Julie Bindel on twitter

[Anonymouswasawoman]

Did her account get deleted?
twitter.com/bindelj/
Twitter is telling me it doesn't exist

I don't agree that anonymity per se means you are more likely to rude and forthright.

I think feeling very confident and being pissed off does. If you are anonymous, so not fearing that your opinion will run you foul of your employers social media rules, you may feel more confident, but equally, you may be a well known individual, with kudos from the wider community of feminists and letters after your name, and feel confident to speak harshly because of that.

Look, I don't give that much of a fuck if women are being arseholes. Because I understand that women are whole human beings, capable of being arseholes just like every other whole human being. I can be an arse, you can be an arse, Captain Tom can be an arse, JK Rowling can be an arse.

It's not always helpful, and sometimes it is. But it's the reality whatever. This idea that anon people are more rude, or more prone to ill disciplined outbursts or unwise statements than those who are known is utter crap.

I don't expect anything like perfection from any woman fighting for her rights and the rights of other women. I'm really not bloody sure why anyone does.

Nooooooooo Julie Bindel is one of my favourite writers and speakers. I will miss her
on Twitter. I don't go on there loads but didn't notice her Tweeting anything controversial (or no more than normal). I hope she's decided to hide her account for a while rather than it being a ban.

I think there has been some research about behaviour with anonymity, and it does seem to have a disinhibiting effect. I'm afraid I don't remember the details but I imagine it would be easy enough to find.

Yes, I understand about the notion of disinhibition. And I'm sure being anon can be a factor, but as I said, there are other things which can foster a certain disinhibition in what you are prepared to say, and I suspect that feeling like you're all out front and have nothing to lose by verbally ripping women to bits who have already made it clear that they aren't in a position to openly answer back properly may well have a similar effect.

Ego, a false sense of security, a quick temper etc. Lots of things.

My basic point here is not that people haven't been rude,or even that they should or shouldn't be rude. I am irked about the preaching against divisiveness while setting up an arbitrary divide.

All very well saying 'we should work together to persuade' but it just looks like posturing if you add 'but not you, you're too gauche'

Oh, I think complaining that people are setting up a divide is useless. People disagree and they need to work out ideas.

Where it gets problematic on places like Twitter is when you have people essentially offering nothing constructive but simply mocking or picking at people, or not listening to what people have actually said or responding to it because they are point scoring. Or someone decides they don't think a particular discussion is worthwhile so they deliberately impede it.

Knowledge of disinhibition is mostly personally useful really, it's useful to think, would I say this to a person in person? Is this constructive at all?

Well most people know my opinion of twitter is snake's-belly low, so I won't disagree that it's an horrendous platform for constructive conversation.

But your final paragraph is my point, too. I might reflect on my own tone and decide to shift away from rudeness. (It does happen!) I am on very wobbly ground when I start trying to impose that reflection on others.

I encountered McKinnon and genuinely believed them to be a thought-experiment

That always makes me laugh (in a good way) when you say that, @DrLouiseJMoody

But if you've ever been to a US academic conference in the humanities, you will know how seriously even the nicest American academics
even US professor who are my good friends take themselves & their work. I'm not a philosopher, but I don't imagine big philosophy conferences are much different. So to assume that a very self-important person is a thought experiment is just the most blissful deflation of that person I could imagine! Brava!

I think there's a certain amount of fair enough criticism to all & by all - having been doxxed & had my (unwanted) moment of notoriety, I just don't know how you Louise, or Kath Stock or Julie Bindel or the others cope. I almost didn't - what kept me going was not letting the bastards grind me down.

On the other hand, having such public platforms may allow such people to (probably fairly unconsciously) feel that what they say should be accepted without question. I know being a senior academic and corrupting teaching young minds for 30 years means I don't like being told I'm wrong!

Let many flowers bloom. We have to hang on to the one fact - incontrovertible IMO - that we are not each others' enemies. We all know who the real enemy is.

I do feel sure that Julie will be back.

It must be very intense to live so much of your life on Twitter, let alone the amount of abuse she receives on a daily basis. She often shares things about her home life as well as her activism, and it's probably not a bad idea to have a break from SM.

Best regards Julie, Kathleen, Louise and other 'out there' feminists if you're reading this thread.

Julie Bindel shoots from the hip and sometimes I think she's reckless. But I imagine those same qualities gave her the courage to come out as a lesbian 40-odd years ago and to speak out on transgender issues when most of us were still going, 'Eh?' or 'Where's the harm?'

If it wasn't for anonymous posters on here I would have never caught on to any of this. So I'm hugely grateful and I understand the need for anonymity - and I choose it myself. I can also understand why Bindel gets impatient with it, even while simultaneously rolling my eyes and thinking, 'Fucks sake Julie!'

I also cannot remember a time when feminists haven't argued and fallen out, vociferously and even viciously. I suppose the difference is that it never used to happen so publicly.

I also cannot remember a time when feminists haven't argued and fallen out, vociferously and even viciously. I suppose the difference is that it never used to happen so publicly.

Well, if anything positive can be taken from these bloody awful spats, it's that for a significant amount of time, no one gave a shit about needing to discredit a resurgent feminist movement, because there was no point.

Nowadays anti-women people find themselves needing to pay attention because when we do organize, we bloody well get shit done.

Luffs you back Moody, you speak as you find

I think Julie is (sort of) back. Also wanted to say luffs back to you Louise. You're a star.

We have to hang on to the one fact - incontrovertible IMO - that we are not each others' enemies. We all know who the real enemy is. this this this!

It's interesting, I think because I found mn before I even understood twitter (took me a looong time to work out what a hashtag actually was/ did) on my anon account I'm actually still respectful and patient (I think!) I just can't be open on my prof account.

I'd have left JJ to it. Only way to peak some.

Another reason I'm anon is that I need to be able to be "under cover" actually in my professional life. I find out more

DrL, I didn't know you picked all
This up from here, cool! Luffs you back!

JB'll come back, Twitter is addictive!

Anon accounts can also whistle blow more from their pov, on the coal face. Anon accounts are necessary.

I rather like it that women are bold enough to act like people in public. Though I dislike the tendency to pile on when everything that is worth saying has been said.
I use my name on twitter because I have nothing to lose, so I can afford to be bold.

We all know who the real enemy is.

The Judean People's Front!

Splitters

With regard to real names - it's also the case that there are people who are required in their work not to make public statements about political issues. They can have private opinions and such but they have to be neutral publicly. (Public servants for example, people in the military sometimes.) The internet just isn't a private space in the sense that they can discuss controversial issues as themselves.

Bindel has disappeared before of her own accord and has then come back (she needs Twitter, obvs!).

Why? Seriously, why would an author with multiple books to her name and articles published daily need Twitter? I don't get that tbh.

As far as anonymous accounts go I’ve never seen anyone with a blue tick complain when anonymous accounts are praising their work, re-tweeting their articles, buying their books, reporting trolls on their behalf, watching their YouTube interviews, and buying tickets to hear them speak. So if they’re okay with all that, it seems disingenuous to only complain when anonymous accounts disagree with or push back against blue-tick accounts. Anonymous accounts aren’t a fan club and they shouldn’t be chastised when they don’t behave like one.

I like Julie Bindel, Kathleen Stock et al but the posts here have done more to open my eyes than anyone on Twitter.

The other anon aspect - my friend recently went back into front line social work and had to sign some sort of disclaimer that she wouldn't say anything political on social media.

Most teachers on Facebook have changed their names to be unrecognisable and undiscoverable as Mrs Doodah even without any GC opinions. We know how university lecturers are held hostage.

I've become extremely opinionated in real life on this and a range of other things in education, but we get regular online harms training and frankly I'm not in a position to not be anon.

Sorry just seen Goose's post. But yes, I was taken aback, as was she, about how they presented that directive to her.

It is difficult. I don’t post as frankly as I would like on twitter for various reasons. Partly I don’t want abuse, I have PTSD from an assault so would find threats very, very difficult to take. Partly I fear reprisals for the rest of my family, I have young teen daughters, so have to think of them, plus my DH’s work. We have an extremely uncommon name, so are identifiable and it would be easy to find out where we live.

This makes me feel uncomfortable and cowardly, when I see other women getting abusive responses on twitter, and that in itself is hard to to deal with, so the whole thing is very complicated. I want my daughters to see me standing up for women and girls, yet I want to keep us all safe. It is dismal.