Posie Parker Zoom

[AdHominemNonSequitur]

Posie Parker has been warned by Zoom that her account may be suspended for promoting hate. Now she can sometimes go a bit far, but as far as I am aware all she does is deny TWAW, which is still supported by UK and probably US law. Are they going to ban the UK government when it debates trans rights too. This is absolutely terrifying over reach. Can anyone still be in denial about the deeply illiberal nature of this shit show. What have we let happen under our noses. What are we still letting happen? What is wrong with people? Why can't they see?

[AdHominemNonSequitur]

If they are not on male hormones, no issues what so ever. I doubt many of us agree with everything PP says. I'd much prefer they didn't feel they had to alter themselves medically at all, but if they do retain their fertility (WHICH IS NOT THAT LIKELY IF THEY POSTPONED PUBERTY WITH BLOCKERS) and want to go through the most female experience you can have, all power to them. As long as they don't try and reinterpret the English language and the words women as a sex class use to describe themselves.

[GemmeFatale]

Zoom, like most tech platforms, don’t allow under 16s to have an account. A parent’s account may be used by a child but the parent is expected to take responsibility and supervise said child.

[JayAlfredPrufrock]

You know, I can’t wait until all the trans folk will have transitioned pre puberty so we don’t have to put up with all this shit anymore.

[jj1968]

There are many people who have experience of growing up in oppressive regimes who are trying desperately to tell people this is happening. Here. Now.

Oh please, try being a homeless single mum in this country being interrogated about her relationships by the Jobcentre under the threat of benefit sanctions or prosecution, or a young black man living on a sink estate and stopped by the police every other day and you might get just a taste of what state oppression actually is. It's not being kicked off a privately owned website because you refused to keep to the rules.

[Clymene]

@jj1968

Should women who reject every aspect of their biology become mothers when they want to be fathers?

I'm curious why you think it's any of your business whether trans men choose to have kids or not?

You've obviously never been a pregnant woman or you wouldn't ask that

[jj1968]

You've obviously never been a pregnant woman or you wouldn't ask that

Why does pregnancy mean you become entitled to decide who is and isn't allowed to have children?

[PotholeParadies]

If Posie walked into her local library and started shouting trans women are men then she would likely be barred. If that meant her children were unable to use the library she would have no-one to blame but herself.

Of course in this case her potentially being banned from hosting zoom live webinars and having a profile on the site will not infringe on her children's education in the slightest.

Why are you switching to a library? Up and down this country, parents kick off violently in playgrounds at pick-up and drop-off. Their children are still allowed to attend school. They do not lose their statutory right to an education because their mum screamed abuse at someone else's.

I'm not sure why you're talking about libraries at all, but are you saying that if I shout anything in the library, my kids should be banned from it, also?

Crikey. Are they responsible for my library fines, too?

[Dalyesque]

@jj1968

There are many people who have experience of growing up in oppressive regimes who are trying desperately to tell people this is happening. Here. Now.

Oh please, try being a homeless single mum in this country being interrogated about her relationships by the Jobcentre under the threat of benefit sanctions or prosecution, or a young black man living on a sink estate and stopped by the police every other day and you might get just a taste of what state oppression actually is. It's not being kicked off a privately owned website because you refused to keep to the rules.

jj you mention the difficulties of claiming benefits etc with which I agree . However we then have people like you stating that it is oh so hard for people to get a GRC . Comparisons can go both ways.

[AdHominemNonSequitur]

@RealityNotEssentialism

I just saw the screenshot from 2018. That is pretty sobering.
I was ...wrung... wong.. Nope can't say it.

But that is pretty overtly transphobic.

[Clymene]

@jj1968

You've obviously never been a pregnant woman or you wouldn't ask that

Why does pregnancy mean you become entitled to decide who is and isn't allowed to have children?

The point>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>you

[Ereshkigalangcleg]

Comparisons can go both ways.

Quite. I made a similar one earlier, which of course has been ignored.

[OldLang]

Oh please, try being a homeless single mum in this country being interrogated about her relationships by the Jobcentre under the threat of benefit sanctions or prosecution

@jj1968

Eh? You realise this site is chock full of women who've had that very experience or similar? Hence why we are perfectly placed to build a community of experience and discuss the harm being inflicted on women across the board by this gender ideology shite.
Oh the irony of you relying on an example of the life experience of women to make a point about how not experiencing that makes you ill-placed to comment or pass judgement.

[AdHominemNonSequitur]

@jj1968

There are many people who have experience of growing up in oppressive regimes who are trying desperately to tell people this is happening. Here. Now.

Oh please, try being a homeless single mum in this country being interrogated about her relationships by the Jobcentre under the threat of benefit sanctions or prosecution, or a young black man living on a sink estate and stopped by the police every other day and you might get just a taste of what state oppression actually is. It's not being kicked off a privately owned website because you refused to keep to the rules.

In isolation Posie parker getting a Zoom warning for hateful conduct, is not an indication of a totalitarian state no. It's not in isolation.

Your examples are not state oppression, they are inadequate state welfare provision. It's subtely different.

[Mockolate]

I've been "a pregnant woman."
Not seeing why that has any relevance myself, unless you're implying that only women who have been pregnant can possibly understand because they know how it feels to be pregnant/all the crap that can come with pregnancy, and why would they want to put themselves through that?
Surely that's a personal decision, not a blanket generalisation "should be sterilized" like the screenshot upthread said.
Why are people defending that?
As for the library comparison upthread, it's pretty ironic for comments saying "points" ...>>>>>> you at people when it's whosshing over people's heads unintentionally or on purpose.
Yes, yes, it meant they're responsible for your library fines now.
Or maybe it was just saying that a RL example of a public place such as a library if you stood in the middle "doing a speech" you could be kicked out if you were deemed to be inciting towards a group of people.
Same would apply if they were deemed racist or homophobic.
Zoom being the online version, they're entitled to not host your views as well just like the library would.

[Gcnq]

@JustAmotherOne

There was that time she said that trans men should be sterilised. And repeated it when challenged.

But hey, let’s gloss over that again and make Posie the victim.

Err no she did not repeat it when challenged.
P.P thinks that if you do not want to be a woman, how can you logically want to go through pregnancy.
This is a perfectly acceptable question.

How can you force your child to call you "Dad" when you are the one who gave birth?"
Again, should be perfectly acceptable question.

Being banned from Zoom? For questions?

[FemaleAndLearning]

[quote AdHominemNonSequitur]@RealityNotEssentialism

I just saw the screenshot from 2018. That is pretty sobering.
I was ...wrung... wong.. Nope can't say it.

But that is pretty overtly transphobic.[/quote]
Is that a fake Posie account though? I know there have been several fake ones to allow screenshots like this?

[PotholeParadies]

Awesome, maybe I can get an answer that makes sense from you Mockolate.
We started this because I said that a household being banned from using zoom would not be a mere bagatelle. Because that would mean children of the household couldn't access online schooling.

We've now moved on to the idea that I might get ejected from using a library based on my behaviour.

But why would my children be banned from using the library? Mmm?

When you've answered that, we can go back to the original subject of children having a right to education. Why is it okay for them to be deprived of it because of a parent's behaviour?

[Mockolate]

P.P thinks that if you do not want to be a woman, how can you logically want to go through pregnancy
This is a perfectly acceptable question

You're right, that is a perfectly acceptable question, I wonder that myself, I don't pretend to understand as I'm not trans.
That comment upthread went beyond that though - is it acceptable to say should be sterilised?
Of course it isn't - or at least you'd think!!
Not the same.
At all.

[CheckOriginalSources]

Posie talked about this on mumsnet back in the day. You can still read the thread, but here’s a screenshot.

[PaleBlueMoonlight]

That tweet is not good. So either that tweet was an example of her speaking from the hip and not explaining well what she actually thought, or the tweet is without its context, or she absolutely meant it and then later resiled from that view. Because the thing is, whatever the truth of how that that tweet came to be, she does not believe that transmen should be sterilised, so why keep saying that she does?

[JustAmotherOne]

Very, very few UK children’s education organisations or services use Zoom due to complexities and vulnerabilities with security and access that were causing safeguarding issues.

Thousands of children have had no access to devices or internet access at all through the entire multiple lockdowns. Them, I’m concerned for.

If, and it’s a big if, Posie’s theoretical banning from Zoom were based on the IP address, and if (another really big if) their school uses Zoom, then recordings could be shared to the children via another platform. Schools routinely do this for children with patchy access, or multiple children all using a single device.

As with all tech platforms ever, if you can’t stick within their terms of use, you get warned, and potentially barred from service. Posie is no doubt pretty familiar with how that works, given how many platforms she’s burned through in the past few years.

One more thing.... it’s not silencing “women”. It’s silencing one specific woman, who has been consistently transphobic for years now, from using one tech platform, for breaking their terms of use.

[Delphinium20]

TL;DR Global companies seem to have too much control over speech.

Zoom is a California company and no law compels them to keep Posie as a paying customer. However, if Posie visited a California public library, she could use their Zoom account AND she could speak at the public library and say TWA"N"W all she likes because of our First Amendment. Now, I know this is a silly example because Posie can't exactly fly to California every time she wants to use Zoom.

But, we've failed to keep up with providing public spaces online, allowing private companies to provide them instead. We need places where freedom of speech laws would allow Posie to talk about almost anything. Thought I acknowledge freedom of speech vs public safety is an ongoing friction. For example, speech that is instigating violence (which, frankly, Posie has skirted with her idiotic suggestion to send armed fathers into school bathrooms).

I don't like everything Posie says, but I defend her right to speak her mind and I am very worried we don't have the public spaces to allow for this. Zoom isn't the problem - our international laws on shared platforms are.

[AdHominemNonSequitur]

I am hard line about free speech, I do not think that saying TW are not W is transphobic, but I do not deny that transphobia exists and there is no way I can rationalise the sentence " Women who think they are men should be sterilised" in any way other than overtly transphobic.

Was that what she was chucked off Twitter for?

I don't know what she said to get a Zoom warning for hateful conduct, but if it was that, then I am not feeling quite as disgusted with Zoom as I was before.

[JustAmotherOne]

“ Is that a fake Posie account though? I know there have been several fake ones to allow screenshots like this?”

I wonder what would ever be considered enough “proof” when the will to excuse, minimise or deny her actions, words and beliefs of so very very strong.

She said it, she meant it, and she went further and said trans people should not be allowed to be parents.

Some of us were here, in mn, and saw it all play out.

Off the hip/out of context tweet etc is not what happened here, however much FWR has bought into that myth.

[PotholeParadies]

JustAmotherOne

Finally, a semi-decent answer!

So, in short? It'll never happen, but if it did, it wouldn't be that bad, because other children have it worse?