What's wrong with 'Cisgender'

[ASugar]

As someone who identifies as a cisgender woman and works in sexual health, I am honestly confused as to why so many females (sex term) who identify with being women (gender term) dislike the term Cisgender?

Now I'm not here to tell you what to say, I am genuinely curious.

However, here is my opinion for those who may be interested.

Cisgender just means you are not transgender. That your sex links you your gender and you assign any gender terms (ie. Pronouns, Gender identity, sometimes gender expression but not always, etc). I personally don't like to think that just because I was born with a vagina means I am a woman because I know many men with vaginas and women with penises. Additionally those who don't have a gender identity, then that would mean you wouldn't use women and men as they're gender terms (according to medical professionals). It would make you non binary or agender.

I understand that the term 'Cis' has been used to insult others which for that I am sorry.
My view is that if you can't allow trans women to be accepted in society and identified as women (without the need for 'trans' infront of it constantly) then we should be using cisgender. It is a medical term that professionals such as the NHS recognize. But I understand that is just my opinion.

I probably won't be commenting as I can imagine this will be filled with comments and I don't want to disrespect anyone's views. Just a cisgender woman who wants to understand more...

And as always I would appreciate if you respect my view as I'm going to be respecting all of yours.

It's a word made up by people centering male born people. I find it offensive that someone wants to change what I call myself. I call myself woman. I'm an adult human female. No new words needed or wanted.

However in my opinion if you don't allow trans women to identify and be women then the term cisgender will continue to be used for women born female.

No, that is not how it works, @ASugar . Men wanting to be women do NOT get to dictate to us the terms. They do not get to ride roughshod over us, and blackmail and threaten to get their way. If that is so, I will call them MEN!

Btw, you haven't answered my question on Transracial people.

if you don't allow trans women to identify and be women

It’s not about allowing it. It is biologically not the reality.

@augustusglupe

I'm a woman. An adult human female. However you can call yourself anything you flamin well please, doesn't make it a fact.

It makes it a fact for me. And for those around me.

identifies with being female or a woman.

Based on?

@MarshaBradyo

if you don't allow trans women to identify and be women

It’s not about allowing it. It is biologically not the reality.

Would you tell someone who has adopted a child she can't identify as a mother because she isn't biologically one?

So transwomen are women because they say so, even though it is factually incorrect on a biological level.

Women are women because they say so and it is factually correct on a biological level.

Is this an exercise in encouraging absolute cognitive dissonance?

@BelleSausage

Woman who wants to name her own experience= bigot who should be ignored

Man who wants to name his own experience= Hero who should be listened to.

Beautifully put.

It makes it a fact for me. And for those around me.

Well I'm glad you recognise that the definition of a woman is an adult human female. It is indeed a fact.

Cisgender just means you are not transgender

Nope, being a woman means I’m not transgender. I don’t need a made up word lumped on me against my will.

I think someone saying to a woman “what’s wrong with cisgender, it’s not offensive etc” is like a woman saying to a trans woman “what’s wrong with being called a man”.

I wouldn’t say that to a trans women because it’s rude. I’d respect their individual pronouns and call them what they ask to be called. I expect the same respect in return. That I want to be called a woman, not a cis woman.

No I wouldn’t op, woman is a sex based word though.

ASugar you keep saying 'identifying as a woman', what is it based on? What is the criteria? Where is the thinking?
Genuinely.

@Erkrie

It makes it a fact for me. And for those around me.

Well I'm glad you recognise that the definition of a woman is an adult human female. It is indeed a fact.

Well people don't have to know I'm female. I am a woman regardless of my sex.

fuck me another thread?

this OP is like an attention vampire

@VivaLeBeaver

Cisgender just means you are not transgender

Nope, being a woman means I’m not transgender. I don’t need a made up word lumped on me against my will.

I think someone saying to a woman “what’s wrong with cisgender, it’s not offensive etc” is like a woman saying to a trans woman “what’s wrong with being called a man”.

I wouldn’t say that to a trans women because it’s rude. I’d respect their individual pronouns and call them what they ask to be called. I expect the same respect in return. That I want to be called a woman, not a cis woman.

Well then women must not mean adult human female if you believe that because not all females are women. Some are men.

Why do people keep engaging with this poster, they appear to be tone deaf, and just keep stating their opinion over and over again as fact.

It makes it a fact for me. And for those around me.

Did you say you were a ‘cisgender woman’ or was that someone else. Do you mean you identify as one?

There is a certain arrogance telling us what the word woman must mean.

We reject that you can change it.

OP states:

not all females are women. Some are men.

I feel sorry for you OP. I hope like a PP you look back on this one day and cringe.

It's wrong for two reasons.
Cis = a derogatory term used by TRAs
Gender = a complete work of fiction. Nobody has a gender, only a sex. Cissex may be more accurate but I think normal should be the ones who decide what they are called.

@prrtnyao

So I socialise in the Deaf community and am fluent in British sign language. But I'm not Deaf. However, I feel like I'm Deaf. I identify with the culture more than hearing culture. I demand people say that I'm Deaf and I want access to interpreters, note takers and a free bus pass. I feel so much like I'm Deaf that I've decided to fully transition and deafen myself. I've found a doctor who will perforate my eardrum. Just one mind so I can still enjoy access to speech and music with my other ear. But I am Deaf. Don't call me hearing as that's offensive to me. Soon I can become my true authentic self.

Being deaf is a disability. You can't self identify as a disability. That has to be medically diagnosed. I have a disability myself and understand that confusion.

ASugar you asked that hours ago and had a response. It hasnt changed.

Mother refers to raising the child. Not giving birth.

So by your definition, a woman is anyone who says they are.
So a 15yr old can identify as a woman?
12year old?
8?
Where do you draw the line, and why?
At what point does someones gender become invalid?

Well people don't have to know I'm female. I am a woman regardless of my sex.

Well, yet again what constitutes being a woman, other than sex?

I'd like to say give me the top five things, but then I'm feeling kind and say the top three things, but then, because I know I'm right, I want to say give me one. fucking. thing.

One thing. That constitutes being a woman, other than biological sex.

One.

Thing.

One...

All females are women, biologically speaking.

Some men identify as women - not the same.

Some of you (not all of you) clearly don't recognize transwomen as women. So you're are transphobic. That is toxic. How can you not see that some women are born into the wrong body, they are a woman, but with male genitals etc etc .

Get over your selves

Let me see if I have this right.
I have to decide if my SEX and my 'gender identity' match.

Here we go.

SEX
So, I know what sex of body I have.
It has ovaries, fallopian tubes, a uterus, cervix, XX chromosomes.
We can describe the body characteristics of the two sexes, (female/male) based on whether a body has developed along a sperm-producing pathway, or an egg-producing pathway. And mine went down the egg producing one.
So, my body is female.
Agree?

'Gender Identity'
What you're saying is that each sexed body type (male-body, female-body) ALSO always has a totally separate (invisible) thing called 'gender' and THAT'S also male or female. And it either matches your egg-producing body, or it mismatches it.
Is that right?

And your 'gender identity' is NOT ABOUT JUST DESCRIBING YOUR BODY.
Am I right so far?

And we all have to work out whether we have this mysterious "female-gender-identity" that matches our ovary-type bodies, so that we can tell you if we've got a match between our bodies and this thing, or not, and then you can call us cisgender or not.

Because if we didn't know what gender identity we had, you'd have to call us something that only referenced our sex! Horror.
So, you're saying we HAVE to have both these two things, sex AND gender, and they're not the same thing as each other at all, so we really have to crack on and learn as much as possible about each gender-identity, male and female, so we can work out which one we are.

Where I get stuck, is that when I say
"I have two legs" (describing my body)
you wouldn't ask me
"what's your leg identity, and does it match the number of legs you were assigned at birth, or not?" (asking my identity)
And if I said
"I have blue eyes" (describing my body)
you wouldn't ask
"but what is your eyecolour-feeling identity, and does your identity match your actual eye colour, or not?" (Asking my identity)

But when it comes to me saying
"I have a female body, ovaries etc" (describing my body)
you seem to think it's valid to ask me
"and what is your female-gender-feeling-identity-thing and does it match your ovaries?"

And that, frankly, makes no sense.
I have two legs. There's no matching identity for that.
I have blue eyes. There's no matching identity for that.
I have ovaries. There's no matching identity for that.

What IS this mysterious, invisible "identity" that is supposed to match my ovaries and fallopian tubes? What IS the 'identity' that matches testicles and a prostate? Maybe I have one of those perhaps, if I only knew what that meant.
What even IS gender-identity?

Can you describe the characteristics of female-gender and male-gender so we can work out if a person has a match between their female-body and this invisible female-gender, or a mismatch?

Because all I can tell you about me is that I've got a female body. That's the only thing I can tell you. I've the same sex body as every 'trans-man', the same sex body as every 'non-binary menstruator' and the same sex body as every woman. That's all I know so far.

and I haven't the faintest idea what the difference is between a male gender-identity and a female one.

But as soon as you tell me, we'll all be a lot clearer.