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Feminism: Sex and gender discussions

See all MNHQ comments on this thread

Clarification on Women only spaces

377 replies

Magenta82 · 12/04/2019 13:18

Hiya, I've always identified as a feminist, I'm fairly new to Mumsnet and before joining had read about trans rights and had got the impression that any challenges were transphobic and bigoted.

I can see now that, as with most things, the issues are far more nuanced than Twitter would lead us to believe. I can see issues with women's rights, self identification, shutting down debate, etc and am starting to understand other points of view.

I guess for me the complications arise when things get personal. I have some trans friends, both MTF and FTM, who have fully transitioned (as adults over 30), had all the surgery, got certificates the whole thing. What would the general consensus be on access to single sex spaces for them?

My friend may not have grown up as a girl/woman, but has made every effort to become one because she has always felt this way, she may not have faced the same challenges as me growing up, but she has faced other challenges and discrimination. I feel like she absolutely belongs in women only spaces and would hate to think that other people see her as a threat.

OP posts:
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Joisanofthedales · 14/04/2019 19:28

I'm sorry but shaboopy doesn't make any sense to me.
Also there seems to be an assumption that no one on this forum has suffered abuse or been active in working for women.

Datun · 14/04/2019 19:28

Datun, you funny looking fuck, that's as inbred as you.

God, it's too easy.

FloralBunting · 14/04/2019 19:29

Good Lord. I know it's Sunday and the mods are probably having a kip, but this visitor appears to be reaching their crisis, and it's all rather unseemly.

Quietlife333 · 14/04/2019 19:30

I don’t believe people can change sex. No matter what we add to our bodies or take away. We may imitate but not actually become. I think private spaces should be defined by sex, so changing rooms for eg. History has taught us that we need these spaces to be separated on the basis of sex no matter what the sexual preference or look of a person may be. I don’t believe in this idea of gender- it means nothing to me or any woman I know. I do think all people should feel comfortable and safe- and I think that if trans people feel at risk using their birth sex changing rooms or loo’s Etc it would be a good idea to create a third or fourth space.

RedDogsBeg · 14/04/2019 19:30

do your own research,

No, the onus is on you to back up what you are saying.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 14/04/2019 19:31

I'm not convinced that shaboopy makes sense to shaboopyself

i think shaboopy thinks women owe shaboopy something (although what and why is not clear), and shaboopy is very angry that women are being tardy about offering it up

CuriousaboutSamphire · 14/04/2019 19:31

Are we counting yet?

Datun · 14/04/2019 19:32

HQ, once you've shown this kid the door please leave the thread. It had some interesting points prior to the daft interruption.

BernardBlacksWineIcelolly · 14/04/2019 19:32

this visitor appears to be reaching their crisis

yep, I had felt bad about goading this person a little, but their post at 19:27 has made me feel just fine

FloralBunting · 14/04/2019 19:32

I think it's fairly transparent now that there is no actual argument here - but I do love how my fellow FWR dwellers are doggedly replying to this total wall of nonsense with patient sense.

If you're still bothering to read, dear lurkers, they do that for you.

JackyHolyoake · 14/04/2019 19:33

there's not enough Kleenex in the world

That'll be Man-Size, of course! Grin

Shaboopy · 14/04/2019 19:34

JackyHolyoake

Absolutely not

Do you think that the political agenda you have chosen has lead you to think that menoweyou something? That they should be indebted to you for the choices you have made? Given new laws on coercion shouldn't more women be prosecuted for DV?

RedDogsBeg · 14/04/2019 19:34

I could win a toaster here! Bernard how many points do I need for an apron? I really need one I just can't make my muffins without wearing one.

JackyHolyoake · 14/04/2019 19:35

I've just realised why this bloke isn't using apostrophes when needed .. he's typing with one hand!

Datun · 14/04/2019 19:36

Revealing though, isn't it, that what made the MRA fling his mask on the floor, was pointing out how women are oppressed. Exactly how.

That did it.

Shaboopy · 14/04/2019 19:36

This reply has been deleted

Message deleted by MNHQ. Here's a link to our Talk Guidelines.

CuriousaboutSamphire · 14/04/2019 19:36

Jacky!!!?! Lower the tone why don't you?

LangCleg · 14/04/2019 19:38

As I always say: Kleenex will never go out of business.

The only thing left on my bingo card is "no wonder only 7% of women say they are feminists".

Please, Shapoopypoos - do that one for me so I can go and read my book. Be a good chap.

Datun · 14/04/2019 19:39

he's typing with one hand!

Maybe he's not typing ... with his hand!!!'

LilyMumsnet · 14/04/2019 19:39

Hi folks,

Just a reminder - if you spot a troll on the boards, or someone posting without the best of intentions, let us know! That's what we're here for. Just hit the report button!

CuriousaboutSamphire · 14/04/2019 19:39

What anecdotes? Where?

Or is that another word you have an alternative definition for?

Nobody has told a personal tale... SHOW ME THE ANECDOTE Smile

Datun · 14/04/2019 19:40

That they should be indebted to you for the choices you have made?

Haha! Why won't women have sex with me???

CassandraCross · 14/04/2019 19:40

Revealing though, isn't it, that what made the MRA fling his mask on the floor, was pointing out how women are oppressed. Exactly how.

That did it.

Didn't it just Datun and the response was that these are choices women have made.

CuriousaboutSamphire · 14/04/2019 19:40

Sorry Lily.

Personally I was having too much fun to check in with my serious side. Blush

JackyHolyoake · 14/04/2019 19:40

Do you think that the political agenda you have chosen has lead you to think that men owe you something? That they should be indebted to you for the choices you have made? Given new laws on coercion shouldn't more women be prosecuted for DV?

Firstly, may I recommend that you type using both hands.

No .. males owe me nothing. We women are used to having to fight to uphold our human dignity, our safety, our wellbeing and our privacy in the face of patriarchy.

We women have no expectation that males are capable of giving since they are conditioned from a very young age to take from the world around them. That is what patriarchy is about. The world and everything in it is there for males to take.

And, the law in UK about coercive control is designed to deter the taking by males of the safety, wellbeing, safety and privacy of females.