Meet the Other Phone. Flexible and made to last.

Meet the Other Phone.
Flexible and made to last.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Robert Webb in the Times

158 replies

JustTurtlesAllTheWayDown · 12/04/2020 09:33

Interesting interview with Robert Webb in the Times. I had no idea he'd been so ill.
He talks about the pile on he got for criticising Mermaids last year and whether he regrets it (no) and says that you can't acknowledge that there are competing rights without being framed as a bigot.
He also says it had real life professional consequences (which I see one of our monitors is already gloating about on twitter)
www.thetimes.co.uk/article/d63efd46-7982-11ea-b535-542bda4e2a5f?shareToken

OP posts:
MermaidUnicorn · 12/04/2020 10:39

Oh boo the share token doesn't work. I enjoyed his autobiography, he's definitely one of the good guys (patriarchy is 'the trick').

BringbackLang · 12/04/2020 10:44

Excellent article. I wish him all the best.

The thing about the crowing on Twitter. They may think they riding high at the moment and can gloat all they want but one day they won't have the power the TRA's currently seem to enjoy. People will look back and history will not treat them kindly.

R0wantrees · 12/04/2020 10:47

extract from Times article:

"The tweet that landed him in really hot water was one in December 2018, in support of an article by Janice Turner in The Times, criticising Mermaids, the charity for transgender children, for being out of step with the NHS. Turner had pointed out that the NHS protocol for children is “watchful waiting” whereas Mermaids pushes for the American “affirmation” model in which any child who declares that they are trans must be treated as such. “This won’t make me popular in certain quarters but f* it — I’m with Janice,” Webb tweeted, adding, “I’ve talked to some really nice trans people here & they have my solidarity if they want it. But Mermaids sucks.”

It provoked a sustained pile-on from transgender rights activists, which had, he says, “real-life professional consequences”. I ask if he regrets the tweet, and he hesitates for six uneasy seconds.

“Not really. But on the other hand I started to say something, and then I stopped, and that means that everyone can rush in and fill in the blanks. ‘He’s a transphobe, he’s a motherf***’. Once you say ‘I’m not transphobic, but … ’ it’s a disaster. It just seems unlucky that you can’t acknowledge that there are going to be competing interests here and there without that becoming, ‘You are a bigot.’ ”

The online onslaught must have been particularly upsetting for someone who has always seen himself as a lefty progressive. He joined the Labour Party in his teens, but quit when Jeremy Corbyn became leader. At the last election, he says, “I didn’t even vote for them. I voted Green.” He looks dejected. “I didn’t really engage with the election and I choose not to think about Donald Trump. I’m not interested in the Labour leadership election. I don’t want to think about Brexit. I can’t bear it. I just don’t think I can afford to invest emotionally in that any more.”

It doesn’t sound like a rant so much as a lament, and he adds softly, “I don’t feel very proud of it, disengaging. But at the moment it’s partly a self-protective thing. I can’t face it. I’ve got these great kids, this lovely wife. Turns out I’m not going to die. I’ve got the job I always wanted to do. I don’t need to think about politics all the time.” (continues)

Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g · 12/04/2020 10:59

What a good article. I had no idea he'd been ill, or that he was such a heavy smoker and drinker. Hope he's completely safe in self-isolation now and keeping off the booze.

This bit is Grin: He did consider AA meetings, but worried about how anonymous he could be. “Without mentioning any names, it was suggested to me by someone that someone else ran their own group full of someones. I met the someone that runs the someones, and he invited me along but I didn’t go.” Why not? He allows a comic pause. “Because Russell Brand would be there. I think I’d rather have liver failure.”

MermaidUnicorn · 12/04/2020 11:06

Thanks TheProdigal

Haggisfish · 12/04/2020 11:07

He’s fab. Hope he doesn’t get corona virus.

CodenameVillanelle · 12/04/2020 11:09

I love him. His book was brilliant. I do understand why he pulled his head back under the parapet but I think we can understand what he's saying

AnyOldSpartabix · 12/04/2020 11:18

It just seems unlucky that you can’t acknowledge that there are going to be competing interests here and there without that becoming, ‘You are a bigot.’ ”

Great article, though this part frustrated me.

It’s not unlucky. The continuous message that anyone questioning any aspect of this is a transphobe and bigot is 100% deliberate strategy.

BuzzShitbagBobbly · 12/04/2020 11:21

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but wasn't he previously full-on "twaw"?

If so, how/what/where was his Peak?

BuzzShitbagBobbly · 12/04/2020 11:22

Slightly OT but ditto Matt Lucas and David Walliams/- the former is completely on board the trans train while the latter isn't? And I vaguely recall some kind of spat about it?

But they are working together again now?

JustTurtlesAllTheWayDown · 12/04/2020 12:05

Forgive me if I'm wrong, but wasn't he previously full-on "twaw"?
Not as far as I'm aware. He was branded 'terfy' for a while before he openly criticised Mermaids although the reasons were always vague.
He was very dismissive of the idea of male or female brains in 'How not to be a Boy' and recommended Cordelia Fine's Delusions of Gender, so I'm not sure how much he ever bought into it.

OP posts:
CodenameVillanelle · 12/04/2020 12:16

I don't think he's ever been TWAW at least not since the gender insanity started.

Danceswithwarthogs · 12/04/2020 12:20

What a good man. I just can’t forget him doing flash dance in a leotard for comic relief

MasterCat · 12/04/2020 12:51

Could you possibly screen shot or c&p the article OP?

I love Robert.

BuzzShitbagBobbly · 12/04/2020 13:14

Not as far as I'm aware. He was branded 'terfy' for a while before he openly criticised Mermaids although the reasons were always vague.

Then I am very pleased to be wrong, thank you!

Clymene · 12/04/2020 13:18

Please do not screenshot or C&P whole articles. You can read 2 articles a week free in the Times or use a share token.

Journalists need paying!

R0wantrees · 12/04/2020 13:30

TheProdigalKittensReturn has provided a link with sharetoken upthread.

ScrimpshawTheSecond · 12/04/2020 19:11

Wow, what a scary time. I'm glad he seems to have come through it.

Michelleoftheresistance · 12/04/2020 19:36

Journalists and others speaking out need to move beyond the defensive 'I'm not transphobic but...." line. Instead they need to simply demand 'what do you mean by 'transphobic'?' Because once you unpick that (instead of mindlessly validating) it becomes clear to all that what is being discussed is not violence, discrimination and oppression, but heresy and disobedience to a niche extremist political lobby.

The language is the rohypnol.

R0wantrees · 12/04/2020 19:44

Journalists and others speaking out need to move beyond the defensive 'I'm not transphobic but...." line

Yes, speaking out in defence of Safeguarding children & women's sex based rights shouldnt need a caveat.

MoleSmokes · 12/04/2020 19:57

I used to think he was a smug dickhead but if he had a drink problem that could well explain his behaviour back then. When I heard him reading his autobiography on the Radio and he seemed a different person; intelligent, humble and insightful.

Amazing stroke of luck with the diagnosis - may he live long and prosper Smile

BuzzShitbagBobbly · 12/04/2020 20:28

The language is the rohypnol.

It's the same here when so many of us start each post by saying how they are pro-everyone having a nice dignified life; or they have many trans f+f etc.

By doing so you are accepting the premise of a false argument.

Just stop it. Stop giving in to the urge to prove your "decent human" credentials in a preamble, and get on with the point you are making. It weakens your main argument and makes you look like you are protesting too much.

(If someone comes along saying "oooh look they didn't say they are pro human rights, so they must be anti them!", who looks more batshit?)

R0wantrees · 12/04/2020 20:51

When I heard him reading his autobiography on the Radio and he seemed a different person; intelligent, humble and insightful.

I thought the same when he was being interviewed this week on R4.
I hope he stays well.

Lisz · 14/04/2021 21:49

Yikes.

Swipe left for the next trending thread