Birthing mother abused for refusing male nurse

[sakura184]

This kind of crap is why I opted for homebirths

pjmedia.com/parenting/colorado-doula-and-assault-survivor-investigated-by-dhs-for-refusing-male-nurse-during-birth/

If you want to advocate for women to choose a male midwife, then campaign for it

OK, so is my interpretation of this comment wrong?
If it is, what did you mean by it then?

No, I asked what choice I am taking away?

It's been answered. Repeatedly. If you can't understand, I'm not sure how to resolve that.
You haven't answered if my interpretation is correct or not?
It's not just me who said they're confused by your comment.
What did it mean then?

Well, women don't currently have a choice of whether to have a male midwife of not - they only have a right to request a female midwife.

So, if you think women should be given a choice to request a male midwife, then campaign for it.

I can't take a choice away that doesn't exist.

I personally would like female-only care in childbirth, but I'm not suggesting that male midwives are run out of the hospital. Just that women can choose to not be treated by men.

Thats what I'm reading Roses to be in favour of too though.

Both of you think that women should have ability to say no to a male midwife.

The only difference you seem to be saying is you'd prefer to have female only midwives across the board. But you wouldn't be so extreme as to chuck male midwives out since they are there.

I dont think you are so wildly apart.

I'm really starting to get bothered by this framing of women preferring same sex HCPs as sexism. The male midwife said he came across sexism in his work.

What if he, and others like him, campaign to eliminate women's right to request a woman sexism in midwifery.

This framing of a woman stating boundaries over who can provide her with intimate care as sexism is rapey. as. fuck.

It would worry me if the percentage of male midwives rose significantly - because I'd worry that a woman wanting or needing female-only care would be less likely to have that request granted.

But I had a room full of men at 2 out of 3 of my births, not midwives, but consultants and paediatricians, and whoever the man who stitched me up was, when I'd have preferred none - so I don't see maternity wards becoming female only any time soon.

The only difference you seem to be saying is you'd prefer to have female only midwives across the board. But you wouldn't be so extreme as to chuck male midwives out since they are there. I dont think you are so wildly apart

Exactly, it's a very similar stance from both zebra and the OP.

Thats what I'm reading Roses to be in favour of too though.

Sorry, do you mean you're reading my interpretation to be the right
one, as Roses definitely isn't in favour of it too lol
(totally referred to myself in the 3rd person there

This framing of a woman stating boundaries over who can provide her with intimate care as sexism is rapey. as. fuck

Nobody's said that about a woman stating boundaries. At all.
What are you actually talking about?

If you want to advocate for women to choose a male midwife, then campaign for it. But I feel there are more pressing issues in maternity care.

Well quite.
this thread has now turned onto the topic of a woman's right to refuse male care and I find it appalling how many people are just dead against it, even going to lengths such as calling women who prefer women: sexist, as well as paranoid, unhealthy, and living in fear.

, even going to lengths such as calling women who prefer women: sexist, as well as paranoid, unhealthy, and living in fear.

Oh FGS, yet again NO-ONE HAS SAID THAT.
AT ALL.

It would worry me if the percentage of male midwives rose significantly - because I'd worry that a woman wanting or needing female-only care would be less likely to have that request granted.

There was a scandal in Japan recently, where it was discovered that for years one of the top medical schools had been changing test scores so that more men than women passed the entrance exams, when the women actually had been outperforming the men.

What if you could find other pretexts for preventing women from entering certain fields. You can just sexistly give men jobs over women on any pretext such as "he was more competent, best man for the job", anything at all really.

That's why we cannot lose our right to request same sex midwives. I would like a woman -only unit where all care would be carried out by women. But as you say this is just a pipe dream.

That's why we cannot lose our right to request same sex midwives.

And no-one's said you should lose that right.

What if
That's a pretty big what if.
I though people frowned on what if's and whataboutery

RosesAndRaindrops

I don’t know, it might be in the settings somewhere but it just kind of happened one day. It’s brilliant though, if I want to get through a long thread but don’t want to miss the ops updates it’s handy.

Women's rights are under threat in other areas. If men start talking about sexism and many more males enter midwifery, so that the choice cannot easily be fulfilled, then - yes, the right to choose female only HCPs could be under threat.

I sincerely hope not, but my eyes have recently been opened to the fact that women's rights can never be taken for granted.

ZebrasAreBras

Have you hit your head recently? I’m going to make this as clear as humanly possibly. I’m going to do you an “Explain it like I’m five” thing.

op wants no men to be allowed to practice for any role that could be needed during a woman giving birth.

Some women don’t mind if a male is all there is and we would like to be able to have someone trained and ready just incase they are needed.

You keep saying there is a choice, well no, there isn’t if you want ZERO males in the roles.

So to all the women that would say “no, I don’t mind if a male examines me.” We won’t be able to do that if there are no men allowed, at all, ever.

Please tell me you understand that?

Not too long ago a man complained of sexism when he was not allowed to enter the waiting room for women having mammogram, because he accompanied a woman. There is a sign on the door politely asking men to wait outside - but he still complained bitterly about the sexism.

No concern for the women who may want the privacy of a women-only space.

op wants no men to be allowed to practice for any role that could be needed during a woman giving birth.

Have you rtft? Have you hit your head as you so pleasantly asked me?

OP has already explained this last night. Want me to quote the post for you?

Please tell me you understand that?

I think it's wilful blindness or something, it's got to be, I mean there's no way of not understanding

Does anyone remember the thread about the wall, and the back and it being in front of a person back and not behind them? That was frustrating, much like this thread when you are explaining something clearly and a few people just don’t get it.

Are you serious Zebra? The op has said that female only hospitals or birthing wards etc is what she wants.. and any man that enters midwifery is a porn watching perv purely because he wants to be a midwife.

OP has already explained this last night. Want me to quote the post for you

You're clearly not reading the thread at all.
Either that or your views are so close to extreme OP that you flat out refuse to see what people are telling you is ON this thread.
Yes, it went a bit more moderate midthread when disagreed with, but read the thread to see it is whap bang right back into the same territory it started off in.
The view clearly never changed at all. It was never about choice.

Yes, I'm serious.

sakura184 Mon 15-Jul-19 18:05:00
@GrammarTeacher
I'm not taking away your choice! I've said a zillion time that women who want men can have them

I would say that saying men can't be midwives (but male consultants are accepted) was sexist!

That kind of attitude from colleagues is rather different and separate from understanding why female patients might want a female HCP.

But y'know. Keep reading what you want to read.

@GrammarTeacher I'm not taking away your choice! I've said a zillion time that women who want men can have them

That was posts ago.
The OP has been right back into extreme land since then.