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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

Jezebel.com lumps GC feminists in with the alt-right

234 replies

CaptSkippy · 11/05/2019 17:53

Yes, I know that I should not waste my time with a site like Jezebel. I saw this post a few days ago and skipped over it as total nonsense. Today I saw it trending on their front page:

jezebel.com/the-unholy-alliance-of-trans-exclusionary-radical-femin-1834120309

This must be deliberate right?

OP posts:
spagbowlexplosion · 13/05/2019 17:50

Sorry? Are you reading the same thread I am?

The original post was

The same applies to the experience of being a woman, or of being trans. People will have different things to say about what it means[..... ]we can never know These things.

With

of course we can. Being a woman isn’t subjective

spagbowlexplosion · 13/05/2019 17:51

‘someone replied with’ that should say.

littlbrowndog · 13/05/2019 17:52

No spag I don’t know what you are trying to say 🤷‍♀️

spagbowlexplosion · 13/05/2019 17:55

I was replying to ereshkgirl

What are you confused about?

littlbrowndog · 13/05/2019 17:56

What you are saying. It doesn’t make sense.

Who is misogynistic? Or what ?

Ereshkigal · 13/05/2019 17:56

A woman is an adult human female. So no, it isn't subjective.

terryleather · 13/05/2019 18:01

8th Rule of Misogyny:

Women are whatever men say they are and men are whatever men say they are.

I still miss TheBewilderness...

Ereshkigal · 13/05/2019 18:04

I would suggest a good read of the FWR archives where all your questions are dealt with.

Dervel · 13/05/2019 18:10

Really interesting and eloquent posts to be found in this thread so thanks.

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 13/05/2019 18:15

I still miss TheBewilderness...

So do I. I see her on Twitter, but it's not the same. Sad

Goosefoot · 13/05/2019 18:18

Is it because both groups are using material reality as the baseline? Rather than POMO 'reality is whatever you want it to be' nonsense. (I admit, as a scientist, I don't really understand what postmodernism is all about, but that's how it appears to me).

Yes, in the west I think that's a big factor. Religious conservatives aren't materialists, but they do think the physical world is real and substantial and also that it is rational. That's why the scientific method comes out of that perspective, or the medievals came up with the idea that gee, maybe we could apply mathematics to the study of the physical world.

The other overlap that's important is what you might call class analysis over individualism though they might not use that language. Liberal progressives tend to understand the need for legal and social controls in economics, but not really in the social sphere. So, they want something like pornography to be a question for individual freedoms.

Religious conservatives tend to see questions like that as impacting behaviours at a group level, and also impacting what they would call the formation of people's souls. Virtue is in part about good habits, both physical and mental, and people don't have those unless they are brought up to them - they are much harder for adults to acquire. They are also likely to see right thinking and habit in one area as impacting on people's behaviours in other areas. This isn't all that dissimilar to many rad fem ideas.

LangCleg · 13/05/2019 18:20

JAQ
JAQ
JAQ
JAQ
JAQ

BORING.

Ereshkigal · 13/05/2019 18:20

Isn't it.

LangCleg · 13/05/2019 18:21

I still miss TheBewilderness...

Goddess, so do I. She was the best at shutting down crapola. The best.

Goosefoot · 13/05/2019 18:28

I thought the idea that we just don't know was about how identity works.

As far as gender identity, to me it seems the closest comparisons would be to other things that are constructed identity. Race, nationality, etc.

It does seem to be a sort of innate capacity, to create these, maybe it facilitates group coherence in small traditional communities.

spagbowlexplosion · 13/05/2019 18:30

You’ve become a very hostile bunch havent you.
I realise I am not in the click as I don’t just bow down and agree without engaging my mind to ask questions.
I did used to join in and read threads under tens of names over the years, lately it’s turned into simply ‘this transwoman said this’ and things majorly unrelated to woman’s rights and tbh for people that call themselves ‘gender critical’ not a lot of critical thinking so much as bashing these days.
I’d hoped for some healthy discussion, I see that if you do not nod along to the hive you are shown the door though.
I’m sure repeating ‘adult human female’ and not much help will really make a difference though, well done suffragettes.

KarenTheCashRegister · 13/05/2019 18:31

I ok hun?

spagbowlexplosion · 13/05/2019 18:33

I ok thanks, you sound confused though?

Prawnofthepatriarchy · 13/05/2019 18:33

And the spaghetti bowl explodes.

Thereby confirming my suspicions.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 13/05/2019 18:35

all of this 'some parts of our brains' blah blah

why is feminism needed? on what basis are women oppressed Spag?

I would argue it is on the basis of our perceived potential to become pregnant - i.e. our biology

what would your argument be?

Ereshkigal · 13/05/2019 18:36

Who is showing you the door? It might have helped if you'd not adopted such a very condescending tone from the outset for your "healthy discussion".

As I said, there are plenty of threads where you can find answers to your not particularly original questions.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 13/05/2019 18:36

Oh dear cross posted

Datun · 13/05/2019 18:44

There is no discussion on the post you reference spag. Someone said you can't know these things. And, quite evidently, you can.

Women's experience of being who they are, will vary. But the fact that they are a woman, won't.

No one would care, if women weren't oppressed by men. But when men try to tell women that being a woman can be figment of a man's else's imagination, they will, funnily enough, refute that.

Datun · 13/05/2019 18:45

errant 'else' in there, soz.

GammonNosher · 13/05/2019 19:01

Yes! We should be suspicious of subjective things like what women say. And instead focus on what they objectively (after physical verification) are! Bodies are much simpler and less equivocal than minds or identities, which fall all over the map and are too difficult to investigate. Anyone trying to carry out that literally impossible task will just be lying and failing to get their story straight.