SANDS sorry if upsetting

[InTheShadowOfTheMushroomCloud]

I have no words. This has upset me so much...

Oh, Aesop.

This is such a heartbreaking thread.

Thinking of all mothers who have lost children and babies tonight. Sending you peaceful wishes.

@ChattyLion

They are avoiding the word mother to not upset lesbian couples as in that case they are both mothers. We are told to do this in the birthing education field too but I only use this language when I have a lesbian couple in the group

That’s a good area of language to be mindful of. But couldn’t people use ‘birthing mother’, ‘the mum who’s carrying the baby’, ‘the mum who is pregnant‘ or similar to distinguish between the two mums? It doesn’t seem to do the job of being inclusive to have ‘mums’ without a female partner and then to put lesbian mothers into a subset of non-mums, when they are both mums^?

Very well.said.

ClaireP20
Please can I be your best mate? I agree with EVERY WORD.

Ha, of course I was a bit when I read it back and realised how much swearing there was, but this has really enraged me.

I'm glad SANDS have apologised, but a lot of damage has been done and women have had to see some truly awful, heartless and downright spiteful comments because of this.

The self-obsession is off the scale.

That first person hasn't even been pregnant let alone lost a child

In the SANDS bereavement support book, they dedicate a whole first 2 paragraphs to ensuring women who don't identify as mothers are not offended by..well, who knows...
Horrific.
Will attempt to post a link.

It's not to upset women in same sex relationships. Don't always assume there's a further agenda

Only one woman can give birth. One woman who miscarries or has a stillbirth - you can’t share this, not can you understand how the mum feels.

This is primarily about the mum - the one who has carried and lost a baby. If someone feels hurty feelings or left out as a result, well that’s their issue - and a selfish git if they feel they can start dictating terms.

The mum who is grieving for the baby who was part of their body is the focus.

@movingonup20

It's not to upset women in same sex relationships. Don't always assume there's a further agenda

If it's about lesbians, how come the word "woman" isn't used at all?

Not all lesbians... 🤔

To be fair, I think their explanation of their policy on using the word 'mother' in their note on language is good - they recognise why some people don't use that word, but explain why they are using it.

However, they haven't followed that policy in the tweet.

One of the problems with twitter is that it doesn't allow you to target your message and it doesn't allow enough characters for nuance - which is perhaps why its unsuitable for this kind of communication. It's not as though most people even use twitter.

Some people may not use the word mother not who the hell refers to theirself as a ‘birthing parent’. Maybe someone won’t want to be referred to as the parent ie a surrogate?

The mum who is grieving for the baby who was part of their body is the focus.

All parents are the focus. Sands choice.

She is the primary focus.

Call the office and tell them they near to hear from women (who birth)

@FairFridaythe13th

The point is for them to ‘be there for’ - roughly in this order:

1. the ‘person’ who carried and lost a baby - the mum
2. the other parent (male or female, doesn’t matter what they are called)
3. everyone else.

I certainly agree with the first point. The mother/expectant mother is the person most affected.

I have had miscarriages. Nobody was pregnant except me and nobody's body miscarried, except mine. This was a unique experience and nobody else involved had anything approaching my experience. The father's input was not as involved and certainly not the wider family.

I looked on Sands website and just scrolled around. I was wondering if I was looking for the unique support, where I as a mother who had lost a child would easily see it. No matter what arrangement, there is always (and sometimes only) a woman who was pregnant, maybe not so much anyone else on the scene. But no. The staff are all individually outlined in a click. But no easy found click for mothers in particular. Maybe it is not really aimed at the mothers/bereaved mothers. It reminded me the separate group AA run for the wider family.

To be fair, I think their explanation of their policy on using the word 'mother' in their note on language is good - they recognise why some people don't use that word, but explain why they are using it.

However, they haven't followed that policy in the tweet

Their own stated policy is to use the word partner, so as to be inclusive of lesbians. So all those defending this new wokespeak on those grounds are demonstrably wrong.

This is not an innocent mistake, it’s wholly deliberate. Whether it is a general change in policy, and whether they will listen to the women who have wholly valid objections, remains to be seen.

Given that this is part of a wider pattern - Tampax, cervical cancer charities, La Leche League etc - I think it's pretty sensible to suspect an agenda.
Have there been any changes in their senior management or trustees?

@Starch1e

Sands is a charity very familiar to me, after my son was stillborn 9 years ago it was the amazing local volunteers who helped me.

Some context to the tweet, if useful. Baby Loss Awareness Week (BLAW) runs 9-15 October every year. The theme this year was isolation, particularly in context of Covid-19. For the first time this year there was a series of online talks sponsored by NatWest. The talks included bereavement support in the workplace, support for partners and wider family, and a talk on trans parents, male couples and surrogates. Since this tweet was from 10 October it was part of the BLAW campaign.

I think it's been potentially useful to show more people the consequences of this under-hand movement to redefine the meanings of words or use alternatives that are so offensive. And I cannot believe the gall of some people insisting we have to describe them using the words they choose (or its literal hurt) but will not allow grieving mothers to choose how to describe themselves. More sunlight...

I'm going to wait and see what Clea and Sands say next, it's not the first time I've been disillusioned with the paid employees compared with the hundreds of volunteers.

The tweet was in reference to surrogacy as part of BLAW. That’s the context we should be looking at it and reading it in.

I read this from a different angle although I see points raised here. I have been involved with this Sands and other babyloss charities on the past and know that there has been lots of awareness recently about same sex couples, largely female female where the mum who didn't give birth has felt alienated.. I read it as being about that - for context I am a bereaved mother and whilst I find lots of language in similar posts..I really don't here.

Sorry typed that reply ages ago and it has just gone up see that point has already been made.

@ClaireP20

In the SANDS bereavement support book, they dedicate a whole first 2 paragraphs to ensuring women who don't identify as mothers are not offended by..well, who knows... Horrific. Will attempt to post a link.

Horrific is way over the top. What a thing to say about this charity!

They’ve looked after goodness knows how many families who have suffered baby loss, and you’re calling their opening statements horrific because it tries to cover all the people they want to reach and help?

I’m shocked actually by the judgement on this thread.

They are really clear about respecting the word mother.

They’ve apologised for not including in that tweet.

Even as a bereaved parent who has used and valued their support, I don’t get to dictate to them who they can and cannot include in their messaging, or what words they use to describe them.

Not that I would dream of doing that, because they’re a charity entirely created to help families survive baby loss, which is profoundly awful and hard to get through. And they do an awesomely good job of it.

They’ve said sorry. You’ve made your point, and been heard.

Can they not be left alone to get on with their work now?

@Sexnotgender

I see Freddy McConnell has weighed in.

Still salty about not being called father on the birth certificate I see.

Why would I listen to one word from someone who is verifiably a liar, about nearly everything ?

Comedic value? A lesson in hypocrisy?

I'm so pleased that SANDS apologised about this tweet. It really hurt me when I read about it in the paper.

The only thing I have from my baby is the experience of a mother - my body changes, the flutter in my tummy, the awful morning sickness. My memories are tied up with being a mother and then coping with my body changing again. It's not right that my experience should be erased for the sake of other people.

I know "non birthing parents" (fathers etc) and people who don't want to be call mothers will feel the loss but I'm sorry, that experience defined me and to have a charity that was there for me and I associate so heavily with that time, try to not use the word that is my only connection to my son. Well it brought me to tears.

So sorry for your loss from one mother to another.