Only consenting to receiving medical treatment from a female is not acceptable

[Siameasy]

mobile.twitter.com/Docstockk/status/1198215833006362630

One NHS trust says it’s unacceptable for women to say they only consent to medical treatment from “natal females”. I find this completely outrageous and couldn’t find a thread on it already. Bloody hell!

Where does the discrimination end? The NHS is already talking about (quite rightly!) stopping treatment for people who ask for a doctor of a specific race. I don’t believe anyone should be saying they want to be treated by a ‘natal’ female — but if you do have issues with past sexual abuse etc you can certainly ask for them to be considered by having a third or even fourth person in the room.

I don’t believe anyone should be saying they want to be treated by a ‘natal’ female

Why not? Why should they not say that they want a female?

Is it really beyond you to see why a female rape victim would only want a female to do a smear?! I cannot believed it is beyond your comprehension

Where does the discrimination end?

Women already have the right to ask for a female health care practitioner; that's been established for a long time. Men also have a right to ask for a HCP of a specific sex. The "discrimination" ends there. That's it. Your question implies a slippery slope which has been proven in practice to not exist.

Race and sex are two entirely different things. It isn't discrimination for a woman to only want treatment from women. We don't have to let men touch us ffs! Especially as so many of them have PROVEN they cannot be trusted around women.

Read my full response siamesy you get the answer .

I'm not generally bothered - I had a GUM exam by a male doctor who was great and fixed my recurring thrush issues. If I need emergency treatment, I don't care who does it

But for a coil fitting I requested a female, because I hate having it done, I'm on my period, scared and I just feel more comfortable. What bugged me was specifically requesting a female, 10 weeks before the appointment, I turn up to a male. I had to wait a long time for the appointment and what if I had requested them for specific reasons and couldn't have had a coil fitted? I did eventually have it done, it was incredibly painful and this time I asked to go to the complex patient clinic because I know the only person who does those is female

I can't believe people are trying to force women to let men touch them intimately. What the actual FUCK!

I can't believe people are trying to force women to let men touch them intimately. What the actual FUCK!

It's incredible isn't it?!

Yep fading

And we got women on here defending it ffs

Erasing boundaries as ever

this provokes such a visceral reaction in me. I've had to edit most of my post.

• the arrogance. The assumption that patients should lie back and do as they're told, that the medics know best, better than the woman, even when it comes to such deeply personal issues, that a woman's consent is so utterly meaningless.

What on earth would give me confidence in the care of someone who encounters a stress/trauma response in a vulnerable patient and decides it's not acceptable to their politics?

This is just sweeping away patient consent. It makes me feel sick.

I, as a rape and abuse survivor, do NOT want more people in the room. That's the fucking last thing I want @GrumpyHoonMain. I just want to be treated by a woman without a penis. It's not that difficult to understand. Being touched my men is difficult for me. I still suffer from complex PTSD. Your comments are truly heartless.

There really does seem to be a concerted effort to destroy women’s boundaries.

No grumpy.

Some of us don’t want men touching us intimately.

Whether there 3 or 4 or 5 people watching

What abou5 that is you don’t get ?

GrumpyHoonMain
Where does the discrimination end?

This word 'discrimination' becomes an interesting device when applied to intimate physical spaces and procedures.

Are we 'discriminating' against what you call natal-men when we choose not to get undressed beside them? Is that discrimination? Am I discriminating against a male if I choose to move away from them if they are undressing in the same space as I am?

Should I be called-up on my 'discrimination' for not letting them be present in my space at all/any times, however vulnerable I may be at that time, because I am female and they are male?

Are we 'discriminating' against these natal-men when we ask that female prisoners should not be told to share the same cell-space with them?

Are we 'discriminating' against these natal-men when we ask them that we'd rather a female instead carried out intimate procedures?

Discrimination starts to lose all meaning, for me, if this counts as discrimination.

And again, why would anyone need a third or fourth person in the room? What are the reasons that this would be accommodated for the person with a history of sexual abuse, but not just the basic 'not a male, please' request?

I sincerely hope that the tone deaf posters on here advocating ignoring women's boundaries and forcing them to receive intimate care from men are nothing to do with health care (or work with children, the vulnerable or even people generally). Some really insensitive posts.

It's unbelievable. How much would it actually take to have just a little bit of empathy for your fellow women and just shut up and listen when they say NO to men.

Choice is everything. My comfort and dignity trumps any HCPs feelings.

It really is.

I had a female Gyne consultant make me feel stupid and a female nurse put me off smears for life when I was 20, whereas the male gyne consultant was nice however I fully reserve the right to choose a female dr for certain things. I certainly wanted a only female dr to check my bulging vulval veins when I was pregnant.

Only a female lactation consultant knows exactly what it's like to breastfeed. Even if they're a transman.

My practice offer the choice on the phone. So it would make an absolute mockery of doing that.

For those who don't understand why some women may have an (apparently irrational) response to males providing intimate care: child abuse, sexual assault, rape, birth trauma, domestic violence.

All of these experiences are unfortunately very common.

There are also some women with religious objections.

At what point do you stop dismissing womens' consent and preferences? Where do you draw the line? Is it acceptable for a rape survivor to have a trauma response to a strange man being involved in her care? No?

The problem arises where it would be possible to be seen by a natal female but the hospital decides that a transgender woman counts as female and removes the right of the patient to elect someone with the same anatomy as them.

Exactly.

The problem with identity politics is it can mask power imbalances within relationships, which persist regardless. The race analogy used is especially poor because it switches the power imbalance - white people hold power over black people; men hold power over women. So women requesting not to be touched by males cannot be the racist white person in that analogy.

But it gets tricky because many patients, even those who aren't survivors of abuse, will feel as though the doctors and nurses are in a position of power over them. Being treated in a hospital can make one feel extremely vulnerable. One lacks a lot of agency about timings and where one has to be and what one has to do; what one can wear, who or what can be with you. The staff have the power to treat you and to treat you with respect, or not.

When allocated a Male midwife, although he was perfectly qualified, I did request to change to a female. I tried to stick with him as I knew logically but I just felt uneasy and then felt v worried about what people felt me swoping.

Is it acceptable for a rape survivor to have a trauma response to a strange man being involved in her care? No?

From the look of it, Scrim, both from some responses on this thread, and the NHS guidance, no, it's not acceptable.

It’s not irrational I just want a woman to do my care and I ask for it

I don’t want to turn up and there’s a guy

Ffs

Stop trying to break down our boundaries as women

I think it’s completely unacceptable to refuse medical help from some one based on their gender or race.

If you need medical attention and there is someone who could potentially save your life I think you should be grateful for that. No excuses.