Abortions

[ILikeyourHairyHands]

I'm not sure MN is the place for women to come for advice about abortions as so many forced-birthers or even 'I could never have an abortion" people/shills come on to every thread where a woman's in a terrible situation and is wavering.

I would advocate abortion in every circumstance a woman will be tied to an abusive man, I really hate the rhetoric that abortions are to be regretted or will cause pain. I think that the idea that abortions are or should be regretful or morally bound is very harmful to women.

Morally I agree with termination up until birth. I know that's an inflammatory position, but I think it's an humane one. And one that would be chosen by few desperate women.

But I think until the point of birth a woman must have volition in law.

Absolutely agreeOP..My bodyMy domain domainMy say😊 ..never had an abortion but im the only one in a huge group of us that hasnt&it has to be every womans right.Ive educated my DC to know its their right too if its their body-i have no comprehension of a stranger telling me
i must raise an unwanted baby or birth it&give it away Detest the diatribe&vitriol that these birth-enforcers spout&have also seen 1st hand through a number of support groups (i ran for SureStart years ago)the times unwanted births prevent women walking away from abuser..raising unwanted kids in absolute poverty.

I accept my position is fairly radical, but so is the alternative.

And it's so rare as to be extrodinary.

But I stand by it.

As early as possible, as late as necessary is a really good phrase Canyon.

Vote for "As early as possible, as late as necessary" from me.

I advocate until birth abortions because I believe in female autonomy and I don't believe that a child has autonomy until the mother expels that child.

But why should the baby be adopted? Why should the woman be seen as not having volition?

I have a friend I’ve had to distance myself from as she posts loads of SPUC stuff on FB with photos of foetuses and emotive terms likes murder of babies and has made personal attack’s at me saying I care about animals more than dead babies (I’m vegan).

Well thanks wimmin, your towering intellects and deep compassion has just peak-pro-choiced me.

I am happy to support abortion, but until term? I can’t get on board with that at all.

Can i ask though and sorry to be upsetting, dont read on if easily upset, but:

In a late term abortion doesnt the foetus still have to be birthed? So if its past the stage of being able to live outside the womb why not c section it out and give it away?

I believe that abortion should be available on demand and free until 12 weeks, this allows for the oops situations that many of us have found ourselves in. After that it should only be used for medical reasons where there's serious disabilities in the foetus or mothers life/health reasons. The absolute limit at 24 weeks is right because the baby is then just about viable, after 24 weeks it needs to be because the baby will not live past birth and the tests came back late. Abusive partners should be dealt with by other parts of the law. Late abortion for social reasons is wrong and very traumatic for the mother

I also dont agree that the whole "if they give the baby up then they are forced to be mothers against their will because there will always be someone biologically connected to them out there" is a feminist issue. Happens every day to men. Loads of men are fathers against their will out there.

Not quite gee because giving birth changes your body and puts a woman at risk. I have no issue with women choosing not to do this. I just can’t agree that late term abortion is right.

I too support abortion but cannot get on board with one at full term. I cannot imagine a scenario where it would be the right thing to do. The mental health implications would be massive and the outcome potentially much worse than giving birth to the live baby.

Thanks for answering that makes sense. I dont agree with late term abortion either unless risk to the mother or babies life.

I'm sorry OP but your position is ridiculous and extreme and not something that I suspect more than 1% of the general population would subscribe to.

Women have rights to an abortion early on but if you make the choice not to terminate before 24 weeks, you have to accept that you're in it for the long haul.

Your arguments with regards to very late term abortions also seem very illogical to me. What is the difference between A) a woman at 40 weeks who is about to give birth but opts for the child to be terminated and B) a woman who has just given birth and decides immediately that she wants the baby killed? The baby doesn't have any real autonomy immediately after birth - it's not like a baby giraffe that can walk off. There should be the ability to have the baby be anonymously adopted in both cases if that's what the mother wants, but once the baby can feel pain (which I understand occurs during the third trimester) that's not OK unless there are serious medical reasons.

I also agree with the above poster - if it's the issue of having a child out in the world that you didn't want then that's not a feminist issue. Men face this issue all the time.

Also, if you support late term abortion for any reason then you are inevitably going to end up with sex-selective abortion. How do you feel about that?

Late abortion is a dirty business. And don't think it's without risk. A friend was annoyed as a woman was admitted in extremis from an abortion clinic to her labour ward and subsequently died meaning the maternal death was counted for her unit not the private clinic that had mismanaged the unfortunate woman.

24 weeks is right with provision for later being for serious foetal abnormality only or to save the life of the mother.

Agree Stinky I find the late term arguments very illogical. I know they are not common but I imagine they are very traumatising for the medical staff.

Your position is extreme and you come across as selfish and irresponsible, OP. I think there are some circumstances where an abortion might be the most acceptable outcome and very early on this could be ok but to have abortions at any stage and just because it’s not the right time is appalling in my opinion. How irresponsible do you have to be to accidentally get pregnant five times? You talk about choice but you have a choice at the start and it’s the choice to get pregnant and use effective contraception. Yes accidents happen but five times?! Did it occur to you to get alternative contraception? Obviously abuse and rape situations might be slightly different but you are not limiting your position to that.

I disagree with you. Every one has a right to put their point across.

I don't see how killing our most innocent and vulnerable in society is womans right and freedom. It turns them into monsters.

I don't believe that a child has autonomy until the mother expels that child.

Why?

Until birth abortions is murder. How can you say it isn't. That child has a right to life and you are NOT God.

I fail to see how you can claim to be Pro women but accepting of the idea of a fully formed baby girl being killed just minutes before being born. I would personally prefer that there was no need for abortions at all but as soon as a baby is viable, the mother should not have a right to request it is killed. As previous people have said, I understand refusal to incubate any longer but not an insistence on the baby's death.

I also do worry that if these views are put forward as if they are generally accepted by feminists, it puts young women off finding out about feminism and/or identifying as feminists. It certainly would put me off and if these views became widely held I'd be looking for some other way to frame my anti-sexism views.

I’m good with the current set up - can’t get behind choosing to kill a healthy baby in late pregnancy

Who's that trip trapping over the MN boards?

Why do these discussions always wander into emotive hypotheticals about vanishingly rare situations?

The idea that hordes of women are deciding to abort healthy foetuses at 39 weeks is ludicrous. Late abortions are almost always a result of something going horribly wrong with a wanted pregnancy, or the result of a highly vulnerable woman having been in denial of her pregnancy or not having understood she was pregnant.

The real problem in the UK is that we still don't have abortion on demand. That is the travesty. In my view abortion on demand should be available up to 18 weeks with no limit for medically necessary abortions or for the small number of highly vulnerable women who did not realise/were in denial about a pregnancy. For these latter, small minority, of situations women should be offered support and counselling to address their underlying issues, not judgement and villification.