Only consenting to receiving medical treatment from a female is not acceptable

[Siameasy]

mobile.twitter.com/Docstockk/status/1198215833006362630

One NHS trust says it’s unacceptable for women to say they only consent to medical treatment from “natal females”. I find this completely outrageous and couldn’t find a thread on it already. Bloody hell!

Me-rail accomplished again. Ciminy!

The OP was about women losing the right to request female HCPs. It was not about requiring women to have female HCPs - that is a strawman argument.

You are so patient and helpful 2B

There’s actually a small but vital word missing from your OP summation and that’s ‘natal’.
One NHS trust says it’s unacceptable for women to say they only consent to medical treatment from “natal females”.

This thread was never started to tell women they could only have a female HCP, but to tell women that actually they might not be ‘allowed’ to request a female HCP, and will have to accept TWAW for their personal medical exams.

It’s now so far off course we’ve merged with (a mis quoted) AIBU thread, and are talking about why there aren’t more men in female related medical fields.

Interesting none the less.

Makes you wonder why some posters are so determined to make the thread about all the bad women working in healthcare compared to the fucking fabulous men. I’d hate to think it was an attempt to scare women and make them doubt their choices.

Where have I once said all the bad women Vs all the fabulous men?

I haven't. You just can't resist the opportunity to misquote can you? Earlier in the thread several posters made the point that we should have the right to choose our HCP without having to explain why. I have explained why - that on a few occasions during 2 deliveries I was treated very badly. Once during catheterisation and the 2nd time when 2 midwives held me down while a Dr tried to break my waters through a closed cervix, despite me crying and telling them to stop.

If a woman posted that just 1 male HCP had done that, and as a result she now couldn't face being treated by a male HCP would you say to her

Makes you wonder why some posters are so determined to make the thread about all the bad men working in healthcare compared to the fucking fabulous women.

The answer is no you wouldn't. You would all be sympathetic, supportive and understanding. I've been entirely up front about the number of hcps involved. Not once have I said that all of the female hcps are X, y or z. I've said the experiences that I have had, in a fucking awful maternity unit that was later subject to investigation this is what happened, not only to me but to many other women too, some of whom died along with babies.

Of course there are the vast majority of female hcps who are not like this but unfortunately those incidents are what have impacted on me. Sorry if that doesn't fit with your narrative.

Stop derailing this thread. It's not about you. It's not about the AIBU thread. It's about the issue of women not being able to request a natal female HCP because trans.

This also affects you, as you may not be guaranteed a natal male.

Wait, I missed the stollen recipe! Dammit!

Well well well....
It was me who asked the AIBU male midwife question. Surprised to come here and see the same 'argument' being made by someone who will only read snippets of someone's reply to them and then omit everything else written just to escalate their argument.

Blimey HearHooves you really seem to have a lot of bad luck with female care providers, don’t you?
My thoughts too, not only two birth experience and a colonoscopy, but now a mammogram too. Any more? They seem to get more and more extreme each time you mention them too. From what you said about your birth experiences and your colonoscopy experience on the other thread, you were assulted by the female HCPs, sexually and physically. Did you complain? I dunno zebra, maybe speak up if you're not happy at the time, instead of going off on tangents years later. Like when having the mammogram and being made to strip to the waist in front of the nurse, why didn't you just say to the nurse "Errr dignity, give me some"? Sure she would have left the room. But despite the amount of training the nurses and radiographers are given on patient dignity, I'm surprised it happened.

But I just wanted to say, I've just read through the last 20 pages of that thread (while eating cheese on toast) - and not once did ANYONE tell you that you were sexist for preferring or requesting a male HCP. Not once. You took another comment made in the same reply out of context and applied it to where you wanted it to be so you could escalate an argument.

You feel more comfortable under the care of male hcps, then you go see them. No one thinks or implies that's a problem. But I can tell you're likely reading this reply now and you only see the words "male hcp" and "problem", so no doubt you'll be back with further experiences and further arguments telling me that "I've got a problem with you seeing a male HCP as it appears you just highlight a couple of words each post and then mould them to be something else. 😈

Welcome to FWR, Hellofromtheotherside. It is lovely to see you here.

Sorry your AIBU was derailed, so many times. It seems this thread has suffered a similar fate.

Welcome Hello

Good to hear your voice added to all those women who are asserting their right to request female HCPs.

Sorry your thread was derailed. The tactic doesn't work. On here or in real life.

I mean, you have to ask yourself who wants to shut women up and why?

Anyway, the right to request a female HCP for my mother and me? Absolutely.

It’s like deja vu seeing you on this thread hello.

I mean, you have to ask yourself who wants to shut women up and why?

I mean, you have to ask yourself who wants to shut women up and why?

Exactly. And thanks handsoffmyrights. I didn't mind the thread being derailed. Was very eye opening seeing some of the different viewpoints. Most were very reasonable (both sides of the argument) and some were just fucking crazy very 'different'. Just a little snippet of society I guess, just a bit gutted my daughter has to grow up in a world where some women undermine everything generations have worked so hard to achieve. Women are allowed a choice, though some disagree. Meh!

Hello winesalot and agrona. Nice to see ya again!

From what you said about your birth experiences and your colonoscopy experience on the other thread, you were assulted by the female HCPs, sexually and physically.

You are an absolute liar. I most certainly did not say that I had been sexually assaulted in any of those instances. How dare you misrepresent what I said. My posts are there on that thread for anyone to go and read and see that you are lying.

Birth 1 - Catherine's. Balloon inflated in urethra not bladder. I cried continuously from the pain. Midwife refused to do anything. Eventually my DH went to the urology ward where I worked to get me help.

Birth 2 - 2 midwives held me still while a Dr tried to break my waters because they were trying to induce labour and after 5 days nothing was happening. I repeatedly told them to stop because it was so painful but they wouldn't (this was the most damaging incident for me)

Emergency colonoscopy this year - bleeding heavily Dr performed it with no sedation. It was so painful and again I asked several times for her to stop. Eventually a nurse stepped in to stop her.

Mammogram last year - no privacy given to me while I was undressing.

None of the above involved sexual assault and I have never claimed that they did. They were examples of very poor care and potentially detrimental to my health.

As for the snidey "oh so many instances, what bad luck you have" you'd say the same to women who experience several sexual assaults by different men over their life would you? It happens. The 2 birth examples were in the same shit maternity unit that were forced to change the management team plus lots of midwives because they were put into special measures as a result of their atrocious record.

How dare you try to make stuff up in order to discredit me. Several times posters have said that no woman needs to explain the reasons for her choices yet I have because my choice is different to the majority. You choose to take that and twist it and make snide comments about it. Shame on you!

Errr dignity, give me some"? Sure she would have left the room. But despite the amount of training the nurses and radiographers are given on patient dignity, I'm surprised it happened.

Sometimes when things happen we don't feel able to speak up. I was so shocked that it was happening that I almost couldn't believe it. I've spoken to friends that have had it done at the same place - the same thing happened. It's obviously their procedure but I don't agree with it. Obviously they don't rate dignity very highly there. Why aren't there changing rooms, or a curtain within the room? Why aren't you given a gown to wear rather than being asked to walk around topless? I don't know.

Did I complain about my experiences? Yes I did. All of them. The 2 midwifery ones the investigated and assured me that the me concerned had been spoken to and training given. No idea if it was true. The colonoscopy was apparently continued because of the urgency of my condition, so done against my will to save my life.

Nice victim blaming on your part though. It's my fault because I wasn't able to speak up at the time?? Nice.

and not once did ANYONE tell you that you were sexist for preferring or requesting a male HCP. Not once.

Sorry but yes they did. It was several comments, not just 1. Maybe read it again.

I also supported your right to see a female HCP if that's what you wanted. So don't try and paint it as though I argued against it. I wasn't one of the posters who did that.

What amazed me is how no one else has pulled you up on your victim blaming, instead giving you metaphorical high fives for your attempts to discredit me. Good to see women supporting other women - not. It's like the playground here isn't it?

Good morning from Northern Ireland Hellofromtheotherside2020. I hope you had a decent day and I’ll ‘see’ you later, after I’ve dropped the wee lass off to college, fed the dogs, fed the cats, walked the dogs, ate more bread ate more bread and even have more bread.

Unless of course the thread has, yet again, been filled by pages and pages and pages of merails that have fuck all to do with the OP’s point.

Again, you've taken things I've written out of context. I never said YOU said you were sexually assaulted. In my opinion having people hold you down despite you yelling NO and inserting things into your vagina is sexual abuse.

You read it, screen shot or copy and paste any post that said "zebra you are sexist" and then post it here, then you'll have photographic or written evidence of me "being a liar". Because after reading it several times I've still not seen this post you're referring to.

If someone wants a male HCP they have the right to ask for one. And if an obviously female HCP turned up instead and announced that she identified as male that day you have the right to say no. However, I expect a male HCP for a female patient would probably want to bring a chaperone with them for intimate procedures. The chaperones are there to protect the HCP (from false accusations) as much as the patient.

I am presuming it is suggested that transwomen HCPs should eschew having a chaperone for a female patient because transwomen fall into that special category where safeguarding ceases to be necessary?

You read it, screen shot or copy and paste any post that said "zebra you are sexist" and then post it here, then you'll have photographic or written evidence of me "being a liar".

I would have to screen shot every post over about 4 pages because it is a conversation. One post relates to another. If I post just one comment I'm going to be accused of misrepresenting what was said. The thread has been linked here so if people want to read it they can. One poster told me repeatedly that I was being sexist for saying I wanted a male HCP because I'd only had a bad experience with a few female hcps and so I was wrong to refuse to see any female HCP going forward.

In my opinion having people hold you down despite you yelling NO and inserting things into your vagina is sexual abuse.

My thoughts too, not only two birth experience and a colonoscopy, but now a mammogram too. Any more? They seem to get more and more extreme each time you mention them too. From what you said about your birth experiences and your colonoscopy experience on the other thread, you were assulted by the female HCPs, sexually and physically.

Where do you say it's your opinion? It's clearly insinuating it's what I've said.

I don't consider it to be sexual assault. It was very poor medical care and I guess once I said "stop" it was assault but I wasn't in a position to be asserting myself at that time. I guess you'd consider that also to be my fault too though.

I am presuming it is suggested that transwomen HCPs should eschew having a chaperone for a female patient because transwomen fall into that special category where safeguarding ceases to be necessary?

I've had 3 vaginal ultrasounds performed by female radiographers and each time they've had another person in the room with them. On one occasion it was a man and she actually introduced him as the chaperone, which I did think was strange.

I've also been examined by female GPS who have asked if I want a chaperone so why would it be impossible for a transwoman to have a chaperone, if natal women hcps either have them as standard or offer them?

It wouldn’t be impossible for a transwoman to have a chaperone and should be standard practice. But female HCPs don’t always have chaperones. I have never had a chaperone present for a smear test, or postpartum checks by midwives or female GPs, or by specialist female pelvic floor physios. All very intimate procedures.

Whereas when I has mastitis with a very unsexy engorge red throbbing breast the GP wouldn’t go near me without a chaperone.

I've said the experiences that I have had, in a fucking awful maternity unit that was later subject to investigation this is what happened, not only to me but to many other women too, some of whom died along with babies.

I'm sorry this happened to you, but there's no reason to think that the fact that the maternity unit only employed female staff is in any way relevant.

Something that you might not have thought about is the randomness of your experiences (in a statistical sense). Most of us can probably think of good and bad experiences with doctors and nurses. For me, these are fairly evenly distributed between the sexes (both good and bad experiences with both male and female doctors/nurses). Your experiences have led you to think good = male, bad = female. Other people may have had the opposite experience to you. And you might find that your very next appointment breaks this pattern.