The NSPCC aren't right about this are they?

[Macareaux]

Oh wise and knowledgeable women of Mumsnet I don't think the EA2010 does this at all does it? I'm not 100% certain so don't want to wade in.

This goes way too deep. Its unsettling and I wodner quite how long the behind the scenes grooming has gone on, before NSPCC, fawcett society, girl guides..and so on capitulated. It has got to be years, surely.

See important thread which provdes evidence of the history of transactivism:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3463920-Lets-go-back-to-2007

I got a response to my email:

We are sorry to hear about your concerns surrounding our response to the question presented to us on Twitter, regarding Unisex toilets and changing rooms.

To clarify, in designing toilet and changing facilities, schools need to give due regard to the safety of all pupils. Over the age of 8, schools must provide separated facilities for boys and girls. But they can also provide unisex facilities for individual use provided they can be locked from the inside and are safe.

The Equality Act requires schools to make sure they do not discriminate against students on the basis of gender recognition, both directly or indirectly, including in the provision of toilet and changing facilities. However, decisions about how this is done should be taken on a case by case basis, in line with schools safeguarding policies, with a proper risk assessment to minimise the risks to all children involved.

I would like to apologise that this mistake and our stance on this topic has caused you to cancel your support.

Again, sorry for any offense that this mistake has caused and thank you for the time you have taken to make contact with us.

I'm mulling over my response.

They conceded they made a mistake?

[grabs smelling salts]

I would want to know why they only concede a mistake was made in your email, and are not tweeting they made a mistake. Own the mistake: why don’t they? Why are they so afraid to put this on Twitter? We know why...

The Equality Act requires schools to make sure they do not discriminate against students on the basis of gender recognition, both directly or indirectly, including in the provision of toilet and changing facilities.

They've admitted one mistake (astonished they even did that), but they're still making them. 'Gender recognition' isn't mentioned in the equality act - the protected characteristic is 'gender reassignment'. So someone can't be discriminated against (treated less fairly) because of this PC. So a boy who thinks he's a girl shouldn't be treated less fairly than any other boy. They don't have to make everything mixed sex, simply have one or two cubicles available for such children. Just as they have a few disabled facilities. Although I don't understand why a 'boy who feels like a girl' should be treated any differently from any other boy - he still has a boy's body no matter what is going on in his head, which is the important thing when it comes to toilets and changing rooms.

I still can't get my head round why so many people seem to think that 'feelings' are more important than the physical reality of people's bodies. Single sex facilities are there because girls' bodies are different from boys' bodies, not because girls' brains are different from boys' brains.

I'm mulling over my response.

Many people of Twitter asked the NSPCC account to clarify their definition of 'boy' & 'girl'
I dont think they did
Which is of coourse very relevent
Because sex

The Equality Act requires schools to make sure they do not discriminate against students on the basis of gender recognition

No it doesn't.

Those were two of the points I was thinking of making, may well nick your excellent phrasing.

Also where they got their bullshit legal advice from...

But they can also provide unisex facilities for individual use provided they can be locked from the inside and are safe.

There are more requirements than simply a lock when toilets /changing spaces are mixed sex.

There is also emerging evidence that such spaces disadvantage girls & women's safety dignity & privacy.

Single sex facilities are there because girls' bodies are different from boys' bodies, not because girls' brains are different from boys' brains.

Put that on a bloody t-shirt.

Although I don't understand why a 'boy who feels like a girl' should be treated any differently from any other boy - he still has a boy's body no matter what is going on in his head, which is the important thing when it comes to toilets and changing rooms.

The Gender Recognition Act is explicit here ... no-one under 18 years can apply for a GRC to enable change of the reference to sex on a Birth Certificate. Thus, no pupils in school can ever be treated as anything other than the sex that is recorded on their original Birth Certificate.

Beyond that, the law that is the The School Premises (England) Regulations 2012 requires strict sex-segregated communal toilet and washing facilities for all pupils aged 8 years and over. Mixed sex toilet and washing facilities can be provided but only as an isolated, self-contained room with a door that is lockable from the inside.

The Equality Act 2010 requires that females be afforded all the necessary protections it contains via the Exceptions in Schedule 3 and Schedule 23.

Note also that Schedule 11 Schools: Exceptions makes absolutely no reference to the protected characteristic of gender reassignment.

In short, there is nothing in any relevant law that applies in any way to the protected characteristic of "gender reassignment" for pupils in schools.

Further, the terms "gender identity", "transgender", "non-binary" are not written in any law and have no legal meaning whatsoever.

Our schools have been grossly misled.

Last three posts win the thread and internet for me today.

NB

The Equality Act requires schools to make sure they do not discriminate against students on the basis of gender recognition

This is what's written in the No Outsiders pack and posters created by the author. It specifically uses the terms gender identity instead of gender reassignment.

I'm guessing the author used other sources when he was researching the book as it was initially an idea to tackle homophobia and he then developed it into the EA; I'm hazarding a guess as to who. Stonewall? Or other source.

I don't believe he's done it deliberately nor realises the ramifications of the woolly language.

Anyone know about the No Outsiders in Our Schools book/ pack? www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3385878-anyone-know-about-the-no-outsiders-in-our-schools-book-pack

Just for reference; poster he uses in his school and is in book included.

I'm attending school safeguarding training soon; I'm looking forward to clarifying some things from that POV.

The Equality Act requires schools to make sure they do not discriminate against students on the basis of gender recognition

This is what's written in the No Outsiders pack and posters created by the author. It specifically uses the terms gender identity instead of gender reassignment.

If you look at the two 'No Outsiders' books by Mr Moffat on Amazon there is limited access but its clear that he quotes the Eq Act correctly re the 9 protected characteristics and within a paragraph or two conflates/replaces sex with gender etc

I spent a little time looking at the resources (many are very good) there is a noticeable absence of focus on sex/sexism

I'm attending school safeguarding training soon; I'm looking forward to clarifying some things from that POV.

May I recommend that you take the PDF version of the Equality Act 2010 with you, having highlighted the relevant sections of the Act to disprove the information related to No Outsiders.

www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/pdfs/ukpga_20100015_en.pdf

You may also want to print this letter and take it with you:

forwomen.scot/30/03/2019/tie-letter-legal-response/

I really am puzzled as to how all this has happened in a primary school? According to the BBC, Mr Moffatt resigned from his previous school after a row with some Christian parents over "teaching challenging homophobia". So it appears that this isn't the first school where he has fallen out with parents over this?

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-47158357

Mr Moffat’s job as a Headteacher is to work WITH parents. I don’t think Mr Moffat is particularly good at his job.

I agree R0 this is difficult as access is understandably limited. When I looked I was able to read the introduction. I also fully agree I like a lot of the pack I've been able to see, but it lacks in topics on sex and sexism.

I'm glad you read that he correctly quoted the EA as is isn't correctly quoted in the introduction.

He writes (explaining how his series of teaching about LGB evolved further):

"No longer should we separate LGBT education from education about other equalities; equality is best taught in the context of British Law, where all protected characteristics of the Equality Act 2010 are included in a curriculum that celebrates difference. So not only are people of different sexual orientations welcome in our primary school, people of different ethnicities, genders, gender identities, religions, ages and abilities are also most welcome."

(Then quotes Desmond Tutu where the no outsiders boy comes from.)

There is then an image of the posters used (as linked in that thread, I'll try to add here) where 'gender, gender identity and sexual orientation' is specifically used. These were around the school and outside the school. This is the language used.

In the introduction it says that in his school they asked that visitors signed in agreeing to uphold the EA, "please read and accept the visitor agreement before signing in" but it lists: "gender, transgender identity, sexual orientation" among the others, including pregnancy.

Where there's woolly language, there's woolly boundaries. We've seen it again and again.

Unfortunately the terms gender identities have evolved from queer theory to reality and conflated with sex. He clearly hasn't included any clarification that sex is different to gender as he placed these terms on posters for the children.

It may simply not have been thought through in a way this board has nor the potential impact of teaching children you have a gender identity.

I'm a teacher and believe me in schools we are absolutely certain we are clear about what we write on posters and displays is correct, even in some situations specific fonts etc. for accessibility and clarity of understanding for the children.

I have copied the quotes directly from screen shots of the access I could get on google books. I have the screen shots but wasn't certain if I could post them here.

Thanks jacky will do.

Radio 4’s Profile on Saturday evening was about Moffat if anyone’s interested in some background.

Equality Act 2010:

Part 6 Chapter 1: Schools:

Application of this Chapter
This Chapter does not apply to the following protected characteristics—
(a) age;
(b) marriage and civil partnership.

Section 10: In the application of section 26 [Harassment] for the purposes of subsection (3), none of the following is a relevant protected characteristic -

(a) gender reassignment;
(b) religion or belief;
(c) sexual orientation.

[The above three PCs are not biological / physical in the way that disability, race and sex are.]

Section 26, Harassment www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2010/15/section/26

sub section 3: A also harasses B if—

(a) A or another person engages in unwanted conduct of a sexual nature or that is related to gender reassignment or sex,
(b) the conduct has the purpose or effect referred to in subsection (1)(b), and
(c) because of B's rejection of or submission to the conduct, A treats B less favourably than A would treat B if B had not rejected or submitted to the conduct.

So, this seems to mean that, within the school environment, the legal position on harassment relates exclusively to disability, race and sex as the protected characteristics because of their biological / physical nature.

This all begs the question: what on earth is Stonewall, Allsorts, Gendered Intelligence et al up to in our schools?

And, just maybe, we need to examine closely the curriculum and all its associated resources for sex and relationship education?

• no outsiders bit comes from

My grammar is crap in that post; I'm multitasking.