Reclaim These Streets have been captured.

[stumbledin]

It was inevitable of course. Whatever the original intentions of the local women who set up the facebook event page, given the huge response they have had, it was just to tempting for those who always want to be in control not to take over.

So now there is a Reclaim These Streets facebook group www.facebook.com/groups/282187170119807/ which of course loads of women have joined. And although it is meant to be about sharing your experiences, your ideas, your whatever, turns out the group admins will not let your voice be heard if you dont express yourself in an approved way.

No need to detail what that is, but once again the vanguard of well schooled stonewall students are definitely in charge.

And of course this also applies to the now in excess of half a million pounds raisde for women's projects. It has been decreed - by knee jerk tweet that only trans inclusive groups will get women.

Tough luck on those providing women only services as legally allowed under the EA. So rape crisis helplines, women refuges, many BME groups will be deemed not worthy of financial support.

How come there are never enough mumsnetters out and about on facebook or wherever to capture groups?

They were founded with the core principles of intersectional feminism.
"Captured," would imply they ever followed your weird, exclusionary brand of feminism to begin with.

Yesterday there were 12k members.
Now there are 15k.
Will be interesting to see how those numbers change going forward.
I wont be staying if the nonsense, which is not helping anyone or doing anything, continues.
Ive joined my local group so Im hoping we can keep to the point there.
They still haven't said how they intend to spend the money afaik

Feminism which centres women and girls = "weird"

Most "intersectional feminism" is nothing of the sort, as it ignores or dismisses a key axis of oppression, being born female.

I feel so dispirited today. I've lost friends since sticking my head over the parapet and they will forever sell the narrative that I'm a bigot

Except eventually when it becomes apparent to everyone what a mess this all is when there are more and more detransitioners asking why the grown ups didn't protect them, then your friends will pretend it never happened and they never supported it in the first place

@ShowOfHands

Thank you.

I feel so dispirited today. I've lost friends since sticking my head over the parapet and they will forever sell the narrative that I'm a bigot. It feels impossible.

We are with you

I’m beginning to think we need to condense our efforts - it seems there are too many individual movements springing up now (FPFW, sex matters, resisters, wpuk, adult human female) and when it comes to this issue there is safety in numbers.

This group has raised more than half a million pounds on their JustGiving website. According to the website, you can only raise funds for one specified registered charity per page or for local or personal causes. They haven't specified which charities they will give the money to but have indicated on twitter that it will likely include Sisters Uncut who are using the response to Sara's death to campaign for rapists and murderers of women.

You can complain about the fundraising generally using this link (which isn't so easy to find on the webpage). I think most of the donors would be surprised to learn their donations might find their way into the pockets of people campaigning for rapists and murderers.

help.justgiving.com/hc/en-us/requests/new?ticket_form_id=137825

I get the impression that perhaps this all ran away from them a bit and they didn't realise how much attention and money they would receive.

However, it is still poor form and unprofessional to not decide what you are doing with the donations until after the donation page has been set up. What a mess.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

Most "intersectional feminism" is nothing of the sort, as it ignores or dismisses a key axis of oppression, being born female.

The core axis of defining women by their reproductive capabilities?

Are you SURE that's feminism?

Are you sure that defining women by what they wear is feminism?

I’ve come off the group both because I didn’t feel I could share my thoughts without being labelled transphobic and didn’t think the arguments on the group were respectful or useful for anyone.

I’m fed up of reading the same stock phrases dropped about left right and centre.

I mentioned all of this three days ago but Mumsnet HQ decided to delete the thread.

I was, shall we say “disappointed” that in doing so, Mumsnet facilitated further donations to a group who said “every single penny” would go to charities that included transwomen - when it’s clear that many felt that was inappropriate.

As for Sisters Uncut “honouring” the deaths of men who had raped women and children, there’s no words for that.

Mainstream media don’t seem to have plucked up the courage to expose this, but on the plus side, apparently JustGiving is giving refunds to those who ask.

You have paraphrased “born female” to “reproductive capabilities”. Interesting. Why don’t you think females should be at the heart of FEMinism?

@ValancyRedfern

Yes they were very upfront from the start about being twaw. I decided not to go to my local vigil as it was for 'all those who identify as women' so I concluded it wasn't for me.

I wish that I had researched them properly. I feel so let down.

The core axis of defining women by their reproductive capabilities?

Are you SURE that's feminism?

Fighting a system of structural oppression based on inherent biology?
Pretty sure, yes

I'm curious as to your definition of feminism

“Fighting a system of structural oppression based on inherent biology?
Pretty sure, yes

I'm curious as to your definition of feminism”

I’m curious to hear it too.

@EightiesRobot

Are you sure that defining women by what they wear is feminism?

Immediately falling back onto the standard strawman argument that does not represent any reasonable person's position, I see.

So how do you define women if it isn't by our sexed bodies?

The core axis of defining women by their reproductive capabilities?

Are you SURE that's feminism?

You don't understand what it's about, do you? That's a really lame take.

You have paraphrased “born female” to “reproductive capabilities”. Interesting.

Isn't it.

I got in to a discussion on the Facebook page this afternoon, on a post demanding confirmation that RTS is trans and sex worker inclusive. All very civilised, polite and respectful (on my part anyway). Comments were closed within minutes.
So many things to say about this. So few I can.

Not RTFT but had a quick look at the Facebook thing.

So depressing. This massive amount of women thinking enough is enough. We need change. A moment to get together and really push for something tangible.

And all that's happening is women bickering over who is more oppressed than who etc.

Shame that can't be put aside for a bit to harness this feeling and get something done.

So how do you define women if it isn't by our sexed bodies?

The "science nerd" Hibari subscribes to a rather bizarre quasi-religious belief that anyone who declares they are a woman, even if male, must necessarily be so and this can never ever be questioned.

Because of course it's really silly to wonder how anyone ever came up with the concept of women if it had nothing to do with biological sex and of course has nothing to do with sex stereotypes, perish the thought.

I'm glad OP you pointed out that the FB is a very white group, so it's easier for them to have luxury oppressions.

I wish intersectional feminism focused on what its original intent was to focus on - that being female AND Black (or from another class who experience oppression) is a double oppression and how there are unique issues based on your particular intersection as a woman. Because you are a woman PLUS another oppressed group. It seems now that intersection potentially involves every human on the planet.

@Ereshkigalangcleg

So how do you define women if it isn't by our sexed bodies?

The "science nerd" Hibari subscribes to a rather bizarre quasi-religious belief that anyone who declares they are a woman, even if male, must necessarily be so and this can never ever be questioned.

Because of course it's really silly to wonder how anyone ever came up with the concept of women if it had nothing to do with biological sex and of course has nothing to do with sex stereotypes, perish the thought.

Yes, the science nerd follows the direction the science has been going since the early 1900s.

anyone who declares they are a woman, even if male, must necessarily be so and this can never ever be questioned.

Not a position I've ever actually stated here, and my actual view is a little more nuanced than that, but... you're pretty close?

"Whoever came up with the concept of woman," is a fun line of thinking to go down. You should look into that a little more.