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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Potential Systemic Safeguarding failures in NSPCC / Childline illustrated by appointment & ending of relationship with Munroe Bergdorf Thread 2

476 replies

R0wantrees · 13/06/2019 13:05

link to previous thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3605120-Munroe-Childline-s-first-LGBT-campaigner

NSPCC statement by CEO Peter Wanless
www.nspcc.org.uk/what-we-do/news-opinion/munroe-bergdorf

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3609218-Hi-from-Safe-Schools-Alliance-UK

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Thread gallery
32
truthisarevolutionaryact · 14/06/2019 21:08

This seems to be giving credence to the belief that the queering of childhood and demolishing of their boundaries is happening in plain sight. No wonder there was such a kick back by so many men (and women) about the NSPCC kink fetish scandal. It is becoming acceptable to publicly display all manner of sexual fetishes and to openly display and instruct children in these.

This is like living in a dystopian novel - except none of those actually target children unlike what's happening here.

NeurotrashWarrior · 14/06/2019 21:13

www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/2019/jun/11/kiss-my-genders-review-hayward-gallery-london

Oh course, 5 stars...

JackyHolyoake · 14/06/2019 21:32

For "kink" read paraphilia

[I disagree with those who say there is a distinction between the two since "kink" always escalates]

Potential Systemic Safeguarding failures in NSPCC / Childline illustrated by appointment & ending of relationship with Munroe Bergdorf Thread 2
Imnobody4 · 14/06/2019 21:33

What rape, erect penis and no trigger warnings!

RedToothBrush · 14/06/2019 21:38

God, image a superwoke primary school trip to this and then the parents finding out what it's about...

... Can we have a journalist report this shite klaxon please?

truthisarevolutionaryact · 14/06/2019 21:39

Are the NSPCC not involved with this? It sounds just up their street.

theOtherPamAyres · 14/06/2019 21:55

the queering of childhood and demolishing of their boundaries is happening in plain sight

Note the reference to Q in the NSPCC's apology to Bergdorf

We’re sorry for the hurt that has been caused by recent events with Munroe Bergdorf. We’re here for every child, including the LGBTQ+ community, who can contact Childline any time.

SophoclesTheFox · 14/06/2019 22:29

That exhibition write up!

Omg.

Ineedacupofteadesperately · 14/06/2019 23:37

Can we have a journalist report this shite klaxon please?

Yes indeed. Come on, the Daily Mail is quite quick to pick up on any wedding dispute threads - perhaps those journalists could do a report on THIS thread.

OrchidInTheSun · 14/06/2019 23:47

Jay Stewart is responsible for the transgender prison guidance that put Karen White into a women's prison

R0wantrees · 15/06/2019 00:03

Jay Stewart is responsible for the transgender prison guidance that put Karen White into a women's prison

Stewart has no background in criminal justice or Safeguarding
just as James Morton who has been instrumental in writing policy affecting vulnerable women in the Scottish Prison estate.

Wasn't Stewart's original degree theatre or film?

"Dr Jay Stewart, MBE
CEO / Co-founder of Gendered Intelligence
Jay has been involved in the trans community since 2002. Since then, he’s been passionate about improving the lives of trans and gender questioning people, especially young people. In 2008, Jay co-founded Gendered Intelligence and have been involved in delivering all aspects of GI’s work at one time or another, including projects such as ‘What makes your gender? Hacking into the Science Museum’ – a £10,000 Heritage Lottery funded project in partnership with the Science Museum, and ‘GI’s Anatomy: a life drawing project for trans and intersex people’ – a £30,000 project funded by the Welcome Trust. In recent years he acted as an independent adviser to the Ministry of Justice review into the care and management of transgender offenders, and gave oral evidence to the Trans Inquiry for the Women’s and Equalities Select Committee. He now sits on the National Transgender Advisory Board for trans prisoners with the Ministry of Justice. He’s very enthusiastic about education and learning; his favourite subject is gender – there’s always more to discover. In 2013 Jay gained his doctorate and has a range of publications in the area of Trans Studies. "
genderedintelligence.co.uk/about-us/the-team

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RedToothBrush · 15/06/2019 00:05

So he knows how to rinse the system for an income? There's words for that.

At the same time as pushing creepy shit?

truthisarevolutionaryact · 15/06/2019 00:09

So Gendered Intelligence - experts in getting male born rapists and paedophiles into women's prisons, including where there are mother and baby units. Now working with the Hayward Art Gallery encouraging primary teachers to bring children to see an exhibition glorifying and displaying sexual fetishes, sexual pain and rape scenes. That's some track record - and I'd put money on it that they've been working with the NSPCC .

R0wantrees · 15/06/2019 00:09

So he knows how to rinse the system for an income? There's words for that.

There are definitel words for those in the MoJ who have given Stewart so much influence.
These words may eventually be used in court when women are able to challenge the failure of duty of care owed to them by the state which led to predatory abusive male prisoners being locked in with vulnerable women.

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BigGreenOlives · 15/06/2019 04:38

Gendered Intelligence ran a course that my son’s HOY went on after which the HOY stopped speaking to me. HOY thought I was cruel to say it was difficult living with him. Why liberal minded middle aged white men think that women don’t know what it is to be a woman & that men do is a mystery to me.

NeurotrashWarrior · 15/06/2019 06:44

I want someone to define "the queer community" because all I'm seeing is kink.

That exhibition is not about gender it's about kink and dressyups.

NeurotrashWarrior · 15/06/2019 07:15

Just has this thought; I wonder if James M covered the Vanessa George cases when he did his safeguarding training?

socialcare.wales/cms_assets/file-uploads/Vanessa-George-Practice-Review-Safeguarding-pack-v.3.pdf

NeurotrashWarrior · 15/06/2019 07:20

My point being she relied on being a nursery worker (must be good) and management and colleagues didn't question things, any thing and many in hindsight remembered times they felt uneasy. Hid in plain sight.

NeurotrashWarrior · 15/06/2019 07:22

To be further clear, you cannot work in roles such as the NSPCC if you don't know what clear boundaries are because it blurs judgments on appropriateness.

Goosefoot · 15/06/2019 07:25

Regarding kink as a safeguarding issue:

I had a few conversations today about this, mostly with gay men, and it really struck me how people dug their heels in over this idea. They connected it directly to the old idea that homosexuals, and especially homosexual men, were unsafe around children because they were willing to cross lines drawn by society around sexual behaviour. Which is to say they either thought it was just outright lies and bigotry, or they thought that the "shaming" in itself created the need for transgression.

THoughts?

WhenIsTheEasyBit · 15/06/2019 07:37

TheOtherPamAyres I was also alarmed by the Q in the NSPCC guff. Followed the links to the Stonewall page and it is Questioning rather than Queer. Relieved... Then start reading about the Hayward Gallery / GI exhibition and wonder whether it's not a convenient coincidence to have a non-threatening 'twin' initial, since clearly elsewhere on Planet WTF, the normalisation project is in full swing.

NeurotrashWarrior · 15/06/2019 07:41

Ah is it?

Re the gay men and kink, there's a lot in the Sheila Jeffrey's book I think I linked up thread; Dr Em did on the unicorn thread.

hoodathunkit · 15/06/2019 08:19

Re Dr Jay Stewart MBE

‘GI’s Anatomy: a life drawing project for trans and intersex people’ – a £30,000 project funded by the Welcome Trust.

I just wanted to share some thoughts about the Welcome Trust, specifically about visiting an exhibition "The Institute of Sexology: Undress Your Mind" at the trust in Euston in 2015

The relevant page on the Welcome Trust's website is here

<a class="break-all" href="https://web.archive.org/save/wellcome.ac.uk/press-release/institute-sexology-be-first-exhibition-expanded-wellcome-collection" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">web.archive.org/save/wellcome.ac.uk/press-release/institute-sexology-be-first-exhibition-expanded-wellcome-collection

I would specifically like to draw the attention of readers to the following:

  1. the word sexology. Also see "sexological" as in "sexological bodywork" The field of sexology and sexual medicine has, rather like psychotherapy, occupied a liminal space between medicine and the human imagination and between science and pseudoscience. In this liminal space is where the trojan horses are usually found in my experience
  1. The exhibition, as one would expect, covered of the work of Masters and Johnson, two early pioneers of sexual medicine whose fascinating research was both groundbreaking and scandalous at the time. Readers should be aware of M&J's pioneering of the use of "sexual surrogates" in sexual medicine and of how the M&J brand and use of surrogates has morphed into something fascinating, especially in relation to neo-tantric sex cults that promote sex work as a form of sexual medicine. More on this later.
  1. The exhibition covered the batshit insane work of Wilhelm Reich in a completely uncritical manner. Reichian and neo-Reichian therapists, who may refer to themselves by various euphemisms, including "sexological bodyworker", promote the idea that repressed memories of trauma are held in the body at a cellular level and can be released via "bodywork" (massage). Genital and anal massage are promoted as empowering by various predators, quacks and charlatans so it was startling to see Reichian theories and beliefs being promoted in an entirely uncritical manner at the Welcome Trust. The exhibition even included an "orgone energy accumulator" - a padded box that visitors could sit inside to generate "orgone" - the invisible orgasmic energy that Reich posited flowed freely through the human body but that was blocked and disrupted by a variety of oppressive experiences ranging from sexual abuse through to anti-sex messages in society.

There is an interesting review of the exhibition by an interesting person in the BMJ here
srh.bmj.com/content/41/2/152.full

The author, Susan Quilliam, who I have mentioned before, has this to say about Reich

"we hear how Wilhelm Reich's belief in the healing power of orgasm caused authorities in the USA to brand him a fraudster, destroy his writings, and imprison him until death. A key theme throughout this exhibition is the emotional and also physical courage of many of the individuals profiled."

Those familiar with Reich will know that contributory factors towards Reich's public humiliation and mental health diagnosis were his belief that repressed sexual energy was the cause of fascism, a belief that sexual energy directed towards clouds could cause rain to fall and a preoccupation with UFOs and aliens. The theories and practices about using genital massage to liberate people from their innate fascism probably didn't help either.

Back to Jay Stewart MBE and GIs anatomy

I have mixed feelings about the life drawing project. Certainly I believe that, as a society we need to be much more sensitive and aware of intersex people and the diversity within the human body and human genitalia that the condition causes.

I do not understand why "trans" is often included in a category with intersex as the two categories are completely different on many levels.

Life drawing classes may provide a less intrusive opportunity to record variety and diversity in the human body than say photography, however nudity can very often be used to groom vulnerable people in the same way that massage and eye gazing can be used. Certainly the neo-tantric sex cults that I am aware of use naturism, naked contact improvisation and life drawing as part of their repertoire of grooming activities.

I also think that there is a prurient interest in society in the bodies of people who are different in various ways, including intersex people.

It may be that these life drawing classes were a wonderful thing and empowering for all concerned. I felt empowered when, with a group of feminist friends back in the 80s, we all used speculums and mirrors to examine our cervixes.

There is sometimes a fine line between exploitation and empowerment and I cannot claim to always know where that line is, however I believe that we should all be sensitive to the fact that a line always exists somewhere and that we should all do our best to avoid and expose the exploitation of the most vulnerable people in society.

R0wantrees · 15/06/2019 08:41

From a parallel thread:

'Another NSPCC Trustee is also chairman of Guardian Media Group, Neil Berkett"

Given The Guardian's appalling coverage & its promotion of a false narrative by Munroe Bergdorf & Owen Jones what influence does this person have on the board?

Its noteworthy that another male Guardian employee was responsible for accusing those concerned by the NSPCC employee's inappropriate behaviour of 'homophobia'
This position has gained considerable traction on Twitter.

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/a3612764-Fake-news-agenda-pushing-in-The-Guardian

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3611328-Owen-Jones-Twitter-feed

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RedToothBrush · 15/06/2019 09:15

Dr Em has done a twitter thread on non contact child sex abuse and the hayward exhibition - referencing the NSPCC guidance on this.

I've posted it on the hayward thread because the hayward stuff is starting to distract from the NSPCC stuff on this although there is a cross over of concerns about kink.

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