History in the making! Watch Parliament Live at 2.30pm!

[Sunkisses]

According to @SexMattersOrg on Twitter the Govt have backed down on the MOMA (Maternity) Bill and will now use the word 'mother' not 'person' in the legislation!

Women did this! We are winning!

Tune in live here at 2.30pm to see history in the making: www.parliamentlive.tv/Event/Index/3ca1efa2-16a5-489d-a5a0-5d929bff81f6

You need an abortion if you don't want to become a mother.

Simples.

“Cotton ceiling” ? Is this one of those ridiculous phrases like chest feeding

To add to Hermit' s excellent post, it was meant to be an echo of glass ceiling in terms of something to smash through, with the cotton being lesbian women's underwear. Essentially how to overcome lesbian women's sexual boundaries. There have been actual funded conferences on how to achieve this.

I'll leave it to you to decide what this reflects about respect for women as potential sexual partners.

One sensitive poster thought that a specific penis was rejected and reported the post. Luckily the lesbian poster got a another chance and was able to state that she rejected all penis and that it wasn’t aimed at any particular penis.

Wtf? 😡 I reserve the right to reject any penis that I want to reject.

One sensitive poster thought that a specific penis was rejected and reported the post. Luckily the lesbian poster got a another chance and was able to state that she rejected all penis and that it wasn’t aimed at any particular penis.

A very fragile penis indeed.

One sensitive poster thought that a specific penis was rejected and reported the post. Luckily the lesbian poster got a another chance and was able to state that she rejected all penis and that it wasn’t aimed at any particular penis.

The 'sensitive' poster should have been told to get to fuck, doesn't matter if the rejection was aimed at a particular penis or every single penis, no qualification required or necessary.

These posters seem to know fuck all about fuck nothing. No wonder they cant string an argument together

Very true Datun, and funny how the majority of the people most upset by this are the ones who will never, ever be mothers or require maternity leave as they fail the crucial qualification by virtue of their sex.

I’ve spent a couple of hours reading through all the transcripts today, what a moment after so much darkness.

On the derail on connecting the word mother to the anti-abortion agenda. I was on a thread a few years ago where the view was strongly expressed that you became a mother when you delivered a live child and calling women mothers when they were pregnant or had lost the baby was sentimental falsehood that plays into the hands of anti-choice perspectives.

It affectedly me deeply. The rules seemed to have been decided. So I have never even mentally called myself a mother (2 losses) as a result.

Diversion aside...

It’s a great day for women (adult, human, females), mothers or not. Well done to all who contribute intelligent discussion rooted in biology and tenaciously fight on in the face of adversity.

you became a mother when you delivered a live child and calling women mothers when they were pregnant or had lost the baby was sentimental falsehood

Frankly, you are a mother during the 2ww when ttc as far as I'm concerned.

It's an interesting point.

Of course when a woman gets pregnant and wants the baby she thinks of it in terms of her baby. To say these women are not mothers if they lose the pregnancy, have a still birth etc is really horrible.

If a woman gets pregnant and wants an abortion, for obvious reasons she often prefers not to think of it in those terms.

These words are all very loaded and how women in different situations use them is really down to women.

I hate that the fact that women have different ways of relating to what's going on in their own bodies is being twisted and used by forced birth types (on the USA mainly) to support their anti woman views.

'Mother" is a term used for pregnant people by anti-choice activists and is a regressive step.'

Mother" is now the legal term for a pregnant woman (or man).

Only biological females can get pregnant. It's not a sex-neutral word.

It's in the maternity bill for MPs.

The word maternity doesn't seem to have been an issue?

Shouldn't it be maternity or paternity?

What would the sex neutral word be?
People-ternity? Birthing people bill?

There's never any follow through.

Because when you follow through it will turn the general public off.

The current equalities act has this (brief excerpt)

'View outstanding changesstatus warnings
17Pregnancy and maternity discrimination: non-work cases
(1)This section has effect for the purposes of the application to the protected characteristic of pregnancy and maternity of—
(a)Part 3 (services and public functions);
(b)Part 4 (premises);
(c)Part 6 (education);
(d)Part 7 (associations).
(2)A person (A) discriminates against a woman if A treats her unfavourably because of a pregnancy of hers.
(3)A person (A) discriminates against a woman if, in the period of 26 weeks beginning with the day on which she gives birth, A treats her unfavourably because she has given birth.
(4)The reference in subsection (3) to treating a woman unfavourably because she has given birth includes, in particular, a reference to treating her unfavourably because she is breast-feeding.
(5)For the purposes of this section, the day on which a woman gives birth is the day on which—
(a)she gives birth to a living child, or
(b)she gives birth to a dead child (more than 24 weeks of the pregnancy having passed).
(6)Section 13, so far as relating to sex discrimination, does not apply to anything done in relation to a woman in so far as—
(a)it is for the reason mentioned in subsection (2), or
(b)it is in the period, and for the reason, mentioned in subsection (3).'

Just to have all the relevant links in one place, so you don't have to search through this entire thread, I've put them in this one post.

So you can watch the entire thing again here: parliamentlive.tv/event/index/3ca1efa2-16a5-489d-a5a0-5d929bff81f6?in=14:32:30&out=17:23:22

Hansard: hansard.parliament.uk/lords/2021-02-25/debates/DFB70DF3-ABA0-4168-8DBF-DBDA63BA4AEE/MinisterialAndOtherMaternityAllowancesBill

Maya Forstater's live tweeting: twitter.com/MForstater/status/1364947739440734217
and threadreaderapp.com/thread/1364947739440734217.html

Jane Clare Jones: twitter.com/janeclarejones/status/1364950528384520196

and if you want to thank any of the peers who spoke up for women, their contact details are here: www.parliament.uk/business/lords/whos-in-the-house-of-lords/get-in-touch-with-members/

@ConservativesForWomen helpfully produced a list of the peers who spoke up for women on page 6 of this 10-page thread. I'll copy the list below, with their twitter addresses where available (or email/post a card using contact details in link above if not on twitter).

L Lucas
L Hunt of Kings Heath
L Craig of Radley
B Noakes
L Cormack
L Winston
B Nicholson of Winterbourne
L Dodds of Duncairn
L Mancroft
L Forsyth of Drumlean
L Morrow
B Finlay of Llandaff
B Meyer
B Fox of Buckley (p)
L Polak
B Uddin
B Altmann
L Triesman
L Balfe
B Hoey
L Lilley
B Deech
L Dobbs

@ladylilo2
@ProfRWinston
@BaronessDeech
@LordLucasCD
@LordPhilofBrum
@1SVN
@Baroness_Nichol
@lord_forsyth
@IloraFinlay
@Fox_Claire
@BaronessUddin
@rosaltmann
@DavidTriesman
@CatharineHoey
@dobbs_michael

@MadBadDaddy

Congratulations /s

The word 'mother' now applies to a parent legally recognised as a man (trans man), so you have succeeded in making 'mother' into a gender-neutral word.

Twasn't women did that.

Twas a transman - and he ain't happy about it!

Thanks, Sunkisses - for starting this brilliant thread and wrapping it up.

Might I suggest we raise three cheers to the peers!

Thanks for this thread OP, I really enjoyed the speeches and would have missed them otherwise.

Reading the McConnell judgement I got the distinct impression that the judge thought McConnell had hoodwinked the GRC providers. There was reference to a box ticking on a form to say that McConnell intended to live as a man forever, panel did not ask if he intended to get pregnant (why would they?) And McConnell didn't tell them. Very shortly after McConnell started IVF. The judge asked it be considered whether a fraud had been committed but the powers that be didn't go with it. I wonder if the forms and panel questions need amending to ask "do you plan on getting pregnant/ fathering a child?" Given that there can't be any assumptions anymore.

Thank you so much @Sunkisses for this joyful thread!

The celebration and happy atmosphere, especially of the early part of the thread, was so good to share!

#Mum is the word!

Thanks for the list OP and hurrah for the House of Lords.

No matter what anyone says about this, it's a significant feeling that some Grown Ups have finally spoken up.

According to Maternity Action the amendment will be debated in the House of Commons today.

No matter what anyone says about this, it's a significant feeling that some Grown Ups have finally spoken up.

It really is. I will never again question the role of the House of Lords. They provide important checks and balances.

I’ve had several lovely responses this morning from various HoL members I emailed my thanks to on Friday

MOMA Bill is back in the Commons this afternoon; list of speakers here:

commonsbusiness.parliament.uk/document/45568/html

Women's rights are human rights!