Young women don't know what a woman is

[BlackForestCake]

This is absolutely staggering.

The latest poll commissioned by Wings over Scotland on the subject of self-ID, finds that all demographics in their majority believe a woman is an adult human female.

Except young women.

"The 16-34 female demographic actually voted by a narrow six-point majority that a person’s sex has absolutely nothing to do with biology. Even the next-closest group (young men) was a staggering FORTY points adrift from that view (net -34), and middle-aged women were close behind them at a net -36. Among women over 55 the margin against self-ID was a crushing 62 points (over 4:1 against), with older men at a breathtaking 10:1."

wingsoverscotland.com/abolishing-women/

In the US court case concerning the right of some male athletes to compete in women's sport, the judge has prohibited the young women Selina Soule, Alana Smith and Chelsea Mitchell's legal team from describing the athletes as male.

District Judge Robert Chatigny "What I’m saying is you must refer to them as “transgender females” rather than as “males.” Again, that’s the more accurate terminology, and I think that it fully protects your client’s legitimate interests. Referring to these individuals as “transgender females” is consistent with science, common practice and perhaps human decency. To refer to them as “males,” period, is not accurate, certainly not as accurate, and I think it’s needlessly provocative. I don’t think that you surrender any legitimate interest or position if you refer to them as transgender females. That is what the case is about. This isn’t a case involving males who have decided that they want to run in girls’ events. This is a case about girls who say that transgender girls should not be allowed to run in girls’ events. So going forward, we will not refer to the proposed intervenors as “males”; understood?"

The judge frames accurate description of sex as bullying which risks civility & 'public decency':

"So if you feel strongly that you and your clients have a right to refer to these individuals as “males” and that you therefore do not want to comply with my order, then that’s unfortunate. But I’ll give you some time to think about it and you can let me know if it’s a problem. If it is, gosh, maybe we’ll need to do something. I don’t want to bully you, but at the same time, I don’t want you to be bullying anybody else. Maybe you might need to take an application to the Court of Appeals. I don’t know. But I certainly don’t want to put civility at risk in this case."

www.nationalreview.com/news/attorneys-for-connecticut-high-school-runners-ask-judge-to-recuse-after-he-forbids-them-from-describing-trans-athletes-as-male/

current thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3906232-Attorneys-for-girls-in-US-sports-case-must-refer-to-males-as-transgender-females

Referring to these individuals as “transgender females” is consistent with science

This isn't true. Scientifically speaking the term "transgender females" would describe the group of people generally referred to as transmen.

Better ‘female’ than ‘woman’ though...

So the assertion is that "trans women are women" and also female?

This was also the desired outcome by Scottish Trans Alliance from a Scottish Bill in 2017/18.

Fairplay for Women
'Like a thief in the night: The Scottish bill that stole the word woman'
(extract)
Last year while we were all looking the other way and distracted by the UK government’s proposals to reform the Gender Recognition Act the word woman was stolen from us. It was sneakily done by the Scottish parliament and hidden behind a smoke screen. That smoke screen was The Gender Representation on Public Boards Bill.

The Bill introduced the ‘gender representation objective’ – a target that women should make up 50% of non-executive board membership.
The purpose of this bill was admirable. It was to help women overcome the institutional sexism we suffer due to our sex. Positive action to redress the imbalances that have arisen from centuries of historical disadvantage. It was to acknowledge the reality that institutionalised inequality and sexist attitudes stop most women from reaching their full potential in public life. Financial barriers, income inequality, the gender pay gap, sexist attitudes, gender stereotyping, women’s disproportionate share of caring responsibilities, the undervaluing of women’s paid work, and media portrayals of women, to name but a few influences, all play a role in the sexism that prevents a fair number of women being involved in public life.

But in a cruel twist of irony it was also to be the perfect trojan horse to steal the very meaning of the words woman and female from us.
It all started early last year. The Scottish Government consulted on the draft bill between 5 January 2017 and 13 March 2017. Quietly and without fanfare. Non existent media coverage. No one was that bothered. Only 101 responses to the consultation, 66 from groups or organisation and 35 from individuals. Compare this to the >15000 responses received for the Scottish consultation for reform of the Gender Recognition Act this year. This one slipped by unnoticed." (continues)
fairplayforwomen.com/scottish_stole_woman/

The definition of transgender female is of or denoting the sex who can bear offspring and whose gender identity correlates to society's idea of masculinity.

How can female be of or denoting the sex who produce sperm???

It's insane.

Humans are mammals. Female mammals are not the ones that produce sperm.

Humans are mammals. Female mammals are not the ones that produce sperm.

Women are adult human females. Adult human females are women.
Men are adult human males. Adult human males are men.

This is all.

I do think there are some young women who believe there is no real difference. Weird, hard to imagine, but it seems to be what I see.

There is a bit in a C.S. Lewis book or essay (I think - I may be misremembering) where he talks about younger people being used to holding together bits of contradictory "truth" and not really expecting them to fit together - he puts this down to education, and I think he's right.

You're in Canada, right? Never went to school there but I was briefly in an American school age 8 and remember them having a book club for us, it was through one of those order a few to start with and they'll send you more monthly old school book clubs that you used to see ads for in magazines, so reading for pleasure was actively encouraged and the school was helping to facilitate it for the kids.

I think there is a lot that comes down to the teachers you happen to get. Some are great. American schools seem very variable - some are quite good and some terrible. I think here in Canada it is a little more even but still not great. Many people in education now seem to think of literature as not important or not real - it's all about STEM.

It's also that the teachers once you get to middle school are hampered by poor reading skills from primary school, so it's difficult to have the kids all reading the same book, or even similar levels of books. Or reading a lot - some are very slow. This comes down to the way they teach reading, there are many kids around 9 or 10, especially boys, who suddenly fall behind because they haven't really the skills and have been faking it. A lot of the kids I see have been memorising words and depend on pictures and such, but can't cope once they are expected to read in greater amounts or words they don't know or without visual clues. They also don't teach the mechanics of writing much now which impacts reading a lot, but no one seems to want to admit it.

A teacher who is really good can make a huge difference but some kids don't ever meet one.

Some people do have a quite touchingly innocent belied that if we give up woman they will let us keep female.

In reality the only thing they will give us is "cis", and most of us don't want it.

Give up on the definition of woman and female, she, her, girl, mother, daughter, niece, are all given up to men.

It's like pulling out a key piece in Jenga, once you do it the whole thing falls down. And the people pushing for the appropriation of the word woman know that.

Yes. They don't want there to be any exclusive words for the ova-producers because any such word excludes them.

I don't really need the word 'female'. 'Woman' is enough. whilst 'female' just sounds like 'girly'. But then, to mangle a phrase 'both words are taken'.

Goosefoot I can't lay my hands on Out of the Silent Planet just now, but Lewis certainly says something of the sort there.
But I think you are thinking of The Screwtape Letters when he talks about people in the past knowing 'pretty well when a thing was proved and when it was not; and if it was proved they really believed it. They still connected thinking with doing and were prepared to alter their way of life as a result of a chain of reasoning...Your man has been accustomed, ever since he was a boy, to have a dozen incompatible philosophies dancing about together inside his head.'
Lewis credits the Press and other sources.
Oddly familiar, isn't it?

And yet, ironically, he was talking about religion.

CBA to look it up, but isn’t it the older devil saying ‘ Remember you are there to confuse him! The way you younger devils talk, anyone would think you were there to teach.’

Do you believe for a second that those young women who you recognise as intelligent really think that you could be one of them? If so, you are more foolish than they are.

No need to be rude. It's something that is discussed on here daily. Young women seem to believe and will passionately argue that men can be women. It's setting this generation of girls up for failure as even great qualifications etc can't outweigh the downsides of having a childlike sense of reasoning or being as gullible as a child. I don't think any men believe that crap - well, maybe only a few of the woke bearded types but most men would never sleep with anyone who has or had ever had a penis.

I think it is a great and unfortunate irony that identity politics has led to this because the origins were in feminism and liberation of women from what I can see - intersectional feminism etc. It has been stolen and turned on women and now it's perhaps the biggest threat to women's rights that exists.

And yet, ironically, he was talking about religion.

Why is that ironic?

well, maybe only a few of the woke bearded types but most men would never sleep with anyone who has or had ever had a penis.

Exactly. They don't really believe it.

In reality the only thing they will give us is "cis", and most of us don't want it.

In the long run, it doesn't matter what you call yourself. If you use a word to differentiate between you and transwomen, they will want that. Any distinction is anathema.

As soon as the distinction is made and cemented, it's targeted. As soon as 'cis woman' starts to denote actual women, across-the-board, the distinction is unbearable.

See India Willoughby calling themself a cis woman.

Cis is only useful if it refers to a very small subset of women. If it refers to all women, it might as well be the word woman.

well, maybe only a few of the woke bearded types but most men would never sleep with anyone who has or had ever had a penis.

Like the man who said "Transwomen are women...except for relationship purposes."

I feel like I blinked and missed a whole movement. As far as I knew a few years ago everyone 'woke' was in agreement that there's no such thing as boys' clothes/toys/personalities or girls' clothes/toys/personalities or even male/female brains (apart from the massive generalisations that mean nothing on an individual level) and all of a sudden the clothes/toys/personalities you like/have rule over everything and determine your physical body.

Yes I know what you mean, popehilarious.

all of a sudden the clothes/toys/personalities you like/have rule over everything and determine your physical body.

And the people saying this insist that they're not reinforcing gender stereotypes.

Exactly. They don'treallybelieve it.

I don't think even the beardy ones would be prepared to take one for the team (a cock that is) if it came down to it, to be honest! They just know they aren't likely to ever have to actually 'walk the walk' in this way.

popehilarious I used to know a young woman who would share things on Facebook along the lines of it's ok for boys to play with dolls etc. Yet then saw no irony in posting TWAW. 😣