Teen with Aspergers convicted of transgender hate crime, he asked is that a boy or a girl.

[HairyPotter]

www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/uk-news/duty-transgender-police-officer-left-17652064

While I completely understand it must be awful to be misgendered, it can’t come as a complete surprise that some transpeople don’t ‘pass’. If you can’t cope with people asking a perfectly reasonable (in their eyes) question, then maybe a job as a PCSO isn’t for you. I’m certain that the vast majority of officers have been called far worse with feeling the need to prosecute them. Maybe a different job or a thicker skin is required.

The PCSO is a poster boy for the Force:

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-wales-45890976

I’m confused. What was the public order offence?

I’m pretty sure that’s less of a sentence and fine than “Tara” Woods got for physicalLy assaulting Maria McLaughlan.

I wonder how many people have been prosecuted for shouting racist or sexist abuse at police officers?

Maybe this:

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1986/64

maybe section 5.

Fined £590 Utterly outrageous.

And placed on a 9pm curfew for 6 months!! For shouting out, to a cop, "is that a boy or a girl" twice.
My God you should hear to abuse hurtled at police on my country. They harden the fuck up and carry on mostly.

Truly ominous.

Actually, more like section 4A:

Intentional harassment, alarm or distress.

(1) A person is guilty of an offence if, with intent to cause a person harassment, alarm or distress, he—

(a) uses threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour, or
...
thereby causing that or another person harassment, alarm or distress.

Wow nauticant!

”Intentional harassment, alarm or distress.

(1)A person is guilty of an offence if, with intent to cause a person harassment, alarm or distress, he—
(a)uses threatening, abusive or insulting words or behaviour, or disorderly behaviour, or
(b)displays any writing, sign or other visible representation which is threatening, abusive or insulting,
thereby causing that or another person harassment, alarm or distress.”

How long before Woman: Adult Human Female T-shirts and Women don’t have penises stickers are criminalised?

Yes, it's astonishing AnyOldSpartabix. For example:

A person is guilty of an offence if, with intent to cause a person ... distress, he uses ... insulting words ... thereby causing that or another person ... distress.

But the real injustice of this is that the Police and the CPS will only act if the victim is a favourite of theirs. If they're not then they can fuck off.

Well, that dashes the whole ‘trans men pass’ argument.

Poor kid. My autistic 19 year old would probably do the same. Transgenderism is ableist!

This is the type of hate crime legislation which I think is dangerous.

Would asking that question (albeit loudly and rudely) be a crime if the protected class was not involved?

If not, how do you assess intent to harrass from one incident which could simply be tactlessness?

“To have something shouted at him that had such personal connotations whilst he was on his own in the middle of a public place that was rather busy due to market day footfall did leave him vulnerable, distressed, and embarrassed.” She said it had left him reluctant to undertake foot patrols on his own.

Today was the first day in a week I didn't get much worse comments than this. I'm a bloody teacher, not a police officer.

How would this person cope with an actual abusive comment, let alone violence?

For shouting out, to a cop, "is that a boy or a girl"

Imagine how empty the streets would be after 9pm if they imposed a curfew on young men who shout the far far far worse stuff at young girls and women every single day.

But street harassment of women is, apparently, not a hate crime.

Street harassment that we - girls and women - learn to deal with from the age of - well, I think I was 13 when I was first cat-called on the street.

For us, it's just normal everyday sexism and misogyny. So "normal" we rarely name it as a problem.

How long have they been trans I wonder?

Pretty standard to get unwanted and abusive comments for women, from early teens onwards.

cross post dolora

and i often fantasise about an abusive man curfew.

What incredibly biased reporting- where's the outrage?

The point about the law donquixotedelamancha is that it's broad enough to cover just about any spoken or written word(s) or signs that someone says they're upset by. But that doesn't mean action will be taken by the Police and the CPS. Action is only taken if the Police and the CPS want to send a message. This means from the point of view of the public, this part of the law is arbitrary.

It doesn't even need to go to court and lead to a prosecution. The breadth of the law alone is enough of a threat and the Police can go knocking on doors or calling on the phone to tell people they've taken against that they need to be compliant or else.

I've got a teen with Aspergers, I've often worried that he'll say the wrong and get thumped, I never thought he'd be at risk of arrest!

Off topic, but putting 'woman adult human female t-shirt' into Google (cos I want one) landed me with this.
I think if I roll my eyes any harder they'll fall out. Think whoever designed this t-shirt needs a biology lesson.

Interesting point on the harassment women and girls receive. Most of which is far, far worse.

Also in Daily Mail

(extract)
District judge Roger Lowe said the aggravating features of the case were that Mr Freel was performing a public service as a PCSO and the incident was in a busy town centre where other people could hear what was said.

He said the sentence had been uplifted from a low level to a medium-level community order because of its transphobic nature."

www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7943147/Teenage-yob-ordered-pay-compensation-transgender-police-officer-abuse.html

Things that have been shouted at me by random men while I've been walking down the street:

• Oi, I'd do you
• Hey, fatty bum bum
• Hey girl, you got a black arse. You want some black in your arse?
• Nice tits!
• Nice face, shame about the arse (and vice versa)

I'm sure there's more but they were largely variations on a theme. I wonder if plastic policeman Freel (plastic on the basis that PCSOs aren't real police offices) has spoken to some female colleagues and asked if they've had that kind of abuse and if so, if they felt upset and embarrassed?

Because I certainly did. I obviously didn't go to the police because I have been called a stupid slag (and worse) by police officers in the past so I'm pretty sure they don't give a shiny shit about misogynist abuse.

But being outed as trans by a kid with a learning disability is obviously terribly traumatic

What incredibly biased reporting- where's the outrage?

As has been pointed out on other threads:

Court reporters can get in a lot of shit for not making stuff like this very factual. National papers may have the resources to say what they think but the Birmingham mail will have little budget for arguing with IPSO and a reporter who drops them in it might easily lose thier job.

I don't think that's OK, but I do think the reporter gave all the relevant info, in clear terms, so the public can make up their minds- they best they could do really.

But street harassment of women is, apparently, not a hate crime.

Street harassment of women would be within the breadth of this law. The point is that the Police and the CPS wouldn't be interested in acting.

The point about the law donquixotedelamancha is that it's broad enough to cover just about any spoken or written word(s) or signs that someone says they're upset by. But that doesn't mean action will be taken by the Police and the CPS. Action is only taken if the Police and the CPS want to send a message. This means from the point of view of the public, this part of the law is arbitrary.

It doesn't even need to go to court and lead to a prosecution. The breadth of the law alone is enough of a threat and the Police can go knocking on doors or calling on the phone to tell people they've taken against that they need to be compliant or else.

I agree completely- it's bad law. I also think that the way the police and CPS are approaching these (unavoidable) areas of discresion has changed in recent years (though perhaps it was always so inconsistent, and just not reported).

I do think it's exacerpated by the hate crime guidance. I don't think a similarly rude comment would have got past a judge towards (as is often suggested) a female police officer.