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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Hey FWR - "We need both sides to live with some compromise "

423 replies

pombear · 13/09/2019 22:40

Warning: This thread will spontaneously combust after 10 posts!

As part of this 'complex subject' a poster started a thread to highlight that a trans activist appeared to have posted a twitter gif that implied they were 'dancing on the grave' of a prominent feminist who sadly died today.

The thread was deleted with this message:

Message from MNHQ: We're sorry to hear some users are not happy with our modding of trans discussions, and our updated Talk Guidelines.
This is a complex subject which is very hard to moderate, and since the two fundamental positions cannot easily be squared, it's likely that both sides will have to live with some compromise and even contradiction if they wish to move forward.
We realise that this will likely be frustrating to many, but we are convinced that our goal must be to support civil and constructive debate.

Civil and constructive debate?

Women point out destructive and uncivil debate from a trans rights activist,

Women also point out the biological sex of this activist.

Women are deleted and schooled in how they must refer to this destructive and uncivil 'debater.

both sides will have to live with some compromise and even contradiction if they wish to move forward

Women - shut up, compromise, live with the 'contradiction' (in this case, does it mean you must only talk about the person who is shitting all over women's spaces and rights if we use the right pronoun?)

OP posts:
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8
Themyscira · 19/09/2019 11:36

Especially what's likely happening to them Confused

MrGsFancyNewVagina · 19/09/2019 11:42

Themyscira that made me laugh and throw up a little in my mouth. ShockGrin

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 19/09/2019 11:45

I instinctively reached for a nice olfactory cleansing bottle of Olbas Oil.

Fallingirl · 19/09/2019 12:39

Everybody, I apologise for the link I posted last night. It seems the rest of you are seeing tweets in that thread that mention ROwantrees.

I don’t see anything referring to her at all, but there are som tweets in the thread that I am blocked from viewing. If I had known the thread cast aspersions on RO, I would not have posted. I have asked MN to have my post removed.

Ereshkigal · 20/09/2019 10:39

I’m lucky enough to know R0 in real life.

The tweets are complete & total bollocks.

Same. Seconded.

BeardedVulture · 20/09/2019 10:58

It's obviously bollocks, and they're obviously absolute idiots.

Angryresister · 20/09/2019 11:03

Has the original discussion been had yet?

Weezol · 23/09/2019 10:03

@YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet @MNHQ @JustineMumsnet

Can you update us on the outcome of last week's meeting please?

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 23/09/2019 10:34

I’ve reported your post Weezol in the hope of drawing MNHQ’s attention to it

BernardBlacksWineIceLolly · 23/09/2019 11:39

Just had a nice update from MNHQ to say that they’re still discussing this and will report back when they can

NotTerfNorCis · 23/09/2019 14:39

I just accidentally misgendered a transwoman. I actually feel bad about it because I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings. But I don't want beliefs forced on me either. 'Female' is a biological reality, not a feeling, identity or social role. I refuse to call this person 'she' in my head and it slipped out.

Ereshkigal · 23/09/2019 14:48

I don't think this is going to work for anyone, trans people included, until there is some realism about this and an acceptance of their biological sex.

I find it quite upsetting to feel my speech is compelled, it reminds me of being in an abusive relationship when I was young where I had to walk on eggshells.

NotTerfNorCis · 23/09/2019 14:54

Yes. That's a fear as well - will this person complain? We're all being coerced into saying things we strongly disbelieve. It's like being forced into a religion.

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 23/09/2019 19:58

Well I just got a threat of suspension for commenting that a lot of trans activists look very silly (I gave a comparison, which was apparently uncivil? dunno what other vague rule references to panto breaks). Was nice to see everyone again but I am not for a second going to pretend that "oh no, you made a Widow Twanky joke, that makes it impossible for this discussion to happen" is a reasonable approach that I in any way agree with.

Stop trying to force a deference towards trans activists that no other demographic gets on your users, Mumsnet. Aunt Lydia is a warning of what can happen when women go along with very bad ideas, not a role model to aspire to.

EmpressLesbianInChair · 23/09/2019 20:04

Well I just got a threat of suspension for commenting that a lot of trans activists look very silly

God, Kittens. You know we’re supposed to say they look Brave and Stunning. Where’s your female socialisation?

TheProdigalKittensReturn · 23/09/2019 20:07

Apparently I got the "not a doormat" version. Whatever was my mother thinking?

(This will be the mother's fault, obviously, just in case my dad decides to turn Brave and Stunning at some point and needs to retroactively be deferred to.)

EmpressLesbianInChair · 24/09/2019 07:00

I got that version too.

testing987654321 · 24/09/2019 07:15

I just accidentally misgendered a transwoman. I actually feel bad about it because I don't want to hurt anyone's feelings. But I don't want beliefs forced on me either

Don't feel too bad, even Paris Lees agent tweeted something like "catch him on Pointless tonight".

And kittens, don't forget that you aren't allowed to mock men. Us laughing at them is more scary than actual violence apparently. Of course, despite having womanly feelings they do still know they are stronger than us.

2BthatUnnoticed · 24/09/2019 15:03

How does misgendering happen in real life (genuine question, only if you don’t mind saying)? I never use he/she when speaking to someone so just not sure how it happens

Weezol · 04/10/2019 08:06

@YetAnotherBeckyMumsnet @MNHQ @JustineMumsnet

Could you please update us?

Cookieflavoredbiscuit · 08/10/2019 10:26

Can you update us on the outcome of last week's meeting please?
Can you update us on the outcome of last month's meeting please?...

....hmm, that blown off feeling....

2BthatUnnoticed · 08/10/2019 11:21

Yes it’s like being ghosted... should you text again? Maybe he/she has been busy! But will you come across as needy? Or are you over thinking as usual...

Cookieflavoredbiscuit · 08/10/2019 13:16

not so much as a breadcrumb...

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