Meet the Other Phone. Only the apps you allow.

Meet the Other Phone.
Only the apps you allow.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Emma Bateman, Co Chair of Green Party Women suspended for Querying Whether Transwomen are Female

198 replies

gardenbird48 · 16/03/2021 13:09

Emma Bateman
@EmmaBatemanGPW
On March 8th, International Women's Day, I was suspended from the Green Party following a complaint by 2 fellow GPW committee members

Because I queried whether trans women are female.
Green Party policy is that 'trans women are women'

Now we must agree that they are also female

I thought Emma had gone a bit quiet since the weekend where they voted down a motion to support sex based rights.

It turns out that Emma might have been forced to accept the language re. transwomen are women but queried whether they are actually female. They objected to that as well obviously.

I guess it was only a matter of time as Kathryn Bristow's stated focus from the start was to take down Emma (rather than actually do any for women).

OP posts:
Thread gallery
5
CardinalLolzy · 20/03/2021 14:59

Thank you all for this thread. I have voted for and done low-level support work for the Green party in the past - they got my attention around the time they stopped plugging homeopathy and other unscientific nonsense (we need science to combat climate change).

I've left well alone since the Challenor and TWAW stuff and I'd seen headlines about this but not about the groups protesting.

AmeliaEdwards · 20/03/2021 23:22

I have resigned from the Green Party because they are hijacked by an obsession with gender ideology that determines that women no longer exist. The Alice in Wonderland of the GParty world where a biological male can identify as a woman, and run the women’s committee, expelling the real woman co-chair, is beyond any totalitarian nightmare. Women are being punished for being women, for holding out for the needs of our sex: for single sex privacy, protection and safety. The Trojan Horse of gender self- identity, dressed in its guise of equality, wants to erase our existence and swallow our space. We must fight back.

gardenbird48 · 20/03/2021 23:49

@AmeliaEdwards

I have resigned from the Green Party because they are hijacked by an obsession with gender ideology that determines that women no longer exist. The Alice in Wonderland of the GParty world where a biological male can identify as a woman, and run the women’s committee, expelling the real woman co-chair, is beyond any totalitarian nightmare. Women are being punished for being women, for holding out for the needs of our sex: for single sex privacy, protection and safety. The Trojan Horse of gender self- identity, dressed in its guise of equality, wants to erase our existence and swallow our space. We must fight back.
absolutely. I'm not a Green voter but I think we need a party focused on the environment to keep important issues in the public eye.

The current Green Party seem to have lost the plot completely - maybe it's time for a breakaway party??

OP posts:
vivariumvivariumsvivaria · 21/03/2021 21:28

maybe it's time for a breakaway party?? yes, gardenbird

With a breakaway Labour, Lib Dem, SNP party too.

I am looking forward to seeing the Tory manifesto, so far they seem to be the only ones who are prepared to say that women have specific rights in law.

Stonecrop · 21/03/2021 22:01

Just a thought but would you not think that the Green Party would be trying to encourage people to accept themselves as they are rather than needing medically unnecessary treatments and all the resources involved in that. Also would you not think they would be fighting against the wastefulness of a pursuing gender-stereotypical appearance and lifestyle for everyone. The people I have met who seemed genuinely to care about the environment and live what they do preach don’t seem to care too much about clothes or appearance and wear minimal makeup etc, rather are more concerned about the sustainability of it all.

OhHolyJesus · 21/03/2021 22:13

In addition to the waste and plastic that clothes and make up produce, I'm concerned about the sanitary pad waste building up.

I read a story this week about a person who has had the surgery that resulted in what I will politely call colon leakage that occurs daily/throughout the day. (This person had caused trauma to their previous surgical wound so a second surgery using part of their colon was required.)

Women can of course use tampons which produce less waste or menstrual cups that last for about 10 years, but even if you had a heavy period you couldn't produce the daily waste as this person would.

Even if you put aside the waste around injections and syringes, pills and patches for the synthetic hormones I would struggle to take a principled environmental stance that ignored science but supported the impact on the planet around the elective surgical process and results, and still run for an elected office both within the greens and as a councillor or as an MP.

You can't expect people to take you seriously if you don't practice what you preach and yet preach to others about green policies about how we need to reduce waste and plastic consumption.

ArabellaScott · 21/03/2021 22:43

Women are being punished for being women, for holding out for the needs of our sex: for single sex privacy, protection and safety. The Trojan Horse of gender self- identity, dressed in its guise of equality, wants to erase our existence and swallow our space. We must fight back.

Star
WarriorN · 22/03/2021 06:56

Given how harmful PBs are, is that not a risk re disposal of vials and do the Hormones get excreted in urine? Impacting water habitats?

Glittery nails are essentially micro plastics.

A true greenie would be worried imo.

WarriorN · 22/03/2021 06:57

I read a story this week about a person who has had the surgery that resulted in what I will politely call colon leakage that occurs daily/throughout the day. (This person had caused trauma to their previous surgical wound so a second surgery using part of their colon was required.)

It makes you wonder who really wants to do that to themselves. Hence in reality, so few actually getting the op.

BettyFilous · 22/03/2021 07:20

I am looking forward to seeing the Tory manifesto, so far they seem to be the only ones who are prepared to say that women have specific rights in law.

I was listening to the Triggernometry podcast with Ben Bradley and his comments about the EA2010 set my spidey senses tingling. I’m not convinced the Tories are safe either. We need a solidly reality-grounded alternative that upholds sex-based rights, along with the other protected characteristics. I’m at the point where I’d donate to a crowdfunder for candidate deposits if a decent new party can form.

highame · 22/03/2021 07:46

I have known 2 transwomen (full transition) and neither wore nail glitter. Are you confusing drag queens with trans? Or are they both now the same? confused?

porridgecake · 22/03/2021 08:44

The reference to glittery nails is specific to a person in the green party.

gardenbird48 · 22/03/2021 08:56

@porridgecake

The reference to glittery nails is specific to a person in the green party.
Oh yes I’ve seen they’s glittery nails proudly displayed on sm.

Bizarrely, as soon as I realised that glitter is indeed microplastic (as pp says) along with many other items like much of the decorative wrapping paper, teabags etc - I took steps to remove those things (and many more) from our household.

It occurred to me the other day that most flags are made of plastic and as they degrade over time are also going to be distributing micro plastics into the environment. We seem to see a lot of extra flags around at the moment with town halls and police stations proudly flying the LGBTQIA+ flags.

In the good old days most eco warriors would have had 40 fits at the idea of deliberately distributing micro plastics with such gay abandon. The Green Party should be a shining example of eco friendliness. I don’t pay much attention to them but have they said much about the environment recently?

OP posts:
porridgecake · 22/03/2021 09:01

The green party seems to have become a single issue pressure group, and it is definitely not the environment.

toffeebutterpopcorn · 22/03/2021 09:14

Not so much ‘green’ anymore. I remember when it was all saving nature, tying to stop humans messing about with nature, saving the planet...

WarriorN · 22/03/2021 11:49

Currently watching this which is an interview with Dom, one of the few Gp councillors, who resigned after the GP conference.

I hadn't joined these dots; "Caroline Lucas is involved with the Good Law Project, which Gender GP have donated to."

ChristinaXYZ · 22/03/2021 11:58

I've voted Green in the past, particularly at local elections as we have some hard working Green councillors. But no more. I am not voting for any party that does not know what a woman is, even if the local candidate does know, they are still giving credence and support to a party that is trying to erase me.

It is getting harder and harder to vote.

SunsetBeetch · 22/03/2021 12:37

@porridgecake

The green party seems to have become a single issue pressure group, and it is definitely not the environment.
Should rename themselves The Gender Party
flyingfoxkins · 22/03/2021 12:44

@WarriorN - Thanks for posting the video chat with Dom Armstrong. Quote: "I didnt think the Green Party would be about all this shit". Neither did I! Also, its somewhat hard to get a working class, north eastern male councillor elected - you`d think the GP would want to hang onto him but obviously not.

WarriorN · 22/03/2021 12:51

I found him refreshing; NE blokes like him see through all the crap and take no shit Grin

WarriorN · 22/03/2021 12:52

Also, its somewhat hard to get a working class, north eastern male councillor elected - you`d think the GP would want to hang onto him but obviously not.

Yep!

OhHolyJesus · 22/03/2021 16:04

"The Green party’s gender intolerance problem" by Debbie Hayton (just because I'm sharing Hayton's words does not mean I am a fan but the points made below stand).

"Is the Green party determined to make its female members feel unwelcome? After voting down women’s sex-based rights at their spring conference, the party has now suspended the co-chair of its women’s committee, Emma Bateman. The reason? According to Bateman, her decision to question whether trans women are female is to blame.

As a trans woman, who also happens to be a science teacher, I know that trans women are most definitely male. Indeed, it is only because we are male that we can be transwomen. But where gender ideology is concerned, the Greens appear to have lost touch with reality.

Bateman is no transphobe but – as with many other women – she thinks that being female is rather more than a feeling. She is also well respected in the party. In the words of writer and activist Beatrix Campbell: 'Bateman is a calm, splendid Green activist. Many people treasure her.'

But is there a place in the party for people like Bateman? Campbell, who has herself faced Green Party discipline for apparently 'causing distress, not just offence', is not alone in feeling exasperated about what has happened to a party she loves:

'Just when you imagine that it can't get worse in Green party culture, something cruel and crazy slaps the collective face. In Stalinist Russia they'd call the use of complaints procedure against Emma Bateman 'administrative methods': a bureaucratic and proceduralist way of disciplining thought.'

Behind a veneer of inclusivity, the Greens have succumbed to the gender ideology that brooks no dissent. Bateman cares about the rights of women; she was named on the defeated women's rights motion that tried to add sex to the other eight protected characteristics that the Green party does support (age, disability, gender reassignment, sexual orientation, race, maternity, religion/belief, marriage/civil partnership).

When that motion was defeated, Bateman’s own motion fell. She had hoped to persuade the party that sex and gender should not be conflated. Unfortunately the Green party leadership appears to think differently. Co-Leader (and candidate for Mayor of London), Sian Berry said:

'Upsetting proposals aimed at excluding trans people from rights and services are being put to Green conference by an organised, loud but small group. Greens we need YOU to show up for our trans siblings this weekend.'

But why should the party not listen to this 'loud but small group'? After all, they speak for many women. Do the Greens care about this constituency of female voters? No, appears to be the answer.

Although Berry insists that 'our core values respect everyone’s right to inclusion and to be who they are', it's hard to see how that extends to people like Bateman.

You might be forgiven for thinking this is just a parochial row within a party on the fringes of British politics. But it's more than that. Why? Because the intolerance at the heart of the Greens' gender debate is not only confined to this party. Worryingly, there are signs – in the Labour party, the Lib Dems, Plaid Cymru and the SNP – that such a one-sided debate is becoming the norm.

So how has this happened? Because some now think that standing up for science and – indeed – for the safety and protection of women is transphobic. It isn't. But those who make that point, like Bateman, risk being hounded, smeared and suspended.

Bateman has also said that:

'It is not discrimination to say that males should not be in a women’s group.'

If anything, that doesn't go far enough: males cannot be in a women’s group, because their presence – our presence, indeed – means that it is no longer a women’s group but a mixed-sex group.

Of course, I am not a Green party member, but if I was, then saying such a thing would almost certainly result in me being hauled in front of the type of disciplinary process that Bateman now faces. But differences of opinion should be settled in debate, not in a disciplinary. The treatment of Bateman, like Campbell before her, is outrageous.

Thankfully, not everyone is silent on Bateman's treatment. Caitlin Collins, co-ordinator of the Bridgwater and West Somerset Green Party is organising a strike in protest:

'We are not willing to represent the Green Party in its current dysfunctional state; nor are we willing to ask others to stand as candidates or to take part in election campaigning for the Green Party. This strike will last until, as a minimum requirement, Emma Bateman’s suspension is lifted.'

How trans people, a small group in any organisation, gained so much prominence is not clear, but our use as a tool to keep women in their place is striking. While Bateman awaits her fate, others are forced to remain silent, often to protect their families and livelihoods. That is no way to run a party and a society. The sooner the Green Party leadership wakes up and sees the problem, the sooner they might be taken seriously."

MuggleStudiesResearchProject · 22/03/2021 16:15

That is all very well put!

flyingfoxkins · 22/03/2021 16:23

Good thoughtful stuff @OhHolyJesus - I was only going to add to my previous post that including a working class man from the north east (self declared) is probably bringing more to the diversity table than yet more people who wish to silence women.

TheRabbitOfCaerbannog · 22/03/2021 16:28

You might be forgiven for thinking this is just a parochial row within a party on the fringes of British politics. But it's more than that. Why? Because the intolerance at the heart of the Greens' gender debate is not only confined to this party. Worryingly, there are signs – in the Labour party, the Lib Dems, Plaid Cymru and the SNP – that such a one-sided debate is becoming the norm.

Totalitarians R us

Swipe left for the next trending thread