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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Suzanne Moore- The Guardian on Selina Todd

326 replies

Ontheblackhill · 02/03/2020 19:04

Presumably you have all seen this......

www.theguardian.com/society/commentisfree/2020/mar/02/women-must-have-the-right-to-organise-we-will-not-be-silenced

OP posts:
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25
iguanadonna · 02/03/2020 19:10

Hot damn she's good.

ScrimshawTheSecond · 02/03/2020 19:11

Wow. No, I had not. Thanks for sharing. And thank you, Suzanne.

death and rape threats for me and my children

Appalling. I hope the police were able to help.

Floisme · 02/03/2020 19:13

No I hadn't seen it thank you!

Suzanne Moore you fucking 

And this time she didn't have to take it to the Telegraph!

Floisme · 02/03/2020 19:14

Sorry Suzanne Blush there was supposed to be a Star at the end.

Here's another just in case Star

wellbehavedwomen · 02/03/2020 19:15

Women have the right to call out the violent men who rape. We have the right to speak and organise without being told that speech is itself dangerous. You can tell me to “die in a ditch, terf” all you like, as many have for years, but I self-identify as a woman who won’t go down quietly.

There are more of us than you think.

Thank you, Suzanne Moore.

transdimensional · 02/03/2020 19:16

Excellent article by Suzanne and good to see it in the Guardian, which until recently has been so one-sided on these issues.

RoyalCorgi · 02/03/2020 19:17

Wow, this is fabulous. After having got into trouble with the TRAs on a previous occasion (when Julie Burchill came to her defence), she has been very quiet about this for a long time. It's just brilliant that she has finally found her voice. It's so eloquent, so powerful. And the Guardian have published it!

Sheshehe · 02/03/2020 19:19

There are more of us than you think. I like it Smile

lanadelgrey · 02/03/2020 19:21

Time to say to guardian how many of us are out there, perhaps? Smile

FlorenceLyons · 02/03/2020 19:22

I self-identify as a woman who won't go down quietly

Brilliant. And yes, I suspect there are more of us than anyone thinks.

boatyardblues · 02/03/2020 19:22

It’s a strong statement and needs to be said. My only niggle is that she concludes by saying she self-identifies as a woman. Surely “I am a woman” is enough. Everything else was bang on, though. Women have rights: get over it.

Clymene · 02/03/2020 19:22

Brava Suzanne! And bravo to the guardian for finally finding your ovaries fo let women speak.

It is not transphobic to say that the word woman is not a feeling in a man's head. It is our real lived experience.

RoyalCorgi · 02/03/2020 19:23

My only niggle is that she concludes by saying she self-identifies as a woman. Surely “I am a woman” is enough.

She was using that terminology to make a point. It was all the more forceful for it.

What's that roaring noise I hear? Why, I think it's the sound of a turning tide.

boatyardblues · 02/03/2020 19:23

I bet Twitter goes into meltdown.

ThePurported · 02/03/2020 19:24

Superb, thank you Suzanne Star. (I won't thank the Guardian because they will undoubtedly follow this up with some inane genderbollocks)

"Women have the right to call out the violent men who rape. We have the right to speak and organise without being told that speech is itself dangerous. You can tell me to “die in a ditch, terf” all you like, as many have for years, but I self-identify as a woman who won’t go down quietly.

There are more of us than you think."
Wine

CatChant · 02/03/2020 19:28

Wow!

In the Guardian!

Yes, definitely "there are more of us than you think." And we aren't going to go away.

Thank you, Suzanne Moore.

NYnachos · 02/03/2020 19:28

🍷🍷🍷 to Suzanne for a great article. Definitely more if us than you think

ScrimshawTheSecond · 02/03/2020 19:29

I think it's the sound of a turning tide.

Sound of women taking a deep breath ...

boatyardblues · 02/03/2020 19:32

Someone posted this Chinese proverb on MN a while ago: “When sleeping women wake, mountains move.” Seems apposite.

ListeningQuietly · 02/03/2020 19:32

Oh I hope sanity is starting to prevail

stumbledin · 02/03/2020 19:41

RoyalCorgi - hwat she said was "I self-identify as a woman who won’t go down quietly" which I think is her making a joke of the concept of self identity, but emphasising that the trans bullies wont make women like her give up.

And yes, very interesting she got this published. I wonder how much of it is a change in attitudes re trans, or whether it is part of the Guardian supposedly being a supported of free speech in universities.

She got in phrases like "sex based rights" and a paragraph on the biological reality of sex: "The radical insight of feminism is that gender is a social construct – that girls and women are not fated to be feminine, that boys and men don’t have to be masculine. But we have gone through the looking-glass and are being told that sex is a construct. It is said that sex is merely assigned at birth, rather than being a material fact – actually, though, sex is recognisable in the womb (which is what enables foetal sex selection). Sex is not a feeling. Female is a biological classification that applies to all living species."

I am not a great fan of her as a writer. I think she got too sucked into the working class girl made good, look at me in the Guardian, shoing off.

But irrespective of that, just terrible that she and others have been harassed and bullied online, and children threatened. Funny how the police never seem to turn up at these bullies houses and arrest them for hate speach. Angry

Lordfrontpaw · 02/03/2020 19:44

The Guardian. THE Guardian? THAT Guardian?

What do they know that we don’t? I still wouldn’t wipe my backside on that comic.

endofthelinefinally · 02/03/2020 19:44

Has anyone got a share token?

boatyardblues · 02/03/2020 19:45

No need - the Guardian is not paywalled. Just close the begging pop-ups.

stumbledin · 02/03/2020 19:48

As is normal with the Guardian comments are open on the web site (because they now thier main followers are MRAs and there would be a pile on).

However the article is listed on their facebook page which is open to comment. And surprise surprise, the only comment is from Natacha Kennedy claiming the article is outright tranphobic bigotry, and evidence that the guardian has gone down hill. And evidence of this is that a cis woman, Lola Olufemi (!), made the complaint so trans people shouldn't be blamed!!!!

For anyone on facebook who wants to comment www.facebook.com/GuardianOpinion/posts/3034266669939175

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