Nigella Lawson - another disappointment

[Kit19]

Any celebrity who thinks we should all just be kiiiiinddd

[quote RedtreesRedtrees]@Sexnotgender thanks for confirming. So trans men compete with women.[/quote]
If they haven’t taken any performance enhancing drugs like testosterone then yes absolutely.

@RedtreesRedtrees yes - as long as they aren’t doping

thanks for confirming. So trans men compete with women.

If they're not on testosterone, absolutely.

If they are, then no. Cheats never prosper.

@RedtreesRedtrees yes - as long as they aren’t doping

"You" say they're women though.
So all trans men to play with the women then!
I mean, you say they're women, right?
No exceptions. Sticking to "their" space regardless of hormone levels/testosterone/whatever going by the logic on here.

Any women taking performance enhancing drugs should not be able to compete against other women. No matter how they identify.

@Quaagars trying to get to the bottom of how GC women see trans participation in sport but not getting very far. Except trans people could try orienteering. Bit of a waste of time this.

It's quite simple, they participate according to the same rules as everybody else. Sorry if that is too complicated for you.

Unlike your average transactivist parroting “acceptance without exception” , quaagars , gender critical feminists generally want to look at the nuance, and the real world impacts. Not all trans people are the same.

Did you see my suggestions, which address exactly these nuances? Any thoughts?

Seems pretty straightforward to me. Compete with your own sex unless you are taking drugs which will make it unfair for the other competitors.

Keep going, redtrees, please do keep going. Your style of argumentation is definitely winning hearts and minds

[quote RedtreesRedtrees]@Quaagars trying to get to the bottom of how GC women see trans participation in sport but not getting very far. Except trans people could try orienteering. Bit of a waste of time this.[/quote]
We’ve answered. You might not like it but you’ve been answered repeatedly.

Transwomen compete with their fellow males.

Transmen compete with their fellow females.

Identity is irrelevant. Sport is categorised by sex for safety and fairness.

Anyone taking any banned substances would obviously be banned from competing as per standard rules.

Really struggling to understand why you think this is complicated...

@DialSquare

Seems pretty straightforward to me. Compete with your own sex unless you are taking drugs which will make it unfair for the other competitors.

Yup. Really quite straightforward.

Except trans people could try orienteering

Yes, orienteering a good one
trying to think of another one, and failing now!
Competitive darts?
Golf maybe

But I don’t need to win any hearts and minds! Why would I?

Christ alive, it’s like trying to get a toddlers shoes on.

Transwomen compete with their fellow males

Transmen compete with their fellow females

Ah, see, you must have missed where there seems to be stipulations on that - trans men are apparently allowed to play with women as "you" say they are women.

OK

But then we have some posters disagreeing with you saying no, trans men are at an advantage, they have to play with the men!
Can't have it both ways

Christ alive, it’s like trying to get a toddlers shoes on.

Yup
That works both ways lol

Michelle, if only real life was that simple.

Please can you explain what you mean here in relation to my comment?

Crazy golf maybe, although I’m sure we’ll be told they have some kind of advantage over us.

@Quaagars

Transwomen compete with their fellow males

Transmen compete with their fellow females

Ah, see, you must have missed where there seems to be stipulations on that - trans men are apparently allowed to play with women as "you" say they are women.

OK

But then we have some posters disagreeing with you saying no, trans men are at an advantage, they have to play with the men!
Can't have it both ways

Because no athletes are allowed to dope with testosterone.

Testosterone use gives an advantage.

So trans men not using testosterone- fine

Trans men using testosterone: not fine according to current anti doping rules.

@RedtreesRedtrees

But I don’t need to win any hearts and minds! Why would I?

I just want someone to come on here with a coherent argument. You said you are GC yesterday in an attempt at sarcasm but you've just said that transmen are women so sounds like you agree with us. So what is your point here?

But then we have some posters disagreeing with you saying no, trans men are at an advantage, they have to play with the men!

Try separating in your mind the TM who are taking drugs that would not be allowed in the female category, and the TM who aren't.

TM are female, and so have full access to the female sports category unless they are taking drugs that any female would be unable to participate in competitive sport with.

The same rules apply to them as to everyone else. Sport is separated by sex, and without medication that presents an unfair advantage. It's not complicated.

But I don’t need to win any hearts and minds! Why would I?

Oh, so you aren't trying to persuade people of the merits of the non-GC position. That does explain things.

Now if wilful misrepresentation were an Olympic sport, we’ve got some real medal prospects here.

Crazy golf maybe

Love a game of crazy golf, not played that for ages
Can't see how that one would be a prob, I mean whether male or female nobody whacks the ball that hard, you'd take the little windmill out lol
Competitive crazy golf for trans people
Sorted!