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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

If you ever wanted proof that TRA is the same MRA check this out.

183 replies

TRAMRA · 12/08/2019 19:28

A man. A man who looks like a man, and identifies as a man,
isn't allowed in a women's changing room. How terribly transphobic and sexist. Read the comments and the way he ignores women's concerns, as even if 1 out of a 1000 men, (he kind of forgets who he is meant to be championing here) was bad you shouldn't be able to tar all of male kind with the same brush. one out of a thousand eh? Hmm.

It's all so thinly disguised isn't it?

Well done to the Primark staff who decided that a man demanding he be allowed in a changing room with a young girl, is the last man who should be allowed in.

medium.com/@RJameson/a-recent-experience-has-opened-my-eyes-to-transphobic-bigotry-f5005a4e6497

OP posts:
FWRLurker · 13/08/2019 02:12

Why couldn’t he take his daughter to the men’s? As he says NAMALT, so surely she would be safe in there anyway? Oh wait....

It’s boggling. Obviously if you asked her, and he probably did, she would say “I can’t change in there, some strange man might see me”! And yet other people’s daughters wanting privacy well fuck them, those sexist bigots eh?

How can he have a daughter and be this blind?

2BthatUnnoticed · 13/08/2019 03:28

There is a glaring flaw in his argument.

  1. He doesn’t want to take his daughter into the men’s space. Why not? She might see a man. And he knows m girls prefer a male-free space.
  1. But if he takes his daughter into the women’s space, the women and girls there will see a man - him. What about their male-free space?

Good on the Dad he told him to stay out, as he was himself doing.

GirlDownUnder · 13/08/2019 05:38

From Pikapikachu's link, I’d say ‘hunting’ is the motivation to accessing women’s changing rooms.

“Isn’t it reasonable for a male, for example, to hunt for a fertile young woman..”

IMissGluten · 13/08/2019 06:03

One of the last people I'd want in a women's fitting room is a man who wants to be in a women's fitting room. With all the (as far as I know) normal decent blokes I know, the conversation would go as follows:

Shop assistant — "Sorry, I know the sign's misleading but this is actually the ladies' fitting room? You can't go in."

Man — "Oh, I'm sorry. Is there a fitting room I can use with my daughter? She'll need a hand with some of the fastenings."

SA — a. "Yes, of course, there are some individual rooms."

  — b. "Well, as she's under x years old you're welcome to take her into the gents' fitting rooms."

or

  — c. "No, but the staff will be happy to help if she asks."

Man —

At no point would the men I know contemplate going into the women's fitting rooms. It's just not done — it makes the women feel uncomfortable, and it makes any decent man feel uncomfortable, not least because he doesn't want to make the women feel uncomfortable. Like, empathy and shit. Do genderwarriors not feel empathy?

2BthatUnnoticed · 13/08/2019 06:24

In response to someone upthread (sorry on phone so can’t copy it).

I’m somewhat GNC and in my younger days, did occasionally get an “um..?” in the ladies, from someone thinking I was male.

I just explained I’m not (voice makes it obvious) and everything was fine. I certainly wasn’t traumatised by it and none of the butch lesbians I know, are - it sometimes happens, you deal with it. Why all the dramaz over a simple exchange Confused

And don’t call women c*s - unless they ID that way (not me).

2BthatUnnoticed · 13/08/2019 06:26

~ Sorry I think the comment I was referring to was in Medium, not MN - as you were Blush

JustbeaDentist · 13/08/2019 07:24

At my local Primark, there's a big disabled changing room which is also used for family changing, nappy changing etc. The staff there are lovely. In fact, so lovely that I sent a note to their head office to highlight how appreciative I was.
As if they were covering up their name badges, he probably didn't think to check their names so is finding a way to blame them.
NAshortMALT, but all of the angry, petty men I know are short. He seems that type.

Bespin · 13/08/2019 07:30

what an idiot.

Rocaille · 13/08/2019 07:48

As if they were covering up their name badges, he probably didn't think to check their names so is finding a way to blame them.

Do Primark staff even wear badges? I shop in there all the time and I've never noticed them...

Rocaille · 13/08/2019 07:52

The second 'Predator' article has actually made me feel a bit upset. It's really genuinely scary that this vile creature feels comfortable to publish his detestable thoughts. It's clear where we're heading now.

Ameanstreakamilewide · 13/08/2019 07:58

This has given me a nosebleed...😫

What an absolute cunt and I agree with Datun that his daughter is definitely fictitious.
'She's' just a plot device for his own brand of misogynistic, entitled, bollocks.

Which is what TRA/MRA are, in a nutshell and are 'legitimately' enabled to say this shite out loud, by Wokey McWoke Points.

JustbeaDentist · 13/08/2019 08:19

Even the piggiest misogynists tend to have a revelation when they have a daughter.

missedith01 · 13/08/2019 08:29

Just when you think it's going to end ...

"Update: I thought some more about this issue and came up with this:"

Kill me now ...

RoyalCorgi · 13/08/2019 08:30

Does anybody else think this guy is being ironic? Deliberately satirising the point of view of Men's Rights Activists? I find it hard to credit that he actually believes this stuff.

Fraggling · 13/08/2019 08:45

Nothing to add

Man is a total cock and a nasty bastsrd too

How did it get to this so quickly, that all the places we had free of men, now men expect to be allowed entrance.

Of course lots of men should be happy to get somewhere teenage girls are getting undressed behind often flimsy, gappy curtains.

Agree daughter is imaginary, if not he would have mentioned her in the part where he got removed by security.

Soubriquet · 13/08/2019 08:45

This guy is a bloody pervert!

Whether he likes to think it or not

And yes that is bad!! It is not a sexual evolution designed to help the species

MermaidUnicorn · 13/08/2019 08:46

I would file this under 'everyone is special'. Some people just think they are special and that normal rules don't apply. We take our kids for swimming lessons at a school every Sunday and I've had men in the women's changing rooms (whose female partners think it's outrageous that they are challenged) and DH says there are sometimes women helping their kids in the men's. Nothing applies to them, it's not inappropriate etc. What an idiot.

SuperFurryDoggy · 13/08/2019 08:54

I strongly suspect it’s a spoof a la Titania McGrath.

I can’t see how this is real

Rocaille · 13/08/2019 08:57

And yes that is bad!! It is not a sexual evolution designed to help the species

Re: the 'sexual predation is ok, actually necessary' article... I once read a book called 'Sperm Wars' which was about the evolution of reproductive behaviours. It claimed that rape was indeed a reproductive strategy adopted by a minority of inadequate loser men who preferred violence to genetic annihilation. But who in their right mind would suggest that makes it ok?! Message to creepy MRA 'philosopher': we are moral, reasoning creature you know - we don't just have to devolve to the most base animal instincts. That's not progress!

KettlePolly · 13/08/2019 08:58

His feelings about this experience trump his daughter's safety in sex segregated areas.

Speaks volumes about male entitlement.

Rocaille · 13/08/2019 08:58

I strongly suspect it’s a spoof a la Titania McGrath

I hope you're right Doggy!

yetanotherusernameAgain · 13/08/2019 09:02

So many issues to unpick:

  1. Men's changing rooms: I think he said it was on a different floor; no mention of not wanting to take his daughter there because of her safety (I can't bring myself to read that drivel again to check).
  1. Every time someone cried 'But no man would ever go to all the trouble to identify as trans or AGP to access female only spaces', we can link to his blog.

He didn't even identify as trans. This was a non-trans man who wanted to access women's fitting rooms. This illustrates women's concerns about the acceptance of transwomen into women's same sex spaces actually eroding the preservation of same sex spaces, because some non-trans men will try to blag their way in. He's actually scored an own goal - he's provided an example of a non-transgender man wanting to enter a women's same sex space, and using the argument of trans-rights. This should be on the This Never Happens thread.

It also shows the fallacy of the TRA strawman argument that women's feelings of being unsafe in the presence of transwomen are unfounded, because, as we all know, that wasn't our concern. It was that once TWs are allowed in, some non-transgender men will try to get in too. And here we have it.

  1. His motivations: transgender rights or MRA? As the OP says, this is blatant MRA - not all men attack women, therefore it's sexist to segregate men and women, and women's concerns of risk and safety are irrelevant.

Interesting that he's conflating this with trans rights. If he really believed in trans rights he wouldn't want to enter a women’s changing room anyway, would he? Because if TWAW then they should use the women's rooms. As he's a man, not a TW, it shouldn't even occur to him to use the women's. Unless he doesn't really believe TWAW and that if penis-owners are allowed in, in the form of TW, then he, as a fellow penis-owner, should also be allowed in.

So his apparent support of trans rights is guff and it really boils down to MRA.

Either way, it's a prime example of how the erosion of sex-based rights in favour of trans-rights can enable non-trans people to override women's concerns for their own safety.

PancakeAndKeith · 13/08/2019 09:02

What a fanny.

PancakeAndKeith · 13/08/2019 09:06

He seems to be acting like he is the only man who has ever had a daughter.
He has a point about lone fathers with daughters and how that can be awkward. If he’d stuck to that he would have had a point but when he starting farting on about ‘assuming his gender’ then he completely lost any point he had.

I think that it’s fair for anyone to assume that a man, dressed as a man, talking and acting like a man and being referred to as dad by his child is a man.

This is also hugely disingenuous of the real problems faced by trans women.
There is no comparison.

Also, why would you buy your daughter clothes that she can’t do up?

Datun · 13/08/2019 09:10

Because if TWAW then they should use the women's rooms. As he's a man, not a TW, it shouldn't even occur to him to use the women's. Unless he doesn't really believe TWAW and that if penis-owners are allowed in, in the form of TW, then he, as a fellow penis-owner, should also be allowed in.

Well spotted. He's equating himself with transwomen. Not just a dick, a transphobic dick.