Why AREN’T men more afraid?

[Lessthanaballpark]

In all the discussion around Sarah Everard and women’s safety, it keeps coming up that men are statistically more likely to be victims of violence ( the perps being men obvs)

Yet, why then aren’t men more afraid? I can’t remember seeing much in the news about male on male violence.

Is that because it’s easier to feel sympathy for women?

And why aren’t men afraid?

Is it because they think they have a fighting chance against any perps?

Is it because they are not targeted for being men?

Is it because the violence towards women is more sexual?

I’d genuinely like to know what everyone thinks, because it seems to me that they should be more scared than they are.

Good question, maybe some of the male posters could tell us what they think.

I think most men who are murdered are either involved in gang-related crimes or were brawling..

Of those who are abducted or attacked without any kind of altercation, the vast majority are female. Add in the differences in strength between men and women and it’s easy to see why women are more afraid.

And of course, we are educated into taking precautions and blamed if we are attacked and did not take those precautions.

A friend shared some bloke's viral wisdom about how he goes running at 11 at night and it's so great, oh but just - just now - realised women don't have the liberty to do that. Well, duh.

In the words of Chris Rock, waddaya want, a cookie? This over-earnest sensitive guy social media penny dropping... are we supposed be grateful? Because it's just really bloody annoying. Are their minds that empty?

I think partly because they assume they will be able to fight back
Partly because they havent had years and geberations of being told how to be careful, how to avoid violence
Partly because if a man attacks a man the male victim isnt essentially blamed for it being their fault by the press the police everyone else
Partly because of fucking toxic masculinity and a patriarchy that serves most men no better than it does women although a lot of men can't see that

They don't think they are in danger. It's that simple.

I have to consider how easily I can become a victim (theft mainly) every day. Not to put equipment somewhere where it can be easily taken to a vehicle, not to get to far from it, to find something to chain it to. I don't feel safe on city streets either day or night but in more rural locations it is quite different, although I would not walk in the dark with headphones on.
I'm going to go fishing tomorrow. My back will be to the path. There will be a fairly heavy torch in my pocket.

Sometimes I think it’s to do with the fetishisation of women’s fear. Lingering shots over dead women’s bodies on murder shows. The tabloids always sensationalising sex and murder.

I’d like to know what the majority of male on male violence consists of. I feel like it’s never reported.

Is it lack of awareness possibly?

I've had some male contacts who were victims of really violent muggings, including being bashed at the back of the head with a brick, one who had the shit kicked out of him because he had no money, and another held at knifepoint after being tricked into stopping his car on a narrow road.

I think all of them would tell me not to be out alone late at night but never thought of themselves as potential victims.

There was also a work colleague who was off sick and asked HR to keep the reason quiet, which of course is fine. But then he resigned, when he came in to collect his stuff, we saw his face was very poorly. He had been punched so hard in a mugging, the eyeball floor had shifted. he left london and went to live with his parents again and said he was scared to live here.

I think it's a great question. Just out of interest I googled the most likely causes of men getting murdered. It just kept coming up with stats about men murdering women. I'm guessing much of the murders of men is gang related, or drunken arguments in the pub/ Saturday night etc.

Hi was hoping to discuss what's happened this week with my form class and I just wanted to have the stats ready as I know o have a few boys who use the 'not all men' argument or 'what about the men'.
It would be good to know just how much at risk men walking home at night are. Is it just a perception that they are safe walking home at night.

We don't actually know what the true stats are in order to make statistical comparisons, because sexual violence against women is grossly underreported.

We don't believe we'll be believed.

@reallyisthisallthereis

I think it's a great question. Just out of interest I googled the most likely causes of men getting murdered. It just kept coming up with stats about men murdering women. I'm guessing much of the murders of men is gang related, or drunken arguments in the pub/ Saturday night etc. Hi was hoping to discuss what's happened this week with my form class and I just wanted to have the stats ready as I know o have a few boys who use the 'not all men' argument or 'what about the men'. It would be good to know just how much at risk men walking home at night are. Is it just a perception that they are safe walking home at night.

Not sure if a BBC source is any good

www.bbc.co.uk/news/explainers-56365412

I've always been under the impression that young men, in their 20s, are the group most at risk of violent attack.

I wonder if most ordinary blokes think it doesn't really happen to people like them - that violence against men is mostly e.g. gangs or drug related (I don't know what the stats are, just what they might assume).
Whereas women know that it does happen to people like us - just ordinary women going about their business.

Suppose I was being flippant OP, I know two men in real life who have suffered serious ptsd following random daylight muggings. How aware they were before of being a victim of crime though, I don't know.

I can only speak personally, but we're often not given the option of being afraid. Certainly, you would be careful, but in the end you have to weigh the risks and do it anyway.

I’ve seen elsewhere that statistically young men are more at risk than women of being attacked. Sorry I don’t have data to hand. Thirty year ago a friend who went to a lot of meetings said that if a young man offered to walk her home for her safety she told him she would rather walk him home as he was more at risk.

It's simple. We take more risks and over-estimate our abilities.

I think a lot of women are afraid of sexual assault and rape actually more than violence. I'm not so afraid a random man will kill me more that he will rape me, although I know the risk of the former does exist there is the added risk I guess of the latter. That obviously doesn't happen as much to men

But also I think a lot of men are afraid but they won't admit it, or allow themselves to be. Possibly they think they could fight back?

As well I think women get years of minor aggressions from men that result in more fear. I've had many, generally minor, incidents from men using their size to intimate me, many years of men touching your arsenal in clubs or brushing their hand on you back etc that lead to a general weariness of men. Men havent probably had that as much.

Ive been staying away from threads on female safety in the streets because I don't want to diminish others experience. But I may be able to try to understand my feeling through this thread.

I'm female, I'm not afraid. Maybe I think like a man?

I regularly run routes, alone, that have no street lights at night. I have no fear going out walking the dog at night, or running alone at night. I make more precautions to make sure I'm safe in traffic (so cars can see me and not accidentally run me over) than I do to consider my safety against men (or people in general).

I like on the boarder of Nottinghamshire and Derbyshire, if that's relevant. Not inner city, fairly rural (but not countryside). I'm 44.

Why don't I feel afraid? I really don't know. I know that, personally, I don't understand why other women feel inherently afraid because it's not my lived experience. I have a 16yo DD who I also know has no issues being out alone at night. I've never lived an experience that has made be feel threatened or sexually harassed. I'd have no issues physically fighting someone if I was in such a position (am I thinking in a masculine way there?) And feel I'm strong enough to have a good chance.

I think OldRailer has it: They don't think they are in danger. It's that simple.

I've never considered myself to be in danger. I don't think I would be attacked or at risk. I feel like other people are generally good people and wouldn't seek to hurt me. And if I was to come across a bad person, that enough good people exist (in their homes, or also out walking, or driving in cars etc etc) to help me (and it's my belief I would be helped) as long as I shout enough.

I dont feel in danger ans so I am not afraid. I think it is that simple. I have this (selfish? entitled?) firm belief that it's very unlikely that anyone would want to harm me. And if I was, a people would help me and I'd ultimately be alright. So I have no reason to feel afraid.

It's an interesting question.

I dont feel able to properly discuss and understand why I don't feel afraid, because as a woman I feel I'm doing an injustice to other women by saying this. Because I don't want to minimise their experiences. But it's nothing I have ever experienced. Maybe more women could think like me? I don't know how to explain it though.

I had the conversation with my husband about how if a woman wants to go for a run at night she has to come carefully consider so many different things whereas a man might only need to consider what the weather’s like. He said it’s Absolutely not true for him and he does worry about going out at night.
He’s tall but slim and once got beaten to a pulp in a bar when a doorman took a disliking to him so I think that’s stayed with him.
He also thinks it would be nigh on impossible to change the views of the type of men who sexually assault women as it’s so heavily ingrained in their lifestyles and social views. It was a really interesting conversation - I had no idea he felt so vulnerable.

I think it's because men are usually not targeted for being men. If they are victims of a crime, it's often just random chance in a generally violent context, not because they are male. My DH has talked about feeling scared going out at night in the town in Scotland he grew up in because sometimes gangs of lads would just pick fights for fun to kick the shit out of someone and so he avoided pubs and drinking. At the same time, my DH never lived in fear because of these events. Getting punched in the face is horrible but it rarely changes your life forever. Being raped or targeted for sexual violence is entirely different.

Women are targeted for being women. Gender-based violence is a hate crime. There are men who deliberately seek women out as targets for sexual assault, rape and gruesome murder because they hate women. We are also more likely to suffer street harassment, always a reminder that we should count ourselves lucky to be allowed to exist in public by men who hate us.

Men know violent crimes and robberies happen but if it happens to them it won't be because they are male. Racial minorities or gay men might have a different perspective as they know what it is like to be targeted for violent hatred because of their race or sexuality.

My brother says it's pragmatism.

You know it's more than likely that at some point in your life you are going to get jumped and take a kicking, but you just go about your life anyway and don't really give it any more thought.

Given how many women don't go out on foot after dark, avoid dangerous areas, aren't involved in gangs, and don't brawl in pubs, it's not surprising that as a population we suffer fewer violent attacks. Less exposure to dangerous situations is bound to have that effect. Just like you're at greater risk of a traffic accident if you spent more time on the road.

If an individual man follows the same female behaviour patterns described above, I strongly suspect he wouldn't be at any greater risk of violence than women are on average.

I think women tend to be more risk averse than men in general. I also think Men are probably less likely to stop doing what they want because of others, they are less likely to question their actions and that includes questioning their actions when it comes to their safety.

I am a man. I was assaulted several times when I was younger, not serious beatings nor muggings just happened to bump into the sort of bloke who wanted to punch somebody. I think a lot of violence against men is of this nature. It always shook me up a bit but never really changed my habits. I never really ever expected it to be worse than that.

@kesstrel I agree with this. I think men who are cautious and follow the same rules as women have less risk of violence than women

When I think of all my female friends we have all been in uncomfortable situations with men, we can all recount a time when we felt acutely at risk from men, men grabbing us, men encircling us in clubs, men following us home, men wanking on trains etc, not necessarily times when men have been violent as such but preliminary acts (like indecent exposure 🤔). But my male friends no. They don't have that same pile of smaller incidents that women do that make them more scared. Its not just big acts of violence that will be counted in statistics that make women scared of men