Is it too much to hope that one positive outcome in the coming months and years

[Doyoumind]

Will be that people understand who the truly vulnerable in society are - i.e. the elderly, sick, disabled and poor - and that some healthy bodied narcissists start to change their narrative and grow up?

Unfortunately I think it’s unlikely, when deaths become big numbers it generally dehumanises... and I’m sick of people saying things like “I’m not worried, it only kills old people” or complaining that the football is cancelled... never mind the loo roll greed

Yes I think it is. People from those groups die in their tens of thousands every winter, from poverty, from the cold, and there hasn't been an effective outcry or opposition.
Labour - the party that are supposed to be on the side of the disadvantaged - are too busy with neoliberal gender politics to bother with us.
www.e3g.org/news/media-room/17000-people-in-the-uk-died-last-winter-due-to-cold-housing

A cynic might say that healthy bodied narcs will benefit if vast numbers of the poor, elderly, disabled and ill to die off. Its the fast way to achieve near zero carbon emissions and to be able to maintain a comfortable lifestyle.

That’s a chilling image isn’t it

Whilst I agree with pp, I do think that when biology has come around and punched you in the face, there will be far fewer people willing to pretend. All those people who're pretending TWAW because they're afraid of other people's reactions or of their job security - I think a lot more people are going to stop giving a fuck and be a lot less willing to lie. More people will speak the truth - sex is immutable.

Because, really, who gives a shit about what pronouns someone wants to force you to use in a pandemic?

It'll blend into the background I think - just like the saying "A single death is a tragedy; a million deaths is a statistic"

And we all know which (male) death will be emblazoned across every media outlet as the worst, most oppressed, most tragic death ever.

I agree with Langbanned. I think that if people experience a period of genuine hardship they will become less tolerant of those who continually cry wolf.

The suicide claims and poor-little-meedom will seem way more ridiculous and will receive short shrift.

That’s my hope anyway.

And inspired by another thread, I hope that medics, working in desperate circumstances, having to make impossible choices about who lives and who dies, and putting their own lives at risk will perhaps gain perspective and will be more willing to tell narcissistic fuckers to bugger off with their self-centred demands.

I think if health services (in the western world) are pushed to breaking point over the coming months people are going to seriously start questioning the morality of unnecessary, vanity led surgeries and hormones that are not meant for a perfectly healthy body.

I've been rolling around The Screwtape Letters in my head. For those that don't know, it's a fictional set of letters from a senior devil, Screwtape, to a junior one, Wormwood, talking about tempting, and eventually bringing to hell, a human subject.

In one letter, Screwtape is angry because Wormwood has been using trivial pleasures that don't really satisfy, to distract the man from virtuous things, and has accidentally let the man experience a real pleasure and lost the control of him.

Screwtape explains;

The characteristic of Pains and Pleasures is that they are unmistakably real, and therefore, as far as they go, give the man who feels them a touchstone of reality. Thus if you had been trying to damn your man by the Romantic method…you would try to protect him at all costs from any real pain; because, of course, five minutes’ genuine toothache would reveal the romantic sorrows for the nonsense they were and unmask your whole stratagem

This is what I suspect may begin to happen now, on a society level. All the endless bellyaching about 'microaggressions' will probably continue, but there will be a much reduced appetite to take it seriously, given the serious nature of what people are actually facing.

Not only are hundreds and thousands of people (globally) going to die from this but the world is going to sharply enter a deep, long depression.

There is going to be no money to pay for anything remotely self indulgent. Fancy a new pair of tits? Well pay for them yourself because the western world will be utterly skint.

No it’ll be dog eat dog out there.

There is going to be no money to pay for anything remotely self indulgent. Fancy a new pair of tits?

The whining has already started on that. I saw a whole collection of tweets this week about HOW UNFAIR life is now, because stretched medical resources will mean no cosmetic boob jobs or genital surgery on tap. The exaggeration and drama about it was very real. These idiots don't even know they're born.

The BBC has obviously decided to put the adults at work with the reporting of the CV-19 updates, thankfully.

I've been reading a lot of books about WW2 over the last few years a bit of an addiction! and I've been thinking, nobody would give a ff in an apocalyptic situation, and almost wishing we'd have some huge disaster to make people realise that whatever "identity" you have in your head, it doesn't matter, or it matters only to you! And now we have that disaster.

Unfortunately I think it’s unlikely, when deaths become big numbers it generally dehumanises... and I’m sick of people saying things like “I’m not worried, it only kills old people” or complaining that the football is cancelled... never mind the loo roll greed confused

I saw an English ex-pat person complaining about all the gay bars in the Berlin night scene have to close! "What will I doooooo? Where will I gooooooo?"

The BBC has obviously decided to put the adults at work with the reporting of the CV-19 updates, thankfully.

HMG is simultaneously adulting and Wokeing

Website text: "those who are pregnant"
Image: "Pregnant women" (scroll down)

www.gov.uk/government/publications/covid-19-guidance-on-social-distancing-and-for-vulnerable-people/guidance-on-social-distancing-for-everyone-in-the-uk-and-protecting-older-people-and-vulnerable-adults

Well, that's the paradox of the human animal, tbh. We can be either petty, despicable selfish creatures, consumed with nothing but our own desires, or we can be magnificent community minded creatures, understanding the value of cooperation and self sacrifice.

The fact that these two possibilities are ever present is why I am never sure if I love or loathe us as a species. But I choose a middle path of believing the best of us and being generally optimistic, while being realistic about our propensity for self absorbed bullshit and self sabotage.

One outcome I could never have predicted is the US seriously discussing a Citizens Wage. If they have any sense, they'll extend to free to access, not for profit healthcare.

I love the Screwtape Letters!
It is one of my favourite books. Perfect passage you quoted as well. I agree with it completely

My niece was due to have 'top surgery' in May. I haven't asked her if it's still going ahead.

I hope that we'll move to a more truthful society. All the witterings about 'misgendering' and 'microaggressions' will be seen as the absolute nonsense it is.

I'd like to see the end of luxury beliefs.
quillette.com/2019/11/16/thorstein-veblens-theory-of-the-leisure-class-a-status-update/

I also think that the "me me me's are about to have a rude awakening when they get told is not all about them anymore.

BoreofWhabylon we can only hope that this is the case. And hopefully the cesspit that is Twitter will implode optimistic

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51933410

All non-urgent operations to be postponed.

The whining has already started on that. I saw a whole collection of tweets this week about HOW UNFAIR life is now, because stretched medical resources will mean no cosmetic boob jobs or genital surgery on tap. The exaggeration and drama about it was very real.

I can believe it.

Women told NOT to have IVF amid the coronavirus outbreak
mol.im/a/8122915

Sorry for anyone suffering infertility but on the plus side this'll put an end to surrogacy hopes for a few for the time being.

Not only are hundreds and thousands of people (globally) going to die from this but the world is going to sharply enter a deep, long depression.

One outcome I could never have predicted is the US seriously discussing a Citizens Wage.

After WW2, and up to the end of the 70’s, the west developed the closest thing to a capitalist welfare state we have had.
Politicians, even the rightwing ones, could see what was needed to get business booming again, and the world more generally getting onto an even keel after the destruction of the war.

Ideally big business and all governments would now come to a similar insight, but I am not holding my breath.

They have been worshipping neoliberalism as a religion since Reagan and Thatcher started it in 1979-80.

But the businesses going under as a consequence of Corona, will not get back up and running, if millions of people are to impoverished to buy anything even after the Covid risk is over.