What's wrong with 'Cisgender'

[ASugar]

As someone who identifies as a cisgender woman and works in sexual health, I am honestly confused as to why so many females (sex term) who identify with being women (gender term) dislike the term Cisgender?

Now I'm not here to tell you what to say, I am genuinely curious.

However, here is my opinion for those who may be interested.

Cisgender just means you are not transgender. That your sex links you your gender and you assign any gender terms (ie. Pronouns, Gender identity, sometimes gender expression but not always, etc). I personally don't like to think that just because I was born with a vagina means I am a woman because I know many men with vaginas and women with penises. Additionally those who don't have a gender identity, then that would mean you wouldn't use women and men as they're gender terms (according to medical professionals). It would make you non binary or agender.

I understand that the term 'Cis' has been used to insult others which for that I am sorry.
My view is that if you can't allow trans women to be accepted in society and identified as women (without the need for 'trans' infront of it constantly) then we should be using cisgender. It is a medical term that professionals such as the NHS recognize. But I understand that is just my opinion.

I probably won't be commenting as I can imagine this will be filled with comments and I don't want to disrespect anyone's views. Just a cisgender woman who wants to understand more...

And as always I would appreciate if you respect my view as I'm going to be respecting all of yours.

@Glamflimfloogety I don't believe you have however I appreciate the apology and kindness 🤍

Why do we never hear of Cis-men ?

Gender is a tool used to prescribe behaviour and enforce a hierarchy based on sex. You gender based terms if you like. Don't try to force it onto others.

I dont agree with with the idea that my personality or preferences define my 'real' sex; that preferring short hair does not mean I'm actually a man.

Asugar what makes you so certain of the existence of gender? Not goady, I would honestly just like to know. I don’t understand what it is, I do not have one.

Also, we don’t seek to find out the gender of our children, we seek to find out their sex.

@yeahbutnaw

Cisgender is an accurate term.

The existence of Tall women, Black women, Muslim women, and Trans women doesn't negate my existence.

They're just adjectives. I've got no idea why everyone is so offended by them.

Surely it would be Tall Ciswoman, Muslim ciswoman etc...

The term is perfectly fine for those who identify as cisgender. I identify as a biological female.

That's what the term cisgender means.

Now this is interesting, as I've been told previously that this is transphobic. As this would mean that anyone "AFAB" regardless of their gender identity would then be considered cis, so are you sure that's what you meant? If you definitely did then can I suggest you agree with us more than you think you do..

An additional question I'd like to ask is then why do we have to know the gender of our child? Shop in stores where clothes are described by gender? Etc.

I don't. I raised mine to not conform to sexist stereotypes and we did not bring them up as a 'gendered' person.

However, we certainly need to know and understand exactly what sex my child is. It would be ridiculous to deny the necessity of that and how it impacts their live.

I don't ‘identify’ as anything. I AM a woman - ie an adult human female. I don’t have a gender identity, because I don't believe in blindly following social constructs. Genderism upholds a patriarchal society by imposing and mimicking stereotypical behaviours. I’m having none of it. Also, people cant change sex, no matter how many surgical procedures they have, no matter what they wear, no matter what nouns they choose to use to describe themselves.

@TheDogsMother CisMen or CisMan are used. However since many people focus a lot on the lives of trans women I can understand that it doesn't come up often. But trans men and cis men exsist.

We don't find out the gender of the foetus.
We find out the sex.

And that's so we don't accidentally paint a boys room pink / girls room blue.
Cos apparently according to society that's important,
When it isn't.

What's important is fucking misogyny, sexism, FGM, child marriages, rape....which only happens to 1 sex.

Additionally those who don't have a gender identity, then that would mean you wouldn't use women and men as they're gender terms (according to medical professionals). It would make you non binary or agender.

So you respect someone’s right to self identify unless you disagree with the terms they use to do so?

I’m not cisgender or agender or non-binary - all of those terms imply that I believe in a binary system of gender. I do not believe in gender as anything more than social construct (which oppresses women and excuses shitty men), and somehow that apparently makes me the crazy one, not those who insist that it’s possibly to change sex.

Although I disagree I can respect that decision. An additional question I'd like to ask is then why do we have to know the gender of our child? Shop in stores where clothes are described by gender? Etc.

I personally don't. My female children have 'boy' and 'girl' clothes and toys. They have their own interests and I let them express these. Look up 'Let Toys Be Toys'. And why do we have toy categories? Well, some people are very attached to gender stereotypes. And it's maybe true that generally female children gravitate towards some types of toys and male children another, as a whole. This doesn't mean an individual female child who likes Action Man is secretly a boy or a male child who loves Elsa is a girl. That's regressive.

Also, why do you call yourself a woman if the term technically is a gender term. By the way, scientists and medical professionals have determined this.
Man and woman are still often used to indicate sex, e.g. women's health refering to mainly obstetric and gynaelogical things. If you say someone is a woman, it's still generally understood by people that she's female.

Your last sentence is also comically vague. Please don't say 'scientists say' or worse 'science says'. Give sources. I say this as a scientist.

@Morgan12

Why are people bothered about me calling myself a woman?

What difference does it make to them?

Seems like everyone can identify themselves however they want...except for women identifying as women.

This

I mean almost comically vague.

Oh for an edit function....

Yes, rape of men happens of course, by other men.
Don't pull me up on it cos you bloody well know what I mean.

I reject the notion of cisgender as a label because I reject the notion or gender as anything more that social construct designed to oppress women.

I am an adult human female, a woman, my sex is immutable and written in my DNA and I utterly reject concept of gender.

No trans person or TRA has even been explain to explain gender without the use of oppressive stereotypes which I utterly reject and until they can I refuse to give any ground on the sex based rights that my predecessors fraught and died to win.

@sofakingg00d

I am a woman.

I am not a subset of woman.

I do not have a gender and find it absolutely fascinating that to misgender a trans person is "literal violence" but to misgender me is absolutely fine. It's just unbelievably hypocritical for you to come on here and tell women what they should call themselves. I'll decide that for myself thanks.

This sums it up. I will not refer to myself as a cis woman, I'm a woman.

"Surely it would be Tall Ciswoman, Muslim ciswoman etc..."

No... ? Why would it be?

It's cisgender woman. Trans woman. Cisgender man. Trans man.

Not had time to read the thread, but I object to cis because I don't have a gender identity. I remember when I was really young being confused that anyone would feel themselves to be "in the wrong body" because I didn't see that it would matter to me either way. My identity as female is based solely on knowing that my body is female. I don't have a womanly soul or anything.

Nope.

Woman, transwoman.
Man, transman.
Non-binary people.

However being female doesn't always mean you are a woman. Many people who are born female don't then identify as being a woman. As gender and sex are separate.

I don't believe in gender identity ideology, so that's not an answer that means anything to me. Sex is all there is. Personal identity is irrelevant.

Many people have stated that they don't agree or believe in gender. Although I disagree I can respect that decision. An additional question I'd like to ask is then why do we have to know the gender of our child? Shop in stores where clothes are described by gender? Etc.

Well those of us that believe that gender is simply a long held set of stereotypes do not know the gender of our child. We do however know the sex of our child and that is most commonly found by changing their nappy. Knowing their sex is important in the relevant care for them. It is irrelevant in clothing them.

ASugar I can't help feeling that a lot of transmen might object to your calling them female?

I don't have a "gender identity". I am a woman because that is the term used for an adult member of the female sex.

@yeahbutnaw

"Surely it would be Tall Ciswoman, Muslim ciswoman etc..."

No... ? Why would it be?

It's cisgender woman. Trans woman. Cisgender man. Trans man.

So we don't get to be tall, short, round, Muslim etc?

Or would that langauge twisting now mean I'd have to be a short cisgender woman? When what I actually am is Claudia Schiffer!

Yes! I was cismodeled at birth!