Young women don't know what a woman is

[BlackForestCake]

This is absolutely staggering.

The latest poll commissioned by Wings over Scotland on the subject of self-ID, finds that all demographics in their majority believe a woman is an adult human female.

Except young women.

"The 16-34 female demographic actually voted by a narrow six-point majority that a person’s sex has absolutely nothing to do with biology. Even the next-closest group (young men) was a staggering FORTY points adrift from that view (net -34), and middle-aged women were close behind them at a net -36. Among women over 55 the margin against self-ID was a crushing 62 points (over 4:1 against), with older men at a breathtaking 10:1."

wingsoverscotland.com/abolishing-women/

Again deliberate misrepresentation. They are not told they are ‘born in the wrong body’ and that they can get to be their true selves by chopping off some functioning body parts. But then you know that.

I understood we were talking about children without disabilities being gaslighted and groomed into believing that they've been born in the wrong body? But I know from bitter experience that once a certain poster turns this into something about their own experience, the derail will go on and on and on.....

Off to the dementors thread ...

Binterested

How am I misrepresenting what was said?

You are focusing on one tiny phrase (the not being born in the wrong body) which we don't even know was said by the person quoted and conveniently ignoring the part I'm disagreeing with - the part about telling children with disabilities that they must accept their bodies and everything that comes along with them. That's what I disagreed with - not misrepresenting anything. I'm disagreeing with the message in that statement which, as a person with a disability, I am allowed to do. I think everyone should be presented with all of the options, including learning to accept your body as it is, and then letting the individual decides how they would like to proceed. That's not misrepresenting anything. That is disagreeing with a statement that has been made.

One group have healthy bodies - the other don’t. One may need medical intervention. The other doesn’t. Neither group is born in the wrong body.

As for ‘focusing on one tiny phrase’ - since it’s at the heart of the trans agenda it is quite important and I will call it out wherever I see this ‘wrong body’ ideology is at work.

Also calling out your timewasting interventions. Off on a zoom call now so you’ll have to see if you can find another constructive discussion to disrupt.

Then that post shouldn't have been raised on here should it? If you are only prepared to talk about healthy bodies? Why raise the subject of children with physical disabilities at all if it's irrelevant to the thread?

But it was you hooves I was reply8nh to

Hearhooves do you think it's helpful to children, whether disabled or not, to teach them that they may have been 'born in the wrong body'?

I think if people decide that they don't accept their bodies, for various reasons, and there are ways to be able to change the body then that's up to the individual. That's not saying that it should be rushed into, or that people should be pushed into it but I think you all keep holding up the "born into the wrong body" is ignoring what people are saying. They are saying that there's a mismatch between what their body looks like and what emotionally or internally they feel it should look like. If they decide that they want to have surgery or take hormones to change the appearance of their body then in my opinion that's between them and their doctors because like hell would I accept or stand for anyone else telling me what I was or wasn't allowed to do with my body so I'm not about to tell anyone else what to do with theirs.

It would be useful if you could answer the actual question because that's not what was asked.

I think if people decide that they don't accept their bodies, for various reasons, and there are ways to be able to change the body then that's up to the individual.

You're presumably talking about adults here, and adults can of course choose to have cosmetic surgery. I was talking about children, who are being encouraged to have a 'gender identity' and then told that if their body doesn't match their self-defined 'gender identity', then they can have medical treatment to fix their body.

Children are being taught that they can be 'born in the wrong body'. Do you think this is a good idea?

There is a degree of body changing that should be allowed under the banner of "I don't like my body". Tattoos for example are regulated in many countries with restrictions for under 18's being common

When it comes to a teenage girl having a dislike of her changing body, chopping it about seems to be a very strange thing to permit, when we can see, from the evidence of past generations, that the girl will grow into her body quite ok. Many women know that time of life, remember it well . And are here to tell the tale

Just because they don't like their body is no reason to allow a child surgery.

Surgery to help overcome a disability , to make something which all can see is materially better is rather different from surgery that many see as setting that child up for a lifetime of health problems . Surgery to fix something which all agree is broken is different to surgery to break a fit and healthy and fully functioning body

Sorry, but I don't believe that children are being encouraged to have a gender identity. Who is it that is encouraging them to have this?

I'm also not only talking about adults no, in regards to medical treatment to change your body and I'm also not only referring to cosmetic surgery either.

In my opinion, it's not my place to have an opinion on what anyone else does with their body. If they are under 18 then decisions about their medical care should be as a result of discussions between parents, doctors and the young person, not Joe Public.

🤦‍♀️ still not actually answering the question.

What do you think the mermaids jellybaby gi joe and barbie stuff was about if not teaching kids about gender identity?

No idea what it was about. I have no experience of it so don't feel qualified to give an opinion.

Whilst each individual case should be private, basically I disagree with you

I think as society we agree what is acceptable and what isn't

We expect the medical profession to be open and their choices and practises reviewed openly. This is how best practise is developed and it is how we monitor that all is being done according to best practise

Things kept between a small group of people leads to unacceptable things happening. Sects developing.

So if it is becoming more common for children to get "treatment" for gender issues, we as society need to think if that is right .

Be kind, tolerant, nice those messages get through which is great but don't let others take you for a doormat seems to be forgotten. So depressing.

I'm not sure about tbh. You want public opinion to sway how drs treat patients? That's not working out too well in some states in America is it, where abortion is now banned.

I think I'm happy to let doctors decide on treatment plans.

In my opinion, it's not my place to have an opinion on what anyone else does with their body.

I'm sure you don't actually mean that? People do horrible things with their bodies.

Children are encouraged to have gender identity by society at large

People see a baby in pink and they treat it differently to a baby in blue ..you pretty girl , you strong boy...immediately rewarding different characteristics

And it's been shown that it's the child's sex and not the child's personality that is affecting how adults interact with the child

My experience is that the rise of advertising and social media has made this even worse in recent years. And it's worse in the UK than Germany where at least a wider range of clothing is available le for both sexes ...not pink sparkles for girls and grunge for boys

Hooves, please can you answer whether you think children should be taught that they can be 'born in the wrong body'? That is what the initial post was about.

Question still hasnt been answered by the way:

Children are being taught that they can be 'born in the wrong body'. Do you think this is a good idea?

Yes, public opinion must sway how doctors treat patients. Public opinion determines how much we are prepared to pay in taxes to support the NHS which in turn determines the value of a years life and hence the range of treatments that are available

Although in this case, the scientific opinion should have the biggest influence.

Yes I agree America is making backwards choices , but that is the risk of democracy .

Having children, hitting infertility, menopause, lower wages post childcare, caring for older parents, breast/ovarian cancer etc tends to happen later in life. I wasn’t abused as a teen and had a very nice sheltered upbringing. Only realised female vulnerabilities aged 30. Up till that point I was extremely naive and believed the best of everyone

Of course they are - they have assemblies, workshops, lobby groups going in to show them gingerbread/jelly babies, stonewall are paid to advise, packs sent out to schools... it’s all over the place!