Pregnant people?

[Trustisamust]

So our local NHS Trust have finally updated their guidance re allowing partners to attend pregnancy scans etc.
They now refer to pregnant people, not pregnant women.
I don't know if I am being unreasonable here but this does not sit comfortably with me?

@YetAnotherSpartacus

*Here's the simple, accurate way, again: Male and female are sex based terms. Man and woman are species-specific sex based terms*

Masculine and feminine are the gender terms.

If that's what you think, cool! But the NHS and medical professionals don't which is why the language is changing. Have your own personal opinion, that's fine. You do you. But this is what the NHS and other medical organizations tend to go by. That's all. I'm not here to change everyone's opinion on this. I know everyone has strong opinions on this. But I'm just clarifying that this is what the NHS believe which is why the language they use is changing to better suit that as they realize it's outdated and incorrect.

You could solve all this argument by just defining what a woman gender ID is.

So we know if we have one or our family members have one.

If non medical people can have an.input into it then surely so cab we. The CEO of mermaids background is in IT no medical.training beyond Google.

So this knowledge is not exclusive to medicine

@Whatwouldscullydo

You could solve all this argument by just defining what a woman gender ID is.

So we know if we have one or our family members have one.

If non medical people can have an.input into it then surely so cab we. The CEO of mermaids background is in IT no medical.training beyond Google.

So this knowledge is not exclusive to medicine

Which like I've said before I can't go into detail on and I don't wish to. So please go ask someone else

This is like working in a call centre. There's a set script and wheb someone asks what the windows are made out of or what agency does the fitting you cant answer.

Its extremely poor that the terms cannot be defined. Questions will.be innocently asked and a simple script is not good enough.

Wtf did autocorrect turn simply into skimpily? As if we don't have enough trouble from people randomly mutating words.

Emphasis on the 'If' at the start of my second para, YAS.... I suppose the distinction between 'gender identity' and 'gender expression' is to allow for the Muscatos of this world. Not exactly a compelling example in favour of redifining (undermining) 'woman'.

@Whatwouldscullydo

This is like working in a call centre. There's a set script and wheb someone asks what the windows are made out of or what agency does the fitting you cant answer.

Its extremely poor that the terms cannot be defined. Questions will.be innocently asked and a simple script is not good enough.

It's utterly tedious.

🦡🌈🤍

@EdgeOfACoin

Man and Woman have always meant gender. They've never been sex terms because the sex terms are female and male.

This really, really isn't true. It just isn't.

Okay maybe not to you. That's cool! But in terms of the history of gender it has. And that's why the medical professionals follow those guidelines. Don't have to change your opinion if you don't want to. Just giving context.

Here's the simplist way; male and female are sex based terms. Man and woman are gender identity terms.

Not according to the Equality Act. See my earlier post.

You cant. Just admit it.

Without using stereotypes or circular arguments you cannot determine one single trait that links.33 million people together besides their biology.

@Whatwouldscullydo

You cant. Just admit it.

Without using stereotypes or circular arguments you cannot determine one single trait that links.33 million people together besides their biology.

Think what you want darling 🤍

Oh I know so.

I've never seen one single account that doesn't reference toys clothes etc

Eveb the mermaids Ted talk.

Undermining.... 'undefining'

But in terms of the history of gender it has.

What?

There aren't parallel histories! We don't have the history of the English language and the history of gender!

@LangClegsInSpace

Here's the simplist way; male and female are sex based terms. Man and woman are gender identity terms.

Not according to the Equality Act. See my earlier post.

Understood. That is what transgender people are fighting for in terms of their rights as trans healthcare has become so unaccessable it means getting a GRA can take years and years, which may result into self ID, which not everyone wants to resort to. However with better equality under the equality act for transgender people that may be avoided. It's kinda too much to explain in a post like this but I hope that makes some sort of sense.

Think what you want darling

Earlier you accused us of insulting you. I can't find any insults. Yet, you insult us.

Can you answer the actual question?

Your "evidence" that the NHS and all doctors/scientists use your definitions is an extract from a very specific NHS guidance document on language to be used in a very specific context. It says nothing about the general use of the terms man and woman and in fact doesn't even specify that they are only to be used to mean gender identity. It in fact is concerned with what the words "gender" and "sex" refer to, only.

Here's the simplist way; male and female are sex based terms. Man and woman are gender identity terms. Masculine and feminine are gender expression terms. They don't all have to link together

ASugarr

I think we're getting somewhere here. So 'man' means someone who is masculine, 'woman' is someone who is feminine.

So - it IS based on stereotypes then. A man who is interested in fashion, arts, is kind and gentle isn't traditionally 'masculine' may be male but he's not a man, and a tough forceful woman who's an engineer and likes football, never wears dresses is female but not a woman? Gotcha.

Well that's progressive isn't it?

@YetAnotherSpartacus

Think what you want darling

Earlier you accused us of insulting you. I can't find any insults. Yet, you insult us.

Can you answer the actual question?

I could. But I don't wish to with you. If you are that curious go to a gender specialist. Might take you a few years to see one however you'll get the answer you want.

There are those who think if they believe hard enough that they can make it so.

It's like the scene in Hook where Robin Williams imagines a feast in front of him.

Some people are stuck in Neverland.

🦡🌈🤍

@AlwaysTawnyOwl

Here's the simplist way; male and female are sex based terms. Man and woman are gender identity terms. Masculine and feminine are gender expression terms. They don't all have to link together

ASugarr

I think we're getting somewhere here. So 'man' means someone who is masculine, 'woman' is someone who is feminine.

So - it IS based on stereotypes then. A man who is interested in fashion, arts, is kind and gentle isn't traditionally 'masculine' may be male but he's not a man, and a tough forceful woman who's an engineer and likes football, never wears dresses is female but not a woman? Gotcha.

No. Man doesn't mean masculine. Woman doesn't mean feminine. You can be masculine and be a woman and vice versa.

Why do people try and "educate" then refuse to answer questions

You will.have to do better. Like providing evidence or the answer

Yup think I'm done here.

@Whatwouldscullydo

Why do people try and "educate" then refuse to answer questions

You will.have to do better. Like providing evidence or the answer

I'm not your teacher, I'm not here to educate. Just here to answer OP's question. The rest you can figure out yourself.

So what links a feminine woman to masculine one?