhaps he could post photos when he does? (well, when he doesn't get in because it won't work, will it, despite what you claim?).

No need to test it. I have the proof for you.

Women have reported going into the ladies changing room at their gym, only to find a naked, fully intact male there, sometimes more than one. I've seen many reports of this, from the UK & abroad. Often, the women say they won't use the showers/changing room/gym any more. Is this what you want to happen?

I've seen a report this week of male students hanging around the women's bathrooms of a university's student accommodation, & telling any young woman who objects that they're trans & can't be thrown out.

Think of UK department stores recently saying that anyone can use whichever changing room they feel most comfortable in. (Of course, women then lose the one they feel most comfortable in, i.e. single sex.)

So yes, it's already happening. You seem to be out of date.

Popped back to see if my question about what the OP would do about self identified women sex offenders in prisons has been answered?
Tumbleweed.

I wonder what advice Madam Bunbury would give about this thread? Especially when looking at the deleted posts?

What is a cornet, exactly? Is it bigger or smaller than a trumpet?

I think if you're making like Elsa, it's something sparkly you wear on your head while whirling a cloak around. (I am merely following guidance on this from my daughter, who could probably qualify for a Frozen phd.)

Go for it. I'm sure you'll have some constructive views on how she's obviously male and you can spot her a mile off.

I would go for it, but those reporting this board got mumsnet to relegate that subject to something we are not really allowed to discuss.

I'll leave it to you to guess why.

So you're not going to ask your male friend to try this experiment?

I thought not

Don't need to. The paedophile rapist has already proven it for you (nothing to say about that then, no?) There are plenty more examples out there. Plenty.

What is a cornet, exactly? Is it bigger or smaller than a trumpet?

Its more compact and has a mellower tone.