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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Feminism: chat

Original poster

Pregnant people?

999 replies

Trustisamust · 11/04/2021 03:12

So our local NHS Trust have finally updated their guidance re allowing partners to attend pregnancy scans etc.
They now refer to pregnant people, not pregnant women.
I don't know if I am being unreasonable here but this does not sit comfortably with me?

OP posts:
Thread gallery
12
ASugarr · 11/04/2021 19:06

@Whatwouldscullydo

You don't honestly think they'd assume you were crazy if it turned out in said emergency the patient was not obscured by a hedge or wedged in a car to the point only feet were visible and therefore genuinely unidentifiable, but right there in front of you and very clearly a man or woman. You don't think that they'd think you were a complete twit for not giving them that information....
Like I've said, make the assumption if you are asked to. However do recognize that you might not be correct and that outside of an emergency it isn't okay to assume.
Erkrie · 11/04/2021 19:07

Yes I do which is why it is important to normalise that some men are born female and stop them from feeling insecure from people knowing they are transgender.

To the point that you don't tell hospital staff you are pregnant? Seriously? And expect staff to check for pregnancy in males on top of everything else they need to do, just in case there's a transman who doesn't want to tell them? You can see that going wrong, particularly as testicular cancer can cause a positive pregnancy test too. Seems to me people need to grow up and take steps to look after themselves. Make sure this info is available. Wear an ID bracelet if necessary.
When you give birth you leave your dignity at the door and pick it up again on the way out. Seems to me the same needs to apply to gender for goodness sake. As you said yourself, gender is not sex. And only those of the female sex give birth.

BaseDrops · 11/04/2021 19:07

How can you help someone with their gender identity? I thought it was innate.

Deliriumoftheendless · 11/04/2021 19:08

How about you paraphrase?

ASugarr · 11/04/2021 19:08

@Erkrie

Yes I do which is why it is important to normalise that some men are born female and stop them from feeling insecure from people knowing they are transgender.

To the point that you don't tell hospital staff you are pregnant? Seriously? And expect staff to check for pregnancy in males on top of everything else they need to do, just in case there's a transman who doesn't want to tell them? You can see that going wrong, particularly as testicular cancer can cause a positive pregnancy test too. Seems to me people need to grow up and take steps to look after themselves. Make sure this info is available. Wear an ID bracelet if necessary.
When you give birth you leave your dignity at the door and pick it up again on the way out. Seems to me the same needs to apply to gender for goodness sake. As you said yourself, gender is not sex. And only those of the female sex give birth.

Well done. Those of the female sex give birth. However not everyone who is female is a woman. You are complicating the whole thing so much more than it needs to be.
Whatwouldscullydo · 11/04/2021 19:09

Its not an assumption though is it.
I mean in the vast majority of the time it's very obvious. I mean they are quipped with eyes just like you .i mean what else do you think they will be working with? If they were psychic they'd be millionaire's and probably not paramedics.. what exactly is it that they can do to identify the sex upon.arruval that you cant?

RedDogsBeg · 11/04/2021 19:09

and this is yet more nonsense:

Again you will have to speak with a sexual health specialist who can give further information on that as I am not permitted to do so. Even though I am anonymous I don't wish to get into trouble for disclosing anything that I wouldn't even if you knew who I was so I can't. But others might have lesser restrictions depending on who they work for. Or even better, you could ask a transgender person to explain it for you.

In response to this:

You have strenuously avoided any definition or description of this mysterious 'woman gender identity ' and now claim that it can be diagnosed but you can't tell us how.

If you are diagnosing a gender identity you must have a set of criteria for that diagnosis, or is this something else you just make up as you go along?

Erkrie · 11/04/2021 19:10

Again you will have to speak with a sexual health specialist who can give further information on that as I am not permitted to do so.

Do you consider yourself to be a sexual health specialist? It seems theres quite a bit of stuff in this area that you don't really know...

PotholeHellhole · 11/04/2021 19:10

@Erkrie

If you are unsure you just say you are unsure. You can give an assumption that's fine. People do that with age and race. In an emergency it isn't an issue.

Do you not think it was an issue for the transman who miscarried?

I have realised during these pleasant debates on MN that soi-disant young progressives clearly delineate male and female people when determining whether they should care about someone's fate. The terrible incident of the poor transman who didn't realise he was pregnant and didn't receive appropriate treatment is such a case.

Whatever a certain type of person is called, at the bottom of the pecking order they remain.

ASugarr · 11/04/2021 19:10

@Whatwouldscullydo

Its not an assumption though is it. I mean in the vast majority of the time it's very obvious. I mean they are quipped with eyes just like you .i mean what else do you think they will be working with? If they were psychic they'd be millionaire's and probably not paramedics.. what exactly is it that they can do to identify the sex upon.arruval that you cant?
I agree that most of the time it will be obvious. However not every single time. That's just something to consider. Again. A question for a paramedic, not me sorry.
ASugarr · 11/04/2021 19:12

@Erkrie

Again you will have to speak with a sexual health specialist who can give further information on that as I am not permitted to do so.

Do you consider yourself to be a sexual health specialist? It seems theres quite a bit of stuff in this area that you don't really know...

I'm just a sexual health worker. I primarily teach and do more singlar sessions with people. Not this kind of emergency type stuff you keep mentioning. And again, you can assume what you want. I really don't care.
Erkrie · 11/04/2021 19:14

Well done. Those of the female sex give birth. However not everyone who is female is a woman. You are complicating the whole thing so much more than it needs to be.

I appreciate that if someone has opted out of womanhood they don't want to be described as a woman. That's fine. You don't need to do your passive aggressive little well done to me. They are female. Thus a transman. Not a man. It's pretty clear what they are by that description. Seems to me it's people like you that over complicate it. With tragic consequences it seems.

RedDogsBeg · 11/04/2021 19:14

Well done. Those of the female sex give birth. However not everyone who is female is a woman. You are complicating the whole thing so much more than it needs to be.

The only person complicating an obfuscating is you ASugarr as I said before it would be amusing if it wasn't so bloody dangerous when it comes to health, but hey who cares if people die due to this ludicrous ideology, price worth paying, eh? Same as women in prison being raped and sexually assaulted is a price worth paying for this same warped ideology.

Whatwouldscullydo · 11/04/2021 19:15

Does anything you do mean applying for funding or resources or giving info?

So if you needed to report that there was a marked increase in teenage girls becoming pregnant I'm X area ajd perhaps they need to work on education akd provide resources to deal with it, younwpuld be happy that those statistics were false or obscured by the fact you report them.as male?

How does that help?

ASugarr · 11/04/2021 19:18

@RedDogsBeg

Well done. Those of the female sex give birth. However not everyone who is female is a woman. You are complicating the whole thing so much more than it needs to be.

The only person complicating an obfuscating is you ASugarr as I said before it would be amusing if it wasn't so bloody dangerous when it comes to health, but hey who cares if people die due to this ludicrous ideology, price worth paying, eh? Same as women in prison being raped and sexually assaulted is a price worth paying for this same warped ideology.

I'm not complicating anything. It is really simple. People are born male and female. They are sex terms for human beings. Some people who are female are women, which means they may identify as cisgender. Some people who are male are men, which means they may identify as cisgender. Some people who are female are men. That means they are transgender. Some people who are male are women. That means they are transgender. Being cisgender or transgender doesn't make you any lesser of a man or woman. Anything around stereotypes and expression (masculine, feminine, etc) is called gender expression. That doesn't have to match anyone's gender. I'm clocking off now because I've spent way too much of my time explaining this. Have a good Sunday 🤍🌤
LockdownLard · 11/04/2021 19:19

Perhaps we could have the name of the organisation, ie NHS, Brook etc to apply for these top secret questions under FOI?

ASugarr · 11/04/2021 19:19

@Erkrie

Well done. Those of the female sex give birth. However not everyone who is female is a woman. You are complicating the whole thing so much more than it needs to be.

I appreciate that if someone has opted out of womanhood they don't want to be described as a woman. That's fine. You don't need to do your passive aggressive little well done to me. They are female. Thus a transman. Not a man. It's pretty clear what they are by that description. Seems to me it's people like you that over complicate it. With tragic consequences it seems.

You can be a man and be female. You can be a woman and be male. It's not that hard to understand. Sex doesn't equal gender 🤍
SirusTheVirus · 11/04/2021 19:19

After reading all 20 pages I can conclude that ASugarr is indeed batshit Grin

ANewCreation · 11/04/2021 19:21

Referring to ewe, mare, doe, hen etc

" Yeah those are gender terms we created for animals. Their sex is male and female. Their gender is then the terms we (for some reason) came up for them.
They are identifying with being who they are. They don't have to be sterotypcially feminine, present female or have any surgery.
Again. It isn't a choice. Its them being who they are and what is most comfortable to them. "

Just checking again. Can you confirm, you think - seriously think - animals have a Gender?! Grin

LockdownLard · 11/04/2021 19:21

@SirusTheVirus

After reading all 20 pages I can conclude that ASugarr is indeed batshit Grin
I am seriously hoping that @ASugarr is going to look back on their posts and cringe with embarrassment in a few years time.....!
DialSquare · 11/04/2021 19:21

I'm starting to suspect that the A stands for agent.

AlwaysTawnyOwl · 11/04/2021 19:22

ASugarr

Again you will have to speak with a sexual health specialist who can give further information on that as I am not permitted to do so. Even though I am anonymous I don't wish to get into trouble for disclosing anything that I wouldn't even if you knew who I was so I can't. But others might have lesser restrictions depending on who they work for. Or even better, you could ask a transgender person to explain it for you

I do not believe this questionnaire exists. You are unable to answer basic questions about what a 'woman gender identity ' is, despite saying you work with people to discover what their gender identity is - hard to do if you can't even describe it.

Erkrie · 11/04/2021 19:24

What about those who don't identify as cisgender? The majority of the population? What would you call them?

I'm not surprised you're going. Your scratched record approach isnt persuading anyone. After all, pretty much everyone here knows what a man and a woman are. Apart from you. Yet you claim to be a health professional. You don't sound like any qualified health care professional I've ever come across. You do sound like a charlatan. Or a sales person trying to sell a lie.

AlwaysTawnyOwl · 11/04/2021 19:24

Another question ASugarr - where might we find a list of approved sexual health specialists who will diagnose our gender identity? You must know of some?

RedDogsBeg · 11/04/2021 19:26

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