Birthing mother abused for refusing male nurse

[sakura184]

This kind of crap is why I opted for homebirths

pjmedia.com/parenting/colorado-doula-and-assault-survivor-investigated-by-dhs-for-refusing-male-nurse-during-birth/

@GrammarTeacher

It's totally practical and feasible for more women to enter this profession.

@sakura184 you do a nice line in speaking for everyone don't you? I know of someone (a female HCP as it happens) who refused to share a room with a lesbian (who had no interest in her whatsoever). There are many heterosexual people who are still uncomfortable with the mere existence of homosexual people (or do you not watch the news?).
I have also worked with a male gay teacher who taught in a girls' school due to gossipy people being 'concerned'. It's all rather ridiculous.
I repeat, if you are genuinely that concerned and worried about the people around you and their motives I would seek help. It isn't normal or healthy.

sakura184 you do a nice line in speaking for everyone don't you?

This, I mean WTF.
It's everything that's wrong on here lately.
It's not OK to speak for all women.
Speak for yourself.

@sakura184 not without the necessary qualifications it isn't! You have not mentioned anything about having to improve educational opportunities to achieve your aim. You seem to want to wave a magic wand and have enough women. If it was that easy then the vastly understaffed midwifery service would have done it already.
Although introducing tuition fees for nursing courses instead of bursaries (so a double financial whammy) didn't help anyone who wants to enter the profession.

@ZebrasAreBras there's a difference between believing all things are possible and doing a sensible risk assessment and going on with your life.

there's a difference between believing all things are possible and doing a sensible risk assessment and going on with your life

Exactly

So, we're at the usual stage of "women, what are you frightened of???" now.

So typical. Women are frightened of sexual assault - as it happens rather frequently. Or do you deny that too?

It also happens to be a fact that 98% of the time, the assaulter is male.

So typical. Women are frightened of sexual assault - as it happens rather frequently. Or do you deny that too

No, I don't deny that.
All we're saying though is that you can't just go around completely segregating males and females because you don't feel comfortable about any men. Which is what the OP seems to want.
I'm sorry, but we're saying it's not healthy or any way to live.

@ZebrasAreBras

Thank fuck you've turned up. Thank you

I'm sorry, but we're saying it's not healthy or any way to live

Concern trolling 😂 about my health. Actually statistics show that single women are healthier and happier than women paired in heterosexual relationships. So go figure

I can imagine transwomen concern trolling lesbians "I'm sorry but it's just not a healthy way to live, to exclude peen" 😂

Roses&Raindrops, I've been reading your crap all weekend. Tell victims of assault that "it's not a health way to live" fgs.

"All we're saying though is that you can't just go around completely segregating males and females because you don't feel comfortable about any men"

Yes, we can. If women don't feel comfortable being treated by a man, then they damn well have the right to ask for a woman. And they should not be guilted and shamed for it.

Indeed it isn't. And it doesn't stop the risk anyway. Unless you go through life making sure you are never on your own. That is the risk. Women being anywhere on their own. The sex/gender of the toilet is irrelevant to that. In actual fact, the busier the better. Although when a crowd becomes a press then the enforced close contact is also a risk. I experienced that at a gig. 'Just' an assault. Didn't make me stop going to gigs on my own. Did make me a little more defensive in how I stood.
All of which is irrelevant to the starting point of this thread.
It would be lovely if we could have those choices but we don't have the funds. Use your vote accordingly.
Where would you stand on other protected characteristics though? Would you defend someone who refused to be treated by a practitioner due to their race (this does happen).

Naughty women! Are you excluding those poor, poor men again?

And you can both stop with the whataboutery too.

Women and girls are a protected characteristic - we have suffered oppression and violence since the year dot, due to our sex. We are not going to give up our rights to sex-segregated spaces, or the right to ask for a female medical practitioner without a fight.

Where would you stand on other protected characteristics though?

Are you seriously suggesting being a man is a protected characteristic? When women are the ones needing protection from men and we do so by segregating ourselves from men, for our protection.

Race, sex are protected characteristics for the oppressed people, not the oppressors!
What on earth am I even reading!

So yes, for sure a black woman can request a black midwife if it makes her more comfortable. I mean, obviously

@sakura184, given the power dynamics and imbalance in just about any doctor/patient relationship, maybe the logical conclusion here is to have men treat men, and women treat women. Would you agree? There must be risks to having men specialising in cervical or breast cancer, to name just two areas of risk. Or your podiatrist might have a foot fetish and get off on treating your plantar fasciitis.

Is segregation of medical treatment the ultimate aim?

I refuse to feel bad that my feminism is one of equality. Not one that thinks all men are the enemy and must be excluded from all spaces.
I genuinely feel really sad about seeing how much some of you dislike boys. I spend quite a lot of time countering the view that feminists hate men but it seems some of you do. Hold men (and indeed women) accountable for their actions yes. But not for the actions of others. Expect them to disapprove of it, yes. But they aren't responsible and I will not treat them as if they are. Or inevitably will be. This does not make me a 'bad' feminist. Or a hand maiden. Just someone who disagrees with you.

There is not one feminism.
There is not one right way to do healthcare (although being a good communicator is the closest to it).
There is not one right way to be a teacher.
There is not one right way to be a parent.
Paranoia is not helpful.

Actually If you look at the Law sex is the protected characteristic. It isn't as simple as you suggest. Male Midwives and nursery and primary teachers experience huge amounts of sexism. Often accusations such as you have levelled at them today.
There is no 'obvious' risk from a man performing a smear test. It is a medical test. It would be performed with a chaperone in that case anyway.
But then, when my coil was put in by my female GP that was with a chaperone too as it was an intimate procedure.
So yes, I do think bringing in other protected characteristics is relevant. It is something that occurs a lot in hospitals. Many doctors and nurses experience hideous racism, another reason for the staffing crisis.

I refuse to feel bad that my feminism is one of equality.

Feminism is for equality for women. Not men. They've kind of had all the equality, up until the Women's lib movement. You know, they were the ones we were fighting for liberation from.

So, no, men do not get "equal rights" into women's spaces, or women's protected jobs, like rape crisis counsellor. Men do not have "equal rights" to carry out my smear test.

I really ... and I mean this from the bottom of my heart... I really do not give a shit about #malemidwifeproblems

It wasn't just me who said it. Somebody else said it and I agreed with it, funny how it's just me you home in on though.

Yes, we can. If women don't feel comfortable being treated by a man, then they damn well have the right to ask for a woman

And you are COMPLETELY missing where I have said that of course women should always have the right to be seen by a female if they want. Always.
That's not what the OP said she wants though. She said she wants all males out of the profession completely as they're taking women's jobs and have motives.

@sakura184 I see that. You don't seem to care about men at all to be frank. You all have a very very different concept of equality. You also seem to think you need protected from men. That's not equality. It really isn't. But there we go.
I have no problem with people saying they personally wouldn't want a male HCP doing their smear. I do have a problem with people
saying that all men in certain health care roles have an evil agenda.

Actually If you look at the Law sex is the protected characteristic

Yes! For women!

In short, women are still fighting to get away from men and men are still using laws and rhetoric to fight their way into our spaces, into our bodies and into our birthing rooms. They just cannot take no for an answer .
Ugh just leave us alone and stop using laws created for women to impose yourselves on us in birth

You all have a very very different concept of equality. You also seem to think you need protected from men. That's not equality. It really isn't. But there we go

This all the way
(Note I'm agreeing, it's not me who's saying it. But I completely agree with it._