Poor woman, she must have been so scared.

[TheLetterZ]

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-56071168

Another man who accidentally killed his wife as he ‘flipped’. She was trying to leave, he must have stopped her then strangled her.

I do hope that with the manslaughter sentence he will still have punishment but fear with diminished responsibility he won’t.

It makes me wonder if society is inherently sexist, how trial by jury can ever be fair in this sort of case. Juries reflect society, that's the point. So unless society changes these crimes will continue being seen as less than murder because "he had a moment of madness" or "he couldn't help it" type defences will be believed.

But then it's not like trial without jury is without its problems when the judges are very often old(er) white men.

I don't think it's fair to criticise the daughter. She's a victim here too. It's like when people are abused, physically, sexually or emotionally (or all three) by a family member, they often still love that person, despite knowing the harm that has been done to them.

The shame is all on the perpetrator.

These stories are so depressingly regular that I look at my teenage daughter and it strikes fear into my heart. Because these men are out there, in every part of society, and someone ends up in a relationship with them. And it could be any of us, or any of our daughters, friends or sisters.

Absolute madness. He must have had her locked in

Why do they keep getting away with it.

And to show what a loving husband he is, the report says "During the hearing, it was outlined how the 70-year-old was said to have barely left the side of his 67-year-old wife"
To me that suggests it must have been horrendous for her once he retired.

And yes, if he can "snap" so easily and with such a horrific outcome, I hope they are thinking about a psychiatric disposal (i.e. committing him to a secure psychiatric hospital).

AWFUL awful. RIP Ruth.

So "I flipped" is an excuse for murder?
Being stressed, depressed, anxious, sleep deprived are excuses for murder?

But despite women suffering equally from all of the above, there is an epidemic of men killing women.

Utter bastard and crap jury.

During the hearing, it was outlined how the 70-year-old was said to have barely left the side of his 67-year-old wife"

oh that poor woman

Poor Ruth.

That gave me the chills. Men's controlling behaviour is still misrepresented as love.

I was just thinking all the same things and thought well at least others feel the same and have posted on MN then I saw this thread is in feminism chat - but why isn't everyone ranting about it on AIBU and Chat, FFS even Relationships?

I read this earlier and had exactly the same reaction. I even scrolled back up the article to look at her face and silently send her deep sadness for what she was put through.

She was murdered. He chose to do what he did. I did think the daughter's comments were odd and a bit of a betrayal of her poor mother but she's probably going through unimaginable hell. I hope in time she feels strong enough to cut herself off from her evil father and build a beautiful life that he plays no part in.

I just don't think you put your hands around someone's throat unless you have a plan. Like, even if you flip, that's a conscious decision to put your hands around someone's neck. You do that if you decide you want to kill them and know you have the strength to do it. If you've just flipped out you throw something or stab them with a knife that you happen to be holding or you push them or punch them or grab them but no previously good, gentle person puts their HANDS on someone's NECK. And then chases them down and does it again. That is a choice. A murderous choice.

Poor Ruth. I'm so sorry she didn't get justice.

I read about this earlier and was absolutely appalled. He's a monster.

@RainingBatsAndFrogs

FFS.

Doesn't it take 3 minutes to strangle someone? 3 minutes without air? 3 minutes is a LONG time to be 'flipped'.

Yes. It's actually really difficult to strangle someone. Takes a lot of force, and as you say, 3 minutes.

This is fucking bullshit. After all thos time, we still have the "poor man, he just flipped, so out of character now he's ruinee his life how sad" trope. FUCK OFF with that.

@HopeClearwater

The judge directs the jury.

The judge cant direct the jury what to decide (believe me I sometimes really want to). Can't say - you must/should convict or acquit. You have to tell them what the law is, the jury decided it wasnt murder. The jury took 5 hours, that's not a very long wait for a murder trial. They are the ones who bought the "wouldn't hurt a fly" line.

I increasingly believe that the jury system is no longer fit for purpose.

There are going to be a lot of trials of lockdown domestic murderers coming up, are they all going to be excused due to juries believing that stress is a acceptable reason to murder your spouse? What justice is that for women?

The BBC need to take a look at themselves for the tone of reporting too

Awful. Maybe it's a case of 'can't unsee', but it seems recently there's little else on my local paper website but for femicides and domestic abuse court cases. I've never noticed so many. It's so upsetting.

I watched a trial and was astounded by the jury's decision.

I do not think juries are fit for purpose. Yes, panels of judges have their problems. However, at least judges have to set out their reasoning as to why they reached the decision they did. The reasoning can then be reviewed and appealed if it is clear that the judge has wrongly decided the case.

A jury, which is not properly trained in evaluating evidence and where members of a jury may be swayed or bullied by other members, is going to make bad decisions in a lot of cases.

@KindKylie

The BBC need to take a look at themselves for the tone of reporting too

Yes, I agree

I've noticed thst too @BraveBananaBadge its awful, and they all get to claim diminished responsibility. It sickens me.

I do worry about jury trials, there was a documentary on itv I think years ago. The crime was reconstructed but the jury was real. They let him off because a couple of very vocal men took over proceedings, but at the very end they showed what had really happened which is that the man had brutally murdered his wife in cold blood and then put on an act of contrition.

One juror, a woman with years of experience as a health visitor saw it right but was completely ignored by the other jurors.

Unfortunately it was years ago and I cannot remember the name of the series but it has always stayed with me. It opened my eyes to how easy it is for violent offenders to get away with ven the most heinous crimes.

RIP Ruth

@KindKylie

The BBC need to take a look at themselves for the tone of reporting too

Yes to this. No other murderers are presented with their mitigation.

When jurys are made up of misogynist men and women there is no hope for justice.

He told police he planned to kill himself too but "couldn't go through with it".

Kim Wall’s murderer said similar. Something like he was going to kill himself but had to come back (from the submarine) to feed his cat or see his parents first

"A pathologist found Mrs Williams died from pressure to the neck and had three fractured bones in her neck."

HE BROKE HER NECK WITH HIS BARE HANDS.

If that's not murder I don't know what is.

This seemed fitting on this thread. Pure misogyny.