TRAs try to ruin Mumsnet survey

[2019StandingforWomen]

Just seen this one Twitter:

Transactivists are sharing a survey from @MumsnetTowers
(asking for feedback on their message boards), they're encouraging people to identify as users & complain about feminist chat. Mumsnet boards are important to so many women so please show your support

What survey is this does anyone know?

I saw the survey thread last week, but was busy so couldn’t complete it. I’ve been on every day since and I’ve not seen the thread again, and this board has hardly been busy in that time.

I won’t share my thoughts here because I’ll probably be deleted, but let’s say, judging by how the survey has been conducted, that I have my own ideas about what’s going on. I very much hope that I’m wrong. If I’m right however, I personally won’t be visiting Mumsnet again, and I doubt very much I’ll be the only one.

I can only echo Langcleg in directing @MNHQ to their own video entitled ‘Walking On Eggshells.’

The parallels with coercive control patterns are striking.

^ indeed

I have my own thoughts about what’s going on too, maybe we can expect an announcement soon....

One of those Tweets -'get rid of the TERFs there and the Trans threads could be great'
That's your warning MNHQ - they want to silence and then they want to take over your parenting site.

The parallels with coercive control patterns are striking.
thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/womens_rights/3452784-Coercive-Control-a-need-for-better-awareness

Last May MNHQ were encouraging reports from TRA non-members via Twitter:

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/site_stuff/3238536-Mumsnet-encouraging-brigading-by-Twitter-TRAs

It would be exceedingly difficult to watch Justine do a reverse ferret on her magnificent stand in the Times last year.

www.thetimes.co.uk/article/mumsnet-founder-justine-roberts-transgender-activists-try-to-curb-free-speech-on-site-z3sr3nf6q

Mumsnet would be dead to me if they close either FWR or discussion on the impact of transactivism on women's rights & children.

-'get rid of the TERFs there and the Trans threads could be great'

From MN FWR additional rules:

"We do not want Mumsnet to be a place that feels inherently hostile to any group, be that trans people, gender-critical feminists or anyone else (except perhaps trolls). If you can abide by our rules – the spirit and not just the letter – we want you to feel you can be a part of the community."

I don't think anyone's trying to silence trans threads, there is sometimes good discussion and debate going on.
Some (I said some not all ) isn't acceptable though and it's not to do with "silencing"

It would be exceedingly difficult to watch Justine do a reverse ferret on her magnificent stand in the Times last year.

AIBU thread response:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3222471-AIBU-to-be-extremely-proud-of-Justine-Roberts-Mumsnet-right-now

There’s a lot worse on AIBU, inc racism and also ableism all over MN and I report it with nothing done. Why the focus on one small groups hurty feels?

Exactly, R0wan.

And yy to this Mumsnet would be dead to me if they close either FWR or discussion on the impact of transactivism on women's rights & children

Some (I said some not all ) isn't acceptable though and it's not to do with "silencing"

In your opinion?

Last May MNHQ were encouraging reports from TRA non-members via Twitter:

They did. They don't seem to anymore though - TRAs that spam the Mumsnet twitter timeline now are largely ignored.

But I'm very aware of the sort of pressure that must be going on behind the scenes.

Here's a twitter thread that is very relevant here:

twitter.com/joaniwalshi/status/1110261637301309449

Why the focus on one small groups hurty feels?

Because that group has corporate, political and institutional capture and is not a movement seeking rights for anyone who is actually oppressed.

-'get rid of the TERFs there and the Trans threads could be great'

So why isn't MN being asked for a TR chat board?

I wonder if many regular posters or lurkers from this chat board would invest so much time reporting, disrupting and attempting to control it?

I don't think anyone's trying to silence trans threads, there is sometimes good discussion and debate going on.

I agree. Whatever one's personal viewpoint on the debate, the fact is that this site openly and willingly hosts content that other forums / social media channels would delete for being transphobic hate speech. Of course, whether that's a good thing or not is a matter of opinion, and people will always make those opinions clear. But MNHQ haven't shown any indication that they're planning to change their policy.

Mumsnet would be dead to me if they close either FWR or discussion on the impact of transactivism on women's rights & children

Yep, I only really spend time on the Brexit and FWR threads these days. I like the political analysis which happens in both sections. I’d have no interest in a ‘Mumsnet-Lite’ site.

Joani's thread is scarily true.

What an unsavoury bunch of characters shared the mumnets survey tweet. Shudder

I did the survey last week. Hopefully it'll be obvious from the influx of NASTY MEAN TRANSPHOBE responses which ones are actually real.

After John McConnell's webchat here (last September) Suzanne Moore wrote:

Mumsnet scrutinise politicians more than any one else I have ever seen. They actually want answers. Its really impressive.

I agree with her - it is really impressive. Of course, sometimes politician's - and the NSPCC, and maybe Gok Wan ( )are left uncomfortable by the level of scrutiny - but never underestimate the Mumsnetter's ability to ask tough questions.

If politicians and high profile charities can't answer those questions - they need to ask themselves why.

It’s worth @MNHQ being mindful of the fact that issues of freedom of speech related to Transgenderism have really started to hit the mainstream media, and the general public are not happy that their right to free speech is being curtailed on this subject. If there’s one issue which will get the public up in arms it’s shutting down their/our right to freedom of expression. If MNHQ contrive a justification to close FWR down, and more widely to curtail its users discussion of matters that directly affect them and their childrens’ rights, I imagine the optics will not be too favourable.

Evoking history and who will be on the right or wrong side of it requires some careful thought and a bit of moral backbone. I think we can all see where this is headed.

Sadly Mumsnet is a commercial enterprise, I doubt they give much of a fuck about being on the "right side of history", they just want to pay their staff and costs and keep going.

If deleting the feminism boards means prospering, they ultimately will, don't you think?

After John McConnell's webchat here (last September) Suzanne Moore wrote:

Mumsnet scrutinise politicians more than any one else I have ever seen. They actually want answers. Its really impressive.

Independent article today, by Maya Forstater
'Has Penny Mordaunt got away with the worst Mumsnet performance ever?
Questions that Mordaunt didn’t answer started with the basics: what is a woman, can humans change sex, and in what circumstances is it necessary to distinguish between males and females?'
concludes:

"Female voters seeking straight answers to serious questions feel cynical and abandoned by elected representatives who won't listen or answer."

www.independent.co.uk/voices/penny-mourdant-mumsnet-gender-recognition-act-a8835621.html

Even if MN did close FWR it would just mean we had to post in chat instead. Unless they close the site altogether how are they going to police every area of it. We are allowed to discuss whatever we want as long as it stays within guidelines.

Trans issues and Brexit are symptoms of something wider happening in politics and public accountability which isn't healthy in terms of debate.

They are both about trying to shut down conversation and shut out people who question things or hold those with power to account.

MN is crucial to women because they are particularly shut out of those conversations by circumstance, by economics and by good old fashioned sexism.